India to Build 6 Nuclear-Powered Submarines - Navy Chief

[Providence]

hi dear @Hyperion
I wish to shed some light on the research and development of light water reactor that went into ARIHANT. India indeed went through the very decent learning curve in ATV project- mind you my friend the project was sanctioned a good 3 decades back. Russian help was very crucial in a lot of areas but if you're thinking that russians are generous enough to simply hand over their blue prints etc to us then you're badly mistaken. In india unfortunately a lot of folks simply dont know the nature of russian involvement in our projects inspite of transparent nature of our research. Russians merely provide the much needed "technical consultancy". Lets suppose they are here for consultancy in SLBM project,and are asked what materials shall we use for efficient operation of RCS in SLBM?then they will give roughly 3-4 choices to narrow down.This helps a lot and cuts a lot of development time- but this has limitation in terms of what they can "tell"- or allowed to discuss with their indian counterparts!
As far as the design of LWR of arihant is concerned,it is our own,however without russian help we wouldnt have made a "sea worthy" reactor in first go! Miniaturizing a light water reactor is one thing- making it reliable for sea operations is QUITE ANOTHER- and thats where russian consultancy helped BARC/DRDO.

Here, seems you don't want to listen to a "white", above is a "brown" guy @amardeep mishra comprising "everybody"
@sankranti

LOL..... really ?

Nuclear-Powered Ships | Nuclear Submarines

India launched its first nuclear submarine in 2009, the 6000 dwt Arihant SSBN, with a single 85 MW PWR fuelled by HEU driving a 70 MW steam turbine.

And pasting a link of 5 pages is supposed to mean something to me?

 

[sankranti]

Here, seems you don't want to listen to a "white", above is a "brown" guy @amardeep mishra comprising "everybody"
@sankranti

Still whining yank ............ good good ....let the butt hurt flow.

And pasting a link of 5 pages is supposed to mean something to me?

Shit No. Ignorance is suppose to mean everything to you

This is just for the rest of the guys who may want too see how hollow your claims are.

 

[Providence]

Still whining yank ............ good good ....let the butt hurt flow.

Not only did you lose the argument on a technical level but numbers also don't favour you

All your credibility is lost in this thread. Believe that !!

 

[Hyperion]

Agreed to most, other than the quoted part...... well, that's another can of worms, better avoided.

The only reason why india didnt go for the LWRs in past was something to do with the poor production of uranium in country,now since NSG doors have been opened and influx of foreign uranium has begun in a big way,india can now afford to install her own LWRs of 900MW

 

[sankranti]

Not only did you lose the argument on a technical level but numbers also don't favour you

All your credibility is lost in this thread. Believe that !!

LOL .... really ? Why ?

Just because you want to believe that Russians gave us the Reactor ? ...... that poor India cannot build a Nuclear Sub ? ........ that it must be impossible for brown folks and they can do it only when white folks help them do it ?

Are you sure its MY credibility that is lost here ?

 

[Hyperion]

@Nilgiri, your input on the whole affair and % 'indigenousness' in core systems of Arihant.

 

[amardeep mishra]

Agreed to most, other than the quoted part...... well, that's another can of worms, better avoided.

@Hyperion
On the contrary,LWRs are technically less complex than breeder reactors or even CHTRs. Hence the cost of a unit electricity produced by a LWR is more competitive than a breeder reactor or a CHTR and thats why they still dominate the landscape of commercial nuclear reactor market-except in india where there was a dearth of a highly enriched uranium.India couldnt afford to run their reactors on highly enriched uranium especially when we have low stock. I happen to have studied some of our designs back in my engineering

 

[Talwar e Pakistan]

Which one among the Top 10, ur navy is getting? The Chinese one??

Yes, but ours will be more upgraded.

 

[Aham Brahmasmi]

or buy 6 nuc subs from russia?

