Indus Valley Civ people diet dominated by beef and other meat, finds study

[fitpOsitive]

Indus Valley civilization diet had dominance of meat, finds study

A new study has found that the diet of people from the Indus Valley civilisation was dominated by meat.

www.indiatoday.in

Even Niraj Rai and Vasant Shinde, government sponsored Hindutva so-called 'researchers', agree!

So what do we have here.. IVC people buried their dead in graves and ate beef.. sounds very Hindu!

Ancient guys were eating everything. Even Arabs ate lizards. Even hindus were eating meat.
Its only later when some guys invented Buddhism, then came this vegetarism.

 

[Naofumi]

1. The Aryans migrated into South Asia not before 1000 BC.

Cite some source please.
Firstly, It was not a one-time migration but a gradual diffusion starting in 2000 BCE.

The Indo-Aryan migrations started in approximately 2000 BCE,[10] after the invention of the war chariot, and also brought Indo-Aryan languages into the Levant and possibly Inner Asia. It was part of the diffusion of Indo-European languages from the proto-Indo-European homeland at the Pontic–Caspian steppe, a large area of grasslands in far Eastern Europe, which started in the 5th to 4th millennia BCE, and the Indo-European migrations out of the Eurasian Steppes, which started approximately in 2000 BCE.[11][1]

Indo-Aryan migrations - Wikipedia

2. There was a question in last week's Kaun Banega Crorepati. It was about a village ( or maybe it was region ) in Himachal which was said to have one of the world's oldest democracies and the question was which king's descendants do these people claim to be. The answer, which I had guessed correctly, was Alexander the Great. And what was this democracy ? It was most certainly brought by the Greeks. The idea called Demokratia - direct democracy though flawed in its version but a milestone nonetheless. So Hindus had lot of influences from non-Hindu cultures and this I would say would be in astronomy ( and astrology ), artistic expression, mathematics, probably medicine and probably clothing too ( like the sari ).

Dude, don't cite a reality show as a serious source in a (supposedly?) academic discussion. And Hindus may have a lot of influences nonetheless but what's your point?

3. About the Mahabharata, some days ago the Pakistani member @firohot4321 said that this epic was a derivation of the Greek epic Iliad.

Cite some academic source not some PDF member.

 

[Novus ordu seclorum]

Similar symbols (NOT same) can be found among many other non IE cultures, that doesn't prove any "Global Aryan community" or even the attestation word Aryan for which @Novus ordu seclorum cited Swastika.
View attachment 785842
Ethiopia
View attachment 785843
Ashanti (modern Ghana region in Africa). Surely, we won't call Ethiopians and Ghanians as Aryans now.
Secondly, This still proves little that modern Swastika was a cultural continuity of the above symbol.

• It differs a lot from the modern symbol.
• It doesn't ascribe "Swastika" name to it which is decidedly of Sanskrit origin.
• The level of social/cultural significance is undecided. It may have been one of the plethora of other symbols.

Swastika was also found in ancient Mesopotamia. You are forgetting Aryan and R1a migrations. There is even genetic evidence of R1a migration into India 12,000 years ago. The oldest Swastika symbol was found in Ukraine from 12,000 years ago. Aryan identity came later but the two are interlinked. 4500 years ago there were waves of Aryan migration from Southern Russian Ural plains to Europe, Middle East, and India carrying Aryan identity and symbol.

 

[Aryzin]

Aryan doesn't mean Noble in Europe, you have an acquired or acculturated meaning of Noble attached to Aryan. Arya "One who doesn't hide his hands" versus Sharif which literally means Noble. Deva in Sanskrit means Noble. Aryans appropriated the meaning.

You are talking about neo Nazi folk but that idea is long gone. You are talking about white supremacists. The Nazi talked about Aryan race but nowadays that is gone and replaced by “white”.

Not doubting Sumerian root word for lion is Ur. There is also the city or state of Ur. Affix 'Du' in Sumerian which means 'going away (from)' [Reference: Cambridge Encyclopedia of the World's Ancient Languages, Edited by Roger D. Woodard]. So, Urdu literally means 'going away (from) Ur'.

Sumerian word Sher means to shine brightly [in character]. We know Sheriff in English and Sharif in Arabic and other languages associate the meaning with Noble. We have Quran Sharif, Kaaba Sharif, Ibrahim Sharif, Darood Sharif, the Prophetic lineage is Sharif. Prophet Ibrahim was born in Ur.

Urdu is Ordu in Persian and if I’m not mistaken it’s a Turkic word originally which means camp or some type of military formation. But I could be wrong.

 

[Novus ordu seclorum]

You are talking about neo Nazi folk but that idea is long gone. You are talking about white supremacists. The Nazi talked about Aryan race but nowadays that is gone and replaced by “white”.

Urdu is Ordu in Persian and if I’m not mistaken it’s a Turkic word originally which means camp or some type of military formation. But I could be wrong.

