Pakistan protests India glacier tourism plan

[Tiki Tam Tam]

No chechan no Afghan not Tajik Sir

Obviously, it would not be reported in the Pak media and so your knowledge would be doctored

No it is not the same

It is the same.

As India had gone herself over Kashmir to UN.

Unlike Pakistan, India went to the UN since we wanted a fair arbitration. Note it that we wanted the issue to be fair and square and guess who dragged their feet? Was a plebiscite done. If not, why not? We had nothing to hid. Got that? When do people go to the policeman? Ask yourself.

Indian leaders accepted that they will give freedom to Kashmiris if they want.
UN asked for plebasite that is the open reality.

You are a newsreporter and you should not be stingy with facts.

Check the UN resolution about Pakistan having to withdraw its troops before the Plebiscite. Was it done?

That is the open reality!

As far NWFP i will again remind you sir there is no freedom movement there and your claim of Pashtunistan is as false as anything could be.
Give me proof or link of just one such popular movement in NWFP for making it part for Afganistan and which is also equalent to Kashmir movement.
I wil agree with you if you could provide me that.
And there is no Pukhtunistan to the world dear sir.

Don't ask me. Ask Mehsud and others.

Pakistan has worked over decades to build up the false notion that there is a freedom movement. Allow some more time to the Pashtuns and see where it leads. Compare the time spectrum of Kashmir and Pastunistan! Indians don't have to do it, so don;t fret about that. The Talibans will do it for all. Pan Islamism and obscurantism will rule the day!

Unless Pakistan control the situation and that too fast, it will be a greater issue than Kashmir!

Traiq daurata hai! (that is if my Urdu is right!)

If it is up to Pashtuns than let us decide sir we have no such maror in our stomchs

????

 

[Tiki Tam Tam]

Jana,

I have never seen you so how can I call you Chotu.

Pathans are huge and so I am sure as a Pathan girl, you would be a giant!

 

[Spring Onion]

Jana,

I have never seen you so how can I call you Chotu.

Pathans are huge and so I am sure as a Pathan girl, you would be a giant!

here i am if i look giant or not you decide
i am in the pink now you decide

BTW pathan gals are as smart as anything could be

 

[Mustapha]

Salaams,

Lol...Salim...


I'm calm and ready to speak, yet you are ready to talk quite impudently.
Lol, you sound like you have been attacked...


Say what you want... like lol... I never talked about Jihad... I also never claimed to be scholar.


Besides that I said "Indic" is an ethnicity. For example like Dravidians lie as a subcatogory in the group "indic". There is a difference between "indic" & "Indian", ( as Indian is a term used for nationality) and you talk about so-called "understandings and beyond"

Yes everyone makes mistakes, and yes I do too; since I am a Human. Yes I do try to keep a careful look out on my errors, thanks by the way I will edit it...

Yes I know if you "cite" Wikipedia as a souce, I Mean Cite a wikipedia article on your essay or your bibliography or cited works page, you will get a zero. I know that. You are allowed to go to the article to get a general idea and then look upon them in "reliable Sources" to clarify them. there is no need to get Testy over such little things lol.

Back to the topic:

Lol ... rumors, as in what Jawahalal Nehru did. Ah I thought you would know better than me. Yes I havn't read anywhere what he did was confirmed so we can only assume, by secondary sources on the net and autobiographies written by biased people. Yes rumors was an incorrect key term. I take that back immediately.

Those three passages had three main points:
first one: Chinese is a nationality, while Tibetians could be the equivalent to "indic"
second : explaining ethnic groups
third: To explain what "N/A" means in that statistical report

Lol you couldn't understand those three basic points...or in other words you couldn't understand my point(s). Hmmmm...who is frustrated & desperate....we all wonder...

Lol your asking me? Your Indian afterall... I thought you would know basic Demographics about your country...lol...

 

[Tiki Tam Tam]

Jana,

Can't say if you are giant because the other Pathans overshadow you!

But you are a nice looking girl, who does not resemble any of the 'toughness' that you seem to show on forum.

You look too gentle.

 

[Tiki Tam Tam]

Mustafa,

A neat and clever tangential sidestep I must say.

 

[Spring Onion]

Jana,

Can't say if you are giant because the other Pathans overshadow you!

But you are a nice looking girl, who does not resemble any of the 'toughness' that you seem to show on forum.

You look too gentle.

Sir please dont mind but all others in the pic are Indian origion Punjabis

Thanks
Yeh im all gentle lady very caring and toooo much fragile cry alot but on forums well you know its so great to make others gonna go nuts

 

[Neo]

Yeh im all gentle lady very caring and toooo much fragile cry alot but on forums well you know its so great to make others gonna go nuts

Thats our Jana Jee

 

[Mustapha]

Salaams,


The Durand Line...Yes a good catch there... Since the British Raj no longer exists, nor should that Durand Line treaty. Though before that treaty, I think present day NWFP, Balochistan, and even Sindh would belong to Afganistan.

