The Rafale vs F22 video that the web is abuzz on! From ATLC 2010.

[Taygibay]

Simple repost from a video leaked in France yesterday and that shows the exercises from the AL-Dhafra 2009 ( sorry for error in the title ) exercise that was discussed at length then.

It's real as evidenced by the grainy definition. This is where the pics we got at the time where extracted from ( as the one in my profile ).

Fox 1 and gun kill; sorry for the French language intro, I'll come by to affix the translation when time allows.

Good day all, Tay.

rafale vs f 22 - YouTube

 

[Taygibay]

As promised, here is the translation of the text that opens the video :

The Aviation fans’ Portal

In the U.A.E., in 2009. an important training exercise for air forces called ATLC took place.
Advanced Tactical Leadership Course 2009

More than a simple exercise, that event was seen as a competition just after the closing of the Dubai Air Show. Not only the men but the tactics were to be the focus of onlookers but also the machines with amongst others the latest Western products :
Eurofighter Typhoon / F-22 Raptor / Rafale

Until then, the Rafale was considered by the Anglo-American world ( or at least the media and general public ) as a very good machine but well below the EF and even more so the Raptor.

During the exercise, the Rafale and its pilots showed that the aircraft was on par with the competing fighters. During simulated engagements and according to the rules and scenarii, 4 Rafale faced 4 Typhoons.
The scores were extensively commented :
4-0 and 4-1 for the Rafale.
The plane demonstrated excellent capabilities as far as electronic warfare but also bombing, proving the validity its “omnirole” concept, whereas the other 2 machines are not yet fully equipped with those.

Still, limitations of the French plane existed. The US conceded that the Rafale was a though machine to dominate as the score was 5 draws and one kill in favor of the Raptor. The message was easy to understand : despite the high level of the Rafale, the F-22, built solely for aerial combat from afar or close was “untouchable”.

This is what a USAF officer declared as reported by a British journalist ( JL ) :
“The F-22 were dogfighting with external tanks reducing their maneuvering capabilities.”

A few months later, appeared this picture/frame from the Rafale’S OSF ( Front Sector Optronics ) taken during the exercise.

1:35 in vid
___ ___
Clearly, the plane is not equipped with external tanks. These should show under the wings and if you doubt that, here is a pic of the F-22 when it has them.

1:50 in vid
___ ___
The following video will now show that the Rafale is at least on par with the fabulous machine that is the Raptor.
If for close air combat or BFM/Dogfight only. that is.

Thanks to “H” for passing this video down to me.

WARNING : This video does not prove a superiority of the Rafale on the Raptor. We do not know the precise RoE nor what happened in the seconds leading to the merge shown. It only shows the Rafale to be able of flight characteristics that make it similarly capable as its adversary.

___

Then 2:17 and the vid begins.
Tay trans.

And good day all, Tay.

 

[Skull and Bones]

No kidding, apparently i had this video for more than a month, leaked by a French Official.

 

[Jango]

Simple repost from a video leaked in France yesterday and that shows the exercises from the AL-Dhafra 2009 ( sorry for error in the title ) exercise that was discussed at length then.

It's real as evidenced by the grainy definition. This is where the pics we got at the time where extracted from ( as the one in my profile ).

Fox 1 and gun kill; sorry for the French language intro, I'll come by to affix the translation when time allows.

Good day all, Tay.

rafale vs f 22 - YouTube

That guy was screaming when he pulled off 8 G...really intense.

Just goes to show the physical demands of being a fighter pilot.

 

[Safriz]

Thanks.........n

 

[Ayush]

good..nice video..

 

[That Guy]

cool, this really is amazing to see.

I wonder what @gambit thinks about this.

 

[gambit]

cool, this really is amazing to see.

I wonder what @gambit thinks about this.

Already talked about it...

 

[Abingdonboy]

@Taygibay, going by your flags, you certainly have an interesting perspective wrt the Rafale sale to India. What are your thoughts on this?

 

[That Guy]

Already talked about it...

Talking about the video in particular, did it look rigged?

 

[KAL-EL]

I'm envious of F-22 pilots

 

[dbc]

Already talked about it...

Gambit look for TD between 4:12 to 4:17 seems to me the dingleberry doesn't help when the F-22 is low or the lens is not in LOS even as close as 1nm.

 

[gambit]

Gambit look for TD between 4:12 to 4:17 seems to me the dingleberry doesn't help when the F-22 is low or the lens is not in LOS even as close as 1nm.

Remember, the 'dingleberry' is an enhancer. It is on the underside mostly to help ground controllers, but given certain aspect angle to any airborne radar during maneuver, it will help that seeking radar.

In that time span, we are looking at the F-22 completely at its widest physical aspect: top/bottom. No shaping or absorber is going to help ANY fighter, let alone the -22. I have seen an F-16 that size thru a HUD so we are looking at only several hundreds meters or may be 1nm max here.

Target HUD tracking is completely dependent upon radar returns. The HUD symbols are slaved to radar information.

F-16 Dogfight Over the Aegean - YouTube

For the HUD video above, at the 35 secs mark is when the target is inside the HUD target box. So we can use that as an example on what to look for.

For the Rafale v Raptor HUD video, at timestamp 2:50 is when the Raptor is in sight but not inside the target box, hinting at tracking problem. Three seconds later is when target box changes to indicate valid track. Timestamp 3:05 is when the Raptor appears again, much closer this time, and the target box successfully tracked. Timestamp 3:22 is when the Raptor returned, seemingly at similar distance, but the target box failed to lock.

To me, this Rafale HUD video hinted at problems tracking the Raptor within visual range. Not impossible, but given how often the Raptor was not inside the aiming reticle, it seemed like the Rafale pilot had serious problems against the Raptor.

 

[OrionHunter]

Why is the pilot breathing so hard continuously?

 

[Viper0011.]

Absolutely, "active cancellation"...or when the active radar signals are scrambled and deflected and similar 'artificial' frequency is sent back, the return on the radar isn't precise anymore as it mathematical calculation processor is off.
Anything fired on the object being locked or tracked will probably miss it by good few meters at the least. Something that the EFT used in an exercise was the FLIR and that seems to work better as there were no broad spectrum radio waves to scramble, it's just the IR running in sort of in a snapshot mode.