Options for PAF After India Selects Rafale for MMRCA

[majesticpankaj]

I cant recall when i possibly read something as ridiculous as this ... JFT are sanction prone really ?

JFT is not under nappies ... Been in operational service for 2 years and being refined with every passing day ... Completed 10 000 sorties and has flown in WoT ... What else do you desire ?

jf-17 still uses russian made engine.. don't you know that.. too bad for you.

As you don't understand the how critical is supply chains for a war.. I put a quote by Air chief marshal of India ... he said borrow, steal or do copy whatever to make critical parts indigenous. what a massive comment when we know that our supply lines are free from sanctions... now try to see from PAF point of view.. the two major jets are critically sanctioned prone.

Bombing against the militants and fighting against a airforce of the size of IAF is a different game.

 

[Secur]

JFT hopes to be as good as Mig29s. And you say it would be able to take on both Mirage 2000 and Mig29s
PAF had F86 and F-104 Starfighter which were much better than Hunters and Gnats and we did not use Mig21 so extensively and still PAF could not stand against IAF.

The Mikoyan Director acknowledged the performance/capabilities of JFT w.r.t MIG 29 ... Check that one ...

PAF almost destroyed 1/3 of IAF in 1965 ... In 1971 , only the Eastern wing was dominated that too because there was only 1 squadron placed over there ... Western wing was a different story ... Check the wiki article ...

 

[Secur]

Sukhoi upgradation to Super Sukhoi has AESA .
Rafale/EFT offered to India will have AESA.
LCA will be fitted with homegrown AESA.
BTW its not only the AESA, but also the advanced avionics edge Europe and Russia have over China.

The gap is narrowing day by day , J 20 is an open example ... How many 5th generation aircraft projects does the Europeans have anyways ?

 

[KRAIT]

Too bad , the Russians still supply it despite the massive military you purchase from them ...
This is business . my friend ... Didn't your diplomats try hard to block that sale ? Did Russia pay any heed to it ? and it doesn't matter , China's been buying these engines for years now ... Most of them have already been delivered

Yes i know , but you dont call a fully ready aircraft operational and bombing targets as being in nappies ? Do you ?

Actually India did succeed in this diplomatic act, but before Russia stop China , the engines were already committed by chinese. Now Chinese have their own engine program, you don't have to depend on it.

 

[ziaulislam]

Sukhoi upgradation to Super Sukhoi has AESA .
Rafale/EFT offered to India will have AESA.
LCA will be fitted with homegrown AESA.

PAF have to think about future of their own and IAF.
BTW its not only the AESA, but also the advanced avionics edge Europe and Russia have over China.

there is a difference between will be and there.

dont worry, to counter your will be, we will be having AESA in J-10 and next 50 thunders(100-150) thunders

 

[Jade]

Clam down guys;

The quantum of the purchase say that this for defensive purpose and for power projection in this region than any intention to attack anybody.

 

[Secur]

Actually India did succeed in this diplomatic act, but before Russia stop China , the engines were already committed by chinese. Now Chinese have their own engine program, you don't have to depend on it.

No bro , it was all over the news ... Even the Mikoyan company protested about the sale ... It wasn't good for their own exports ...

 

[majesticpankaj]

Too bad , the Russians still supply it despite the massive military you purchase from them ...
This is business . my friend ... Didn't your diplomats try hard to block that sale ? Did Russia pay any heed to it ? and it doesn't matter , China's been buying these engines for years now ... Most of them have already been delivered

Yes i know , but you dont call a fully ready aircraft operational and bombing targets as being in nappies ? Do you ?

My dear friend, as I tried to tell you the importance of sanctioned prone supply lines at the time of WAR but I think you don't have the head to appreciate the fact.

Will support India against friendly neighbour: Medvedev - Hindustan Times

 

[KRAIT]

The gap is narrowing day by day , J 20 is an open example ... How many 5th generation aircraft projects does the Europeans have anyways ?

They didn't have to, because of F-35 and EU union and NATO in which US will have 187 F-22 raptor. India, Russia and China are atleast 6 years behind to induct first 5th gen.
I agree with you on gap narrowing part, but at the same time India is also making progress to narrow its gap with China, yeah we are way behind but still reaching closer.

 

[Hobo1]

The Mikoyan Director acknowledged the performance/capabilities of JFT w.r.t MIG 29 ... Check that one ...

PAF almost destroyed 1/3 of IAF in 1965 ... In 1971 , only the Eastern wing was dominated that too because there was only 1 squadron placed over there ... Western wing was a different story ... Check the wiki article ...

Mikoyan Director was making all this noise because he doesn't want any competition for Mig29s. If would suggest you check wiki, it full of stories how gnat after the war of 71 how Gnats were started to be called Sabre slayer and sabres were best fighters around that time. Mig21 were not that used by IAF probably since they still new and so of them were also kept aside for Chinese threat.

 

[Secur]

My dear friend, as I tried to tell you the importance of sanctioned prone supply lines at the time of WAR but I think you don't have the head to appreciate the fact.

Will support India against friendly neighbour: Medvedev - Hindustan Times

Just how can you sanction the engines bro ? Kill switches in RD 93 ? Is that what you are implying ?

Shouldn't have sold the engines in the first place ... Action speak louder than words actually ...

 

[KRAIT]

there is a difference between will be and there.

dont worry, to counter your will be, we will be having AESA in J-10 and next 50 thunders(100-150) thunders

I already said that you are getting AESA and i also wished that you don't get it soon. But my wish wont change inevitable.
Cheers

 

[KRAIT]

Guys don't bring history, it will derail the thread.

 

[MilSpec]

I don't think India's decision is a solid one either and I don't see any timetables being met as well (lets face it till now none were met as well).

Indications are that the French were the lower bidders, which further indicates that the Indian financial crises played its role. The amount of INR that it would have cost India has exponentially increased since the rupee devalued. Moreover we still don't know if the Rafale can even take on the Su-30 MKI.

Pakistan needs to continue on its path of upgrading JF-17s and then moving to J-10s and J-20s.

I didn't quite understand the relevance of your Afghanistan comment.

sir,
out of the contenders for MMRCA, the two shortlisted a/c fulfilled the desired parameters set by the air force, and the lowest bidder was selected. It does not signifies indian financial crisis, lowest bidder often referred as L1 is always selected government issued tenders. This is standard operating procedure for any contract in PSU's and government contracts.

As far as rafale and Su 30MKI, the two are of different class, Super Su30 MKI upgrade proposes, AESA radar, RAM coatings upgraded IRST, Ramjet BVR r77 AE-MD will outclass rafale by a fair margin. Even in its current configuration MKI outguns everything in the subcontinent including the proposed newest arrival rafale in its current configuration.

As for pakistan, I suspect there will be a surprise aircraft showing up in few years. the current plans of j17, j10 and the proposed new stealth fighter for PAF by china will provide ample deterrence for PAF to maintain the traditional balance.

 

[Secur]

@indians

Trust IAF and selection committee.

Make it both ways bro The MMRCA was going on for almost 6 years ... Surely the PAF may have thought something , No ?

As far as rafale and Su 30MKI, the two are of different class, Super Su30 MKI upgrade proposes, AESA radar, RAM coatings upgraded IRST, Ramjet BVR r77 AE-MD will outclass rafale by a fair margin. Even in its current configuration MKI outguns everything in the subcontinent including the proposed newest arrival rafale in its current configuration.

China has Su 30's right ? Whats the difference ? How do you claim this utter dominance in the subcontinent ? When does that begin though the upgradation process ?