So wait the Durand Line treaty was applied in 1893, and India was partitioned in 1947.

So basically Afganistan had not controlled the area for 54 years. Now its been 114 years that Afganistan had any sovereignty over the annexed area. Though, the Afgans never brought that up... Did they take the issue to the International court?

Sort of odd now, that they bring up the old issue. Pakistan had control of the area since 1947.

However if it was all in Pitan Nationalism, wouldn't that mean Afganistan would have to be divided up too...Like Tajik Badakshan would go to Tajikistan, Since Hazaras are Shia, it woud go to Iran...etc... Its kind of like the Kurds in Iraq, Turkey, and Iran.
though I think the Unification of all the countries in Central Asia would be a good idea.
However being unified with Afganistan with today's situation, doesn't sound like a good idea. Like the Poverty, Corruption, and narcotics. Like Pakistan on it's own has quite a bit of problems.

 

[bhangra12345]

The Durand Line...Yes a good catch there... Since the British Raj no longer exists, nor should that Durand Line treaty. Though before that treaty, I think present day NWFP, Balochistan, and even Sindh would belong to Afganistan.

So wait the Durand Line treaty was applied in 1893, and India was partitioned in 1947.

So basically Afganistan had not controlled the area for 54 years. Now its been 114 years that Afganistan had any sovereignty over the annexed area. Though, the Afgans never brought that up... Did they take the issue to the International court?

Sort of odd now, that they bring up the old issue. Pakistan had control of the area since 1947.

<offtopic>

Afghanistan has disputed the claim of durand line since 1947 and it would not be truthful to say that they have suddenly brought this up.

Pakistan Replays the 'Great Game' - Carnegie Endowment for International Peace

After Pakistan&#8217;s independence from Britain in 1947, Pakistani leaders assumed that Pakistan would inherit the functions of India&#8217;s British government in guiding Afghan policy. But soon after Pakistan&#8217;s independence, Afghanistan voted against Pakistan&#8217;s admission to the United Nations, arguing that Afghanistan&#8217;s treaties with British India relating to Afghan borders were no longer valid because a new country was being created where none existed at the time of these treaties.

Pakistan has control, doenst mean afghanistan doesnt have a claim -
similar to Pakistan has control of Baltistan and ilk , India has a claim and so on.
</offtopic -just to notify the facts>

 

[Tiki Tam Tam]

Salaams,


The Durand Line...Yes a good catch there... Since the British Raj no longer exists, nor should that Durand Line treaty. Though before that treaty, I think present day NWFP, Balochistan, and even Sindh would belong to Afganistan.

Before the Treaty, the world may have belonged to Afghanistan, but only the Pashtuns in NWFP and Baluchistan would qualify as ethnically similar! The remainder could be as akin as maybe the Greeks to Afghanistan!

So wait the Durand Line treaty was applied in 1893, and India was partitioned in 1947.

So basically Afganistan had not controlled the area for 54 years. Now its been 114 years that Afganistan had any sovereignty over the annexed area. Though, the Afgans never brought that up... Did they take the issue to the International court?

Sort of odd now, that they bring up the old issue. Pakistan had control of the area since 1947.

If the McMohan Line could be brought in question, what stops the Durand Line being not recognised?

However if it was all in Pitan Nationalism, wouldn't that mean Afganistan would have to be divided up too...Like Tajik Badakshan would go to Tajikistan, Since Hazaras are Shia, it woud go to Iran...etc... Its kind of like the Kurds in Iraq, Turkey, and Iran.
though I think the Unification of all the countries in Central Asia would be a good idea.
However being unified with Afganistan with today's situation, doesn't sound like a good idea. Like the Poverty, Corruption, and narcotics. Like Pakistan on it's own has quite a bit of problems.

Right now we are discussing NWFP!

As regards your points of other nationalities, for example if Hazaras etc being Shias does not mean that it should be a part of Iran. If sects of a religion decided nationalities, then Pakistan should be a part of Saudi Arabia! That defies logic.

 

[Spring Onion]

Thats our Jana Jee

Thank you Nadeem (Neo) actually i am in process of learning many things though the hard way but i am trying to develop the qualities in me that others posses like selfishness and becoming all materialistic but i think im too much bug head despite hard efforts i dont feel learning so early.


Rest I am gratful to PFF and its members the seniors who had been respecting me despite i had messed up with them many times.

Kindness of Ahsan towards me
Even Asim showed much candid behavour.

Sir Ray (Salim) has a love hate relation with me but i had learned alot from him.

Sid was a good friend don know where he is these days.

Mel had been also soo nice and kind.
and you Neo indeed been a good man and friend.