Well, Sumerian 'Sher' acquired the meaning of Lion. Similarly, Sumerian 'Urdu' acquired the meaning of Camp, Order, or Formation. Both are originally Sumerian words. And I am not talking of Neo Nazis. Aryan has ancient racial meaning in Europe which does not mean Noble. Aryan must have acquired that meaning in Iran and India through association or attachment [acculturation].

 

[Naofumi]

buried their dead

1. The funerary practices of the Harappan civilisation are marked by fractional burial (in which the body is reduced to skeletal remains by exposure to the elements before final interment), and even cremation.
2. In the aftermath of the Indus Civilisation's localisation, regional cultures emerged, to varying degrees showing the influence of the Indus Civilisation. In the formerly great city of Harappa, burials have been found that correspond to a regional culture called the Cemetery H culture. At the same time, the Ochre Coloured Pottery culture expanded from Rajasthan into the Gangetic Plain. The Cemetery H culture has the earliest evidence for cremation; a practice dominant in Hinduism today.
3. The Cemetery H culture was a Bronze Age culture in the Punjab region in the northern part of the Indian subcontinent, from about 1900 BC until about 1300 BC. It is regarded as a regional form of the late phase of the Harappan (Indus Valley) civilisation (alongside the Jhukar culture of Sindh and Rangpur culture of Gujarat), but also as the manifestation of a first wave of Indo-Aryan migrations, predating the migrations of the proto-Rig Vedic people.

Indus Valley Civilisation - Wikipedia
Cemetery H culture - Wikipedia
The Ancient Indus Valley: New Perspectives - Jane McIntosh - Google Books
The Indus Civilization: A Contemporary Perspective - Gregory L. Possehl - Google Books
Burials in different Harappan sites. (A) and (B) Burials at Mehrgarh... | Download Scientific Diagram (researchgate.net)

Aryan identity came later but the two are interlinked.

Yes, it came later. End of. By the way, even IVC has remains of Swastika type symbols.
IndusValleySeals_swastikas.JPG (411×237) (wikimedia.org)

 

[Novus ordu seclorum]

Yes, it came later. End of. By the way, even IVC has remains of Swastika type symbols.
IndusValleySeals_swastikas.JPG (411×237) (wikimedia.org)

End of what? What point you made. The point is Swastika symbol is originally associated with Eurasia [Ukraine]. It has an origin. We cannot say it originated all over the world.

 

[Paitoo]

Slightly off topic....

We have little moral right to talk about cow protection as long as we continue consuming copious amounts of dairy products, doing havans with ghee, distributing unnecessarily large amounts of sweets on festivals and weddings, and pouring kilolitres of milk on giant statues. Where does all the milk come from? What happens to cows when they stop producing milk? Do we take them inside our homes and care for them for the rest of their lives? How many goshalas exist in India? Are they enough to accommodate all the discarded cows? Faaar from it. Cows are roaming around the streets eating plastic and falling sick and getting gangrene on their legs.

Do a calculation of how much milk we consume in our lifetime and how many cows are required for that amount of milk. I am not even including concentrated dairy products like ghee, paneer, butter, icecream etc, which will shoot up the per capita dairy consumption. We are not milking random cows who accidentally emerged from the forest. Cows are being reared specifically for our need. Its a whole industry. If you are bothered about cows, stop consuming dairy. Na rahega baans, na bajegi bansuri. Till that time there is no point vilifying people who are essentially 'cleaning up your mess'.

And what is wrong with buffalos? Why are they not protected from slaughter? Why are we the largest exporter of buffalo meat in the world? Black lives matter or not?

 

[Naofumi]

They had no king , no religious personality and no sign of singular govt , they had a very different form of govt and that without any standing military

http://dx.doi.org/10.13140/RG.2.1.3529.1124

By looking at and comparing two different sections of the VS Area of Mohenjo-Daro (Section A, Block 1 and Section B, Block 2) we are able to provide a relatively accurate analysis of the social stratification within the Harappan Civilisation, specifically using access analysis at the archaeological site of Mohenjo-Daro. It has been found that through the application of access analysis on a small sample group that there are indicators that through the structure size, layout and number of rooms that this society was socially stratified. As stated before, it has often been difficult to determine whether or not this particular society is socially stratified within the archaeological record due to the lack of decipherable written records and also the lack of differentiation between structures and building within the citadels. This undergraduate dissertation was formulated in the hopes that there is a stronger indicator of social stratification within this civilisation. From this analysis, there appears to be a difference between the structure types, the number of rooms and the accessibility of the rooms that can indicate social stratification within a civilisation. As stated within the discussion section, there are several House that was analysed using access analysis that suggested that higher ranking members of the community lived there due to the number of rooms and also the fact that several of the rooms appeared to be very remote and could only be accessed by going through a series of other rooms. Compared to several other Houses that were relatively uniformed in shape and size along with number of rooms. These houses could then be seen as houses that belong to the ‘working class citizen’ as by having a standardised size and shape of house would make it easier to firstly build and secondly indicate to others where this particular person or group of people fitted in within the society.

