Pakistan Air Force will have to operate from Afghanistan to escape S-400: Senior Indian MoD official

[volatile]

The Russians use whatever means necessary as negotiations tactics. Have you ever seen Russia not sell something to India? The Russians will sell the S-400 regardless of the FGFA deal signature. The Reliance-Almaz deal is testament to that fact.

We don't know the size of the S-400 deal in the future. All we know is we are buying 5 systems for now and they will all be located around Delhi. If more S-400s are purchased, then indigenous production is possible.

We don't know if the SAM will be customized. There are rumours that 2 new missiles meant for the S-500 will be part of the S-400's arsenal. There are also rumours that the Indian S-400 will also be connected to the Sword Fish radar and the next generation Sword Fish. That way the Indian BMD and S-400 can be integrated. It can then be integrated with Barak and SPYDER also. All we know for sure is an Indian company will build 6000 missiles, most likely Reliance.

Hmmm ! Let see in coming years how this will turn up .

 

[randomradio]

Trial MACE XIII exercise in Slovakia

Trial MACE XIII exercise in Slovakia

Slovakia’s sole S-300PMU (SA-10 ‘Grumble’) surface-to-air missile system was the main actor during the ‘Trial MACE XIII” electronic warfare exercise held in Slovakia from 16-27 April. The S-300PMU and its attendant ‘Flap Lid’ and ‘Clam Shell’ radars were sited at Nitra, with support provided by a Slovakian Air Force L-39ZAM from the 2nd Squadron at Sliac that flew as a target for the SAM crews. The exercise allowed NATO air arms to practise tactics to deal with the so-called ‘double digit’ air defence threat, while ground and flying personnel alike were exposed to operations under electronic jamming conditions.

Sliac air base hosted the tactical air contingent, which consisted of French Air Force Mirage 2000Ds and Rafale Bs, Royal Danish Air Force F-16AMs, a NATO E-3A and a French Air Force E-3F, a Royal Norwegian Air Force Falcon 20, resident Slovakian Air Force MiG-29AS/UBS, and

Turkish Air Force F-4E-2020s from 111 Filo. Also involved was the rarely seen Learjet 35A D-CARL of German firm GFD, fitted with two Cassidian EW pods, again operating from Sliac.

Aircraft involved in ‘Trial MACE XIII’ included 111 Filo ‘Panthers’ F-4E-2020 from Eskisehir equipped with an Elta EL/L-8222 electronic countermeasures pod. Special markings to commemorate 50,000 Phantom flying hours within the unit were applied during the exercise

===================

Except for the Rafale-B, all the NATO aircraft were shot down by the 1980 Soviet era S-300 in Slovakia.

 

[Osiris]

We can simulate S-400 Behaviour in our

Havelsan exports 1st electronic warfare test & training range to Pakistan | TR Defence



Chinese Beidou cum SIGINT assets of ours can give us a fairly accurate idea of the location of S-400. Remember S-400 would be operating continuously which increases its chances of being detected and making saturated attacks against it possible

If you are making castles in air, why not include American spy satellites to track and British James bond to destroy the S400 with his wrist watch too?

After all you are a Major Non Nato ally.

 

[randomradio]

Chinese Beidou cum SIGINT assets of ours can give us a fairly accurate idea of the location of S-400. Remember S-400 would be operating continuously which increases its chances of being detected and making saturated attacks against it possible

The S-400 is highly mobile. And it works in a layered format.

If 10 battalions are positioned in one location, then we are talking about a lot of radars, not just one or two. And for saturation attacks to be possible, you will need hundreds of missiles.

10 battalions should easily have an estimated 720 missiles, out of which 320 are solely dedicated to stopping cruise missiles and aircraft. And this does not count the presence of Barak and SPYDER.

 

[Bratva]

If you are making castles in air, why not include American spy satellites to track and British James bond to destroy the S400 with his wrist watch too?

After all you are a Major Non Nato ally.

So you got no idea Pakistan is using Beidou military GPS since 2012 and has zero idea about SIGINT capabilities of PAF/PA/PN ? Go read up on that. So we can have a constructive discussion.

The S-400 is highly mobile. And it works in a layered format.

If 10 battalions are positioned in one location, then we are talking about a lot of radars, not just one or two. And for saturation attacks to be possible, you will need hundreds of missiles.

10 battalions should easily have an estimated 720 missiles, out of which 320 are solely dedicated to stopping cruise missiles and aircraft. And this does not count the presence of Barak and SPYDER.

It is a very misunderstood concept that SAM are highly mobile. Do you have any idea how long it takes to pack a fully operation SAM and move it to another location ? The fully extended SAM launchers of S-400 and and radar locators as well C&C vehicles would only get to know about saturated attack once it is launched. Surprise is the greatest element. ALCM moving at 800-850 KM/H would take 20-25 minutes to strike at 300-350 KM range. Can S-400 packup under 20-25 minute and leave the saturated attack area ?


And fun fact is Our cruise missiles has limited data link capability as well as planners can see the complete flight path in real time, they can reprogram the missile based on real time update as welll.

 

[$@rJen]

Ok S400 is a good system but let's not get carried away

Pakistan can drop SSG unit behind lines to kill this system or when JF17 block III is out it can use anti radiation missiles H2/4 bombs to take down the system

Also Turkey has gathered lots of info on EW on S400 no big deal

S400 just means PAF will have to operate differently it won't change the balance of power

how is ssg going to reach 100km inside??? S-400 won't be alone it'll be deployed along with low range Akash.. and such systems would always be protected by Gun ships and 100s of Soldiers...