Sorry guys little bit off topic but will post on the main topic after sometimes.

Thank YOu PFF

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

1/3 of india was ceeded to pak by the british, and the indians agreed. it was never captured from india like u r implying.

Just as 2/3 of the subcontinent was ceded to India by the British, and the Pakistanis "agreed". Neither country captured anything from anyone, they did win their respective independences from colonial rule though.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Pakistan has control, doenst mean afghanistan doesnt have a claim -
similar to Pakistan has control of Baltistan and ilk , India has a claim and so on.
</offtopic -just to notify the facts>

The Pashtun's voted in a referendum after independence to Join Pakistan, I would say that the people have spoken, and any claim of Afghanistan, other than minor adjustments to the Durand Line, are moot.

India can have a "claim" but as the UN resolutions on Kashmir show us, even an apparently "legally valid" claim, by virtue of the "Instrument of Accession" is not so valid. By giving the right to decide their destiny, to the people of Kashmir, the final arbiter, the people, have been vindicated. and that is what counts.

Salim,

You keep insisting on referring to the violence in FATA as " a freedom movement in the NWFP".

You refuse to validate your claims, other than being wishy washy and crooning nonsense to the effect of "someday - given enough time" - "someday the sun will not be", perhaps someday India will be in a dozen different pieces - hardly arguments worth entertaining.

But then there is nothing else for you to make a case upon.

You are indulging in intellectual dishonesty, and making baseless assertions and generalizations, not to mention digressing from the subject of this thread.

To talk of "asking Mehsud", whose beef with the Army is one of not being allowed to carry out raids in Afghanistan, and impose his medieval laws, not Independence, shows how far you have to stretch to make a non existent point.

YOU brought up the argument of "Pashtun Freedom" and you have the presumption to state "ask Mehsud"!

No sir, how about you make your case, and provide evidence to substantiate it (on a different thread please!).

To reiterate a philosophical quote:

"You believe something exists, I don't - I cannot provide negative proofs, the burden of proof is on you to prove that X exists."

 

[Tiki Tam Tam]

The Pashtun's voted in a referendum after independence to Join Pakistan, I would say that the people have spoken, and any claim of Afghanistan, other than minor adjustments to the Durand Line, are moot.

India can have a "claim" but as the UN resolutions on Kashmir show us, even an apparently "legally valid" claim, by virtue of the "Instrument of Accession" is not so valid. By giving the right to decide their destiny, to the people of Kashmir, the final arbiter, the people, have been vindicated. and that is what counts.

Salim,

You keep insisting on referring to the violence in FATA as " a freedom movement in the NWFP".

You refuse to validate your claims, other than being wishy washy and crooning nonsense to the effect of "someday - given enough time" - "someday the sun will not be", perhaps someday India will be in a dozen different pieces - hardly arguments worth entertaining.

But then there is nothing else for you to make a case upon.

You are indulging in intellectual dishonesty, and making baseless assertions and generalizations, not to mention digressing from the subject of this thread.

To talk of "asking Mehsud", whose beef with the Army is one of not being allowed to carry out raids in Afghanistan, and impose his medieval laws, not Independence, shows how far you have to stretch to make a non existent point.

YOU brought up the argument of "Pashtun Freedom" and you have the presumption to state "ask Mehsud"!

No sir, how about you make your case, and provide evidence to substantiate it (on a different thread please!).

To reiterate a philosophical quote:

"You believe something exists, I don't - I cannot provide negative proofs, the burden of proof is on you to prove that X exists."

Does this (my quote below) indicate that I am claiming that it is a freedom movement?

Not Kashmiris, but the rabble that found themselves unemployed after the fall of USSR backed Afghanistan claiming to be Kashmiris and the same rabble that is also plaguing Pakistan in NWFP. It is in Pakistan's interest to divert this to Kashmir so as to keep Pakistan safe and that is what is being done in the guise of 'moral support'.

Would you agree that the rabble that is plaguing NWFP are Islamic freedom fighters wanting liberation? I don't think you would agree. Yet, many feel so and repeatedly claim so. Are they right?

Ask Mehsud is just to indicate that the foreign sponsored terrorists in Kashmir is of the same ilk as Mehsud and his 'fighters'. Mehsud is a terrorist as much as the foreign terrorists operating in Kashmir!

All these terrorists are unemployed malcontent who would otherwise starve, if there was peace and law and order, since all they know is creating unrest and mayhem and have no idea of eking an honest living. They cloak their dishonesty in pious claims. Fools believe them with sheeplike docility and stupidness!

On the issue of India disintegrating into hundred of pieces at a future date, it does not matter to me since it is your forecast. When that day approaches, I will think over it.

What guides me is Reinhold Niebuhr quote:

&#8220;God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, the courage to change the things I can, and the wisdom to know the difference.&#8221;