PAF New Batch J-10 C Spotted

[mdmm]

It looks second batch has been received to PAF.
Congrats.
Can anyone confirm units numbers?

Second batch of what ??

 

[UKBengali]

Rafale is indeed superior to J-10C I think. MKI is simply too outdated while Rafale is something PAF needs to counter since MKI is mainly a threat in numbers and in how IAF can operate using such a dinosaur fighter. It is less sophisticated but MKI is undeniably capable in bringing many missiles into the air. PAF however has JF-17 as its high volume fighter. IAF's main strength over PAF is huge numbers advantage.

To simply say MKI would eat J-10C is retarded. Yes 200 MKI would indeed eat 24 J-10C lol but 1 vs 1. Every airforce person in knowledge of these would bet their money and their lives on J-10C defeating MKI. PLAAF own exercises even J-10B can defeat Su-35 with relative ease. J-10C against Su-35 wasn't a competition. It is J-10C choosing when to engage and how to engage every time. Big flankers only come into their strength when the rest of the airforce allows them to use their strength appropriately. Rafale is IAF's top end fighter and to tie everything together, to kick down the door, to supress adversary electronic and battlefield assets.

Simply you are correct. IAF requires more Rafale. PAF's counter to Rafale since that's the order of acquisition, is J-10C. If they want to properly counter, the PAF needs more J-10C and greater support from ground to other in the air. Before Rafale, IAF had no modern 4.5 generation fighter and no modern air to air missile.

How did you work out that Rafale is superior to J-10C?

In high-altitude engagements J-10C will have the edge since it is canard-delta design and the PL-15 will be very competitive with Meteor, with the Meteor having a slight edge.

I expect the radar and electronics on the J-10C to be the equal of anything in the Rafale.

 

[White and Green with M/S]

To all the Pakistani trolls:

View attachment 855973

This is biggest proof that's MKI was hit by AMRAAM in Indian airspace you troll you're brainwashed by your military/ govt

And last you're bigger troll than us

 

[Thorough Pro]

Taking a missile, fired by your opponent, up your *** is not considered having lunch, dinner, or breakfast among sane people.

The SU-30MKI would eat the J-10C for breakfast, lunch and dinner.

 

[doorstar]

Possibly the reason COAS quietly ( no ISPR announcement of much a do planned trip ) flew to China week or so ago to hash out the payment for much a needed J-10s ?

negotiated a 3.2 billion dollar grant aid for the relief of pandit showbaaz goremint --in order to avoid default-- to the chagrin of imam e ahzam.

earlier he convinced saudi wali ehd to say that: "we cannot abandon our Pakistani brethren" + 3 more countries are advancing loans.

 

[doorstar]

Hone many Rafale India is able to afford to counter China’s Might.

as many as France can produce, I assume. today I saw saeed qazi, a pro khan TV presenter and his screaming sidekick arif bhatti praising india. extolling the virtues of honest indian politicians who have helped india accumulate more than 600 billion dollars in reserves. "heck they earn 150 billion dollars a year in IT exports alone". then they went on to show pictures of many futuristic and posh buildings from india to show what a prosperous country it was while lamenting that Pakistani establishment has brought back the crooks to power.

@Wood

 

[MultaniGuy]

To all the Pakistani trolls:

View attachment 855973

lol Pakistani trolls on a Pakistani website. Are you an idiot?

 

[Bengal71]

To all the Pakistani trolls:

View attachment 855973

That clearly looks like the missile hit something and exploded.

 

[siegecrossbow]

To all the Pakistani trolls:

View attachment 855973

If India has shot down an F-16, why not just show parts from the plane instead of the missile?

 

[White and Green with M/S]

lol Pakistani trolls on a Pakistani website. Are you an idiot?

No @Samar111 is an INDIOT not an idiot

If India has shot down an F-16, why not just show parts from the plane instead of the missile?

They claim they shot down our jet in our airspace not their and airspace and @Samar111 is just a baseless Indian troll and nothing else we should ignore him brother

 

[SQ8]

No @Samar111 is an INDIOT not an idiot

I don’t appreciate the term..