Therefore, to conclude, there is an indicator that there is social stratification within the Harappan Civilisation, using specific examples from Mohenjo-Daro. Of course this theory and conclusion would be strengthened through more analysis of the site and also comparing larger and different areas of Mohenjo-Daro. One definitive way to determine social stratification within the Harappan Civilisation is to apply access analysis to the entire site and excavation plan of Mohenjo-Daro, along with the other citadels of the Harappan Civilisation (Harappa, Melhua, Kot-Diji). But for now it is a safe conclusion to say that from the sample group that had access analysis applied to them, there is an indication of social stratification. This can now lead to further analysis of the Harappan Civilisation and hopefully a better understanding of how members of the society of Mohenjo-Daro lived and related to one another.

Violence, infectious disease and climate change contributed to Indus civilization collapse -- ScienceDaily

The results of the study are striking, according to Robbins Schug, because violence and disease increased through time, with the highest rates found as the human population was abandoning the cities. However, an even more interesting result is that individuals who were excluded from the city's formal cemeteries had the highest rates of violence and disease. In a small ossuary southeast of the city, men, women, and children were interred in a small pit. The rate of violence in this sample was 50 percent for the 10 crania preserved, and more than 20 percent of these individuals demonstrated evidence of infection with leprosy.

There was social stratification in IVC as recognized in house sizes and cranial injuries of remains. There's evidence of different living quarters for certain occupations. There must have been some central authority to standardize such urban planning and trade measurements.

What point you made

Aryan identity came later exclusively to Indo-Iranians, they probably picked it just before the split and there was not an awareness of "Global Aryan community" at any point of time.

It has an origin. We cannot say it originated all over the world.

But we can not tell whether later Indo-Aryans picked it from IVC or IE. There can be multiple independent origins.

Do a calculation of how much milk we consume in our lifetime and how many cows are required for that amount of milk. I am not even including concentrated dairy products like ghee, paneer, butter, icecream etc, which will shoot up the per capital dairy consumption. We are not milking random cows who accidentally emerged from the forest. Cows are being reared specifically for our need. Its a whole industry. If you are bothered about cows, stop consuming dairy. Na rahega baans, na bajegi bansuri. Till that time there is no point vilifying people who are essentially 'cleaning up your mess'.

Correct and economically, eating older mon-milkable cows (and bulls) is better than letting them die.
How India is killing the country’s largest economy of the poor (downtoearth.org.in)

 

[Novus ordu seclorum]

http://dx.doi.org/10.13140/RG.2.1.3529.1124


Violence, infectious disease and climate change contributed to Indus civilization collapse -- ScienceDaily


There was social stratification in IVC as recognized in house sizes and cranial injuries of remains. There's evidence of different living quarters for certain occupations. There must have been some central authority to standardize such urban planning and trade measurements.

Aryan identity came later exclusively to Indo-Iranians, they probably picked it just before the split and there was not an awareness of "Global Aryan community" at any point of time.

But we can not tell whether later Indo-Aryans picked it from IVC or IE. There can be multiple independent origins.

Correct and economically, eating older mon-milkable cows (and bulls) is better than letting them die.
How India is killing the country’s largest economy of the poor (downtoearth.org.in)

Not multiple independent origins. Why are you ignoring the 12,000 year old Ukrainian swastika symbol. Aryan identity came from Sintashta culture which was part of the larger Andronovo culture. Sintashta Wikipedia: "It is widely regarded as the origin of the Indo-Iranian languages.[9][10]"

 

[Chhatrapati]

There reversed roles of devas and asuras notwithstanding it is certain that original Hinduism originated in Iranic lands and then the Hindus probably had some cultural tussle with other Iranics and then migrated into South Asia around 1000 BC and who knows what they did to the IVC ( if it was still existent then ). The Hindus probably then adapted their religion to local environment.

I like how these people desperately look for something to discredit it. There is a small problem in your theory, the rivers and geography in RigVeda disagree with the Iranian origins. There is no records of any conflicts between Zoroastrians we are talking about nearly 4000 yrs old history. IVC ended around that time based on evidences.

 

[Novus ordu seclorum]

In Europe, Aryan has nothing to do with the meaning of Noble. It has racial or genetic meaning.
Dictionary.com: Aryan. Noun. Ethnology. A member or descendant of the prehistoric people who spoke Indo-European.

 

[Novus ordu seclorum]

Something to keep in mind. IVC language was not the only one which disappeared because of Aryan migration. Wikipedia, Pre-Indo-European Languages:

"The Pre-Indo-European languages are any of several ancient languages, not necessarily related to one another, that existed in Prehistoric Europe and South Asia before the arrival of speakers of Indo-European languages."

What was the reason for Indo-European language to dominate so many indigenous languages? My guess is it was better in communication and expression.

 

[Naofumi]

Aryan identity came from Sintashta culture which was part of the larger Andronovo culture

Sintashta had a concept of Aryan brotherhood but its parent culture Andronovo didn't. That's the simple point why are you going in circles?

 

[Maira La]

Sintashta had a concept of Aryan brotherhood but its parent culture Andronovo didn't. That's the simple point why are you going in circles?

Sintashta is the older culture, so I'm not sure how an younger entity gives birth to an older one. Vedic logic?