How is JF going to come within range??? before it can get anywhere closer it'd be blasted out of sky...

 

[Osiris]

So you got no idea Pakistan is using Beidou military GPS since 2012 and has zero idea about SIGINT capabilities of PAF/PA/PN ? Go read up on that. So we can have a constructive discussion.

Do you know what GPS is?

It tells you your location on earth and its not a spy satellite. It can not give you the location of enemy equipment.

India has access to Glonass since long before that and its own GPS system on verge of completion.

Ok lets put in a example you might understand.

You are sitting in your room, there is ambulance blaring on the road (S-400 radar battery) some 5 blocks away..you can hear it clearly as you have very good ears (your SIGNIT ) and you have your made in China phone with very accurate GPS on it, it is giving you your exact location.

Based on this information and no other can you give me the exact co-ordinates of the ambulance on the road?

 

[Sage]

you quoted someone who sounded as if he has lost all the hope on his armed forces winning and hoping against hope the Indian Muslims will fight for his country. and you are telling him you can hit via Kashmir.

Yes ...The feasibility of such incursion is sunny ...if you see it from the Pakistani perspective ...no ?

 

[Theskald]

the s400 is the Russian pride & feared by every country . It's amazing that India managed to get their hands on them ,it does make sense after all India were the biggest importers of Russian / soviet tech since ages .

.

 

[Bratva]

Do you know what GPS is?

It tells you your location on earth and its not a spy satellite. It can not give you the location of enemy equipment.

India has access to Glonass since long before that and its own GPS system on verge of completion.

Ok lets put in a example you might understand.

You are sitting in your room, there is ambulance blaring on the road (S-400 radar battery) some 5 blocks away..you can hear it clearly as you have very good ears (your SIGNIT ) and you have your made in China phone with very accurate GPS on it, it is giving you your exact location.

Based on this information and no other can you give me the exact co-ordinates of the ambulance on the road?

Except if you have helicopter in the area which can pretty clearly see the ambulance. No ? And I'm talking about the aerial signint assets of Pakistan not ground based.

 

[Osiris]

Except if you have helicopter in the area which can pretty clearly see the ambulance. No ? And I'm talking about the aerial signint assets of Pakistan not ground based.

You can not see the S-400 because it is enemy territory. And if you can see S-400, it can see you too and much more shoot you down.

Aerial Signit or ground based SIGNIT pretty much work the same, all that changes is the range of detection.

all they can give you general direction the enemy emitter is in. you will not get exact co-ordinated of any emitter from SIGNIT, there will always be huge CEPs involved.

 

[simple Brain]

Chinese arent influential yet in Russian Defence circles where trust in India runs high. Still.

I reckon you need to speed up a little bit in order to catch up for the updates regarding the changing cycle in the world's geopolitics.

 

[cerberus]

Pakistan can drop SSG unit behind lines to kill this system or when JF17 block III is out it can use anti radiation missiles H2/4 bombs to take down the system

Last Pakistan Tried SF Airborne Attacks Against In Indian Soil 1965 Its Doesn't Turn Out to be Nice.Pakistan based its Wartime Strategy on Defensive Because Power Ratio is to Wide Strategic System Like S-400 are Protected in Layers That to Attack Behind the International Border in WAR time its Day Dream

As For Attack from other Means Do Find Reaction time of Indian Air force And Indian Missile defense's and Satellite Surveillance

 

[randomradio]

Can S-400 packup under 20-25 minute and leave the saturated attack area ?

The S-400 can deploy or stow in less than 5 minutes. It can redeploy in a safer area very quickly because the TELs are fast on rugged terrain. Only the mast mounted versions take time, but those are not forward deployed. They are deployed within layers.

India to buy Russian S-400 Triumf air defence missile systems ahead of PM Modi's Moscow visit

Your ALCM is only useful against fixed, undefended targets. Not the S-400.

 

[PaklovesTurkiye]

All i know is....S-400 or blocking sale of F-16, it won't be able to save IAF from the wrath of PAF......

On topic... for S400, what is this for?

Impressive KORAL Land Based Radar Electronic Warfare System on aselsan booth at IDEF 2015 07051509 | IDEF 2015 Show Daily News Coverage Report | Defence security military exhibition 2015

And I have also read following comment on Quora....

"Dear Guys ,

I don't know anyone of you following Turkish defence closely but I certainly am.

A small point , Turkey has bought from Belarus a S-300 System (Only Radar sub systems , no missle included) It was around 2012-2013. From that time on they worked on that system. Taking into consideration the difference between S-400 and S-300 which is only capacity wise , They long time ago finished solved the how system is working. The Koral system is partly designed as a result of that S-300 study. When you solve S-300 , the S-400 a piece of cake.

Here is the official explanation made by Aselsan last week: The Coral system has been installed in Syria border from July 1025 on (Hatay) . And from that time until today there has been more than 1000 test in real war environment . And all of the tests showed success rate far above the expectations.

Please remember , Russian bombs fell on to PYD headquarter last week and the bombs fell on to Assads troops as a result of mistakes. The system also has the ability to misguiding Russan bombers navigation systems. I think you can imagine what is going on....

As I read from the papers , US military analysts saying the Koral System is very powerfull system high above the expectations.

The 5 system oficially accepted by Turkish air force last week after these successful tests.
The system unlike the Russian systems , is completely digital and fully automatic system with very short response time.

So please do not take lightly this system ... I think it is one of its kind which you will hear very often in the future..."

Also see following thread....

Israeli air strike on Syria

@500....if you can shed some light on myth of S 400?