Better to use Bhaktora and differentiate between sanity and delusional idiots.

Popularize this term because even sane Indians could use it.

To all the Pakistani trolls:

View attachment 855973

You really are a real life version of wimp lo

 

[serenity]

SAMAR seems like a false flag person who wants to embarrass India.

The BJP logo also is too much and becoming obvious. Then the showing missile wreckage as if to suggest the usual old Indian narrative... that doesn't look well for India. 90% sure this guy is anti-Indian false flagger now lol.

 

[MultaniGuy]

No @Samar111 is an INDIOT not an idiot


They claim they shot down our jet in our airspace not their and airspace and @Samar111 is just a baseless Indian troll and nothing else we should ignore him brother

Exactly that Indian member is an Indiot.

This is a Pakistani website. How can there be Pakistani trolls on a Pakistani website?

 

[Signalian]

Rafale is indeed superior to J-10C I think. MKI is simply too outdated while Rafale is something PAF needs to counter since MKI is mainly a threat in numbers and in how IAF can operate using such a dinosaur fighter. It is less sophisticated but MKI is undeniably capable in bringing many missiles into the air. PAF however has JF-17 as its high volume fighter. IAF's main strength over PAF is huge numbers advantage.

To simply say MKI would eat J-10C is retarded. Yes 200 MKI would indeed eat 24 J-10C lol but 1 vs 1. Every airforce person in knowledge of these would bet their money and their lives on J-10C defeating MKI. PLAAF own exercises even J-10B can defeat Su-35 with relative ease. J-10C against Su-35 wasn't a competition. It is J-10C choosing when to engage and how to engage every time. Big flankers only come into their strength when the rest of the airforce allows them to use their strength appropriately. Rafale is IAF's top end fighter and to tie everything together, to kick down the door, to supress adversary electronic and battlefield assets.

Simply you are correct. IAF requires more Rafale. PAF's counter to Rafale since that's the order of acquisition, is J-10C. If they want to properly counter, the PAF needs more J-10C and greater support from ground to other in the air. Before Rafale, IAF had no modern 4.5 generation fighter and no modern air to air missile.

Rafale's SPECTRA is an integrated defensive system. J-10's defensive system is largely unknown. JF-17 should be able to get an integrated defensive system in Block III.

 

[serenity]

Your SU30S are being shot down by obsolete soviet era Mig 29As from the 1980s in Ukraine

Russia lost a few Su-30 in Ukraine but not quite as many as some think. The numbers last time I checked was under 10 lost. Ukraine war for Russia is like Vietnam war for USA or Korea for USA rather than using Afghanistan or Iraq as examples. The capability gap between Russia and Ukraine is closer than USA and Vietnam 50 years ago. That of course was a different era but the US lost over 3000 manned aircraft and over 5000 helicopters.

I think the portrayal of the war is a bit too affected by propagandas. I think Russians use their stuff very roughly and with a very risk tolerant attitude but reality is maybe this is even a wrong impression and in comparison to other major large scale all out wars (which Russia is the one not pushing all its weight) then their aircraft losses aren't actually all that substantial. If the US were to go to war with North Korea for example, they would lose many modern fighter aircraft. One can bet everything on that. Lose at least similar levels to how many Russia is losing. Of course this requires China to be supporting the North Koreans with weapons like USA supports Ukraine for example.

To recently at least, Ukraine still moves around S-300 SAMs and others. They are not all destroyed by Russia especially in the eastern half.

2020s russian junk is being shot down by 1980s soviet junk in Ukraine. Only real threat to the PAF are the few dozen Mirage 2000s and Rafales. Mirage 2000s are mainly focused on ground strike. The IAF only have a few dozen jets capable of precision guided strikes. Rafales will be split across the China/Pak frontier whereby PAF will be able to focus its full resources along the Indian frontier.

MKI they have over 200 of which means well over 100 that are serviceable. This is capable of bringing basically 1000 medium range missiles into fights or a fight. This alone is some force. Of course MKI is by even 2010, outdated as this was the era (for everyone not USA) of 4.5 gen fighters already starting to be manufactured. MKI is NOT a 4.5 gen fighter.

PLAAF considers J-11B to be fairly useful. Of course it is using even more old tech than what is on MKI but for PLA as a whole, J-11B in modernity and technology is after J-20, J-35, J-16, J-10C, J-10B, Su-35, J-11D (or J-11BG), and even Su-30MK2 (modernity but maybe not in capability).

PLAAF still has J-8 and J-7 in service. Thousands of these fighters are not a force to be ignored. hundreds of Su-30MKI is a greater force than the entire Australian Airforce for example, ignoring F-35 in Australian service of course.

In the next conflict I can bet 5 bitcoins that the PAF/Pakistani forces will eat IAF/Indian forces up.

This I would not bet. J-10C vs Su-35 or Su-30MKI, J-10C ...okay yes 5 bitcoins no worries. PAF will eat up IAF in the next conflict? we should remember how much of a numbers difference there is and if it was a case where PAF has dozens of 5th generation fighters to balance it out, then 5 bitcoins bet okay.

India has roughly 600? 4th generation to 4.5 generation fighters (assuming 36 Rafales all delivered) while Pakistan has 300? 4th and 4.5 generation fighters.

No matter training and command superiority, that's 100% more. The technology base and equipment capability level are roughly similar, maybe even with slight advantage to India in fighters and missiles while Pakistan at the moment would have slight advantage in networking, communications, and electronic warfare.

How did you work out that Rafale is superior to J-10C?

In high-altitude engagements J-10C will have the edge since it is canard-delta design and the PL-15 will be very competitive with Meteor, with the Meteor having a slight edge.

I expect the radar and electronics on the J-10C to be the equal of anything in the Rafale.

The Rafale IAF bought are the most modern and updated Rafales with an American based AESA radar. The French RBE AESA radar I think was American design based. Might be wrong on this.

It carries 25% more fuel (more energy and range) and more payload. Meteor is probably slightly better than PL-15E to significantly better similar to PL-12 to PL-15 difference gap maybe. PAF bought PL-15E export version and has range that is more limited and no dual pulse motor apparently. Again this is quite an unknown but let's assume worse rather than assume better.

Radar and electronics honestly I would have considered J-10C to be higher because the honest truth is Chinese electronics especially high end military ones are no exaggeration, leading if not tied with US. BUT J-10C receiving all the best and the top notch equipment? I don't think so. This is supposed to be China's light weight cheap fighter. It is the budget fighter and so the calculation for deciding how well it needs to be electronically is optimized rather than given the absolute best with blank check for engineers like J-20 would be. J-10C would have just good enough AESA to peak and optimize its platform and just good enough EW etc. This is still a good level don't get me wrong, PLAAF has in the past sent J-10A and J-10C to intercept Japanese F-15s and Vietnamese Su-30s. Always sending a single J-10 to intercept several fighters. In Vietnam's case, there are leaks that the J-10 were able to jam Su-30s since China bought two Su-30MK types and know them thoroughly and know their weaknesses and how to electronically defeat or suppress them.

The French SPECTRA suite is nothing more than what many fighters have used. Active cancellation and signals processing is yawn. Boring and neither China US or even Russia bothered with that path. They would all have looked into it and trialed it. J-10C however does have something quite similar, basically an integrated EW suite and jammer. That's all SPECTRA really is... it just is the French gave it a cool sounding name. The active component is just jamming but integrated with aircraft rather than on a pod and supposedly can mask the aircraft better etc. Maybe J-10C's isn't far behind in effectiveness, maybe it is. The key to this though isn't in defence - jamming and SPECTRA etc but in defeating jamming attempts and going through it.

Overall Rafale is still better since it can carry more weapons and more fuel if all those over concerns are roughly equal. I would rather PAF assume those categories are all at least slightly worse than Rafale in performance. Then the balance shifts to Rafales favor even more.