 

[amardeep mishra]

@Hyperion
Here are some of the reactors on which research work is going on in india-
kindly go through them all. Especially the AHWR,it is very promising design capable of utilizing thorium
Research & Development Activities – Materials Sciences- High Purity Materials

 

[Hyperion]

I have studied that particular one in detail, and I agree that it indeed has a promising potential. Thanks for the tag.

@Hyperion
Here are some of the reactors on which research work is going on in india-
kindly go through them all. Especially the AHWR,it is very promising design capable of utilizing thorium
Research & Development Activities – Materials Sciences- High Purity Materials

 

[Aham Brahmasmi]

India has around 150 active warheads, while it can assemble somewhere around 500-700 warheads in very quick time frame. And has enough purified fissile materials to make around 1500 warheads if situation demands. In a long term time frame, if the situation deteriorates, I see India maintaining around 350-400 warheads in active duty.

whats name of 2nd generation Arihant Class sub ?

 

[Aham Brahmasmi]

I refuse to apply burnol on your @ss, i suggest you do it yourself.

I refuse to apply burnol on your @ss,

post reported @waz

 

[Nilgiri]

@Nilgri, your input on the whole affair and % 'indigenousness' in core systems of Arihant.

The BARC guys (I have met a few) are a very dedicated intelligent and organised group. Definitely underrated.

My interaction with them was mostly limited to the FBTR program, and I doubt I would have got any answer from anything regarding a miniaturised reactor:

ARIHANT TEST FIRED HER FIRST SLBM

Now I would imagine that the main issues regarding a "small" marine PWR revolve around the materials RnD and engineering since proof of concept and design envelope would be quite easy to establish given the path trodden by other countries in the area.

This sort of RnD does not come easily. IIRC, I remember an article long time back talking about one of the teams of BARC scientists that went to France to study the design (in the 80s), operation and most importantly scaling methodologies and simulations used in France's PWRs zirconium based-alloys. The RnD iterations regarding these (from what I know of superalloys used in gas turbines and jet engines) need heavy investments of time, funding and mental perspiration. I would imagine the French took at least 20 years to perfect these to the level available at that time....probably with lots of joint European cooperation too (especially with German fundamental material research - which is second to none to this day).

Mind you there was a lot of groundwork done by India itself in the 70s when the ATV project first commenced. However this access to materials science from France would have in my estimate accelerated the whole thing by at least 10 years.

Ground based PWR prototype by BARC - criticality 2003:

Regarding Russian help/contribution, it cannot be sidelined either....but it was not as significant as the French imo. But it was probably roughly the same amount....but I cannot say for sure since a lot of what Admiral Gorshkov provided to India is still veiled in secrecy today. I would imagine most of it would revolve around such things as operational expertise and handling (especially the modelling of the various feedback loops from the change of material ductility over time from neutron flux - where ground "hands on" experience simply has no theoretical substitute)...and probably some form of guidance and stewardship on reactor arrangement and ways to shortcut around known issues etc.

The 70MW claim is dubious in first place.

Agree. I think someone converted the number wrong to wiki.

 

[sankranti]

Agree. I think someone converted the number wrong to wiki.

WOW .... I just have to hand it to you. Your lucid assumptions take precedence over the Press Release by the Indian Navy and the Govt. of India ? .......... Amazing Hubris.

THIS is from the official Press Release and invitation to Major Newspaper in India when Arihant was Unveiled.

INS Arihant: All you want to know about India’s first nuclear-powered submarine - daily.bhaskar.com

Class & type: Arihant-class submarine
Type: SSBN
Length: 111 m (364 ft)[1]
Beam: 15 m (49 ft)[1]
Draft: 11 m (36 ft)[1]
Propulsion: PWR using 40% enriched uranium fuel (80 MWe );[1] one turbine (47,000 hp/70 MW); one shaft; one 7-bladed, high-skew propeller (estimated)
Range: unlimited except by food supplies
Test depth: 300 m (980 ft) (estimated)
Complement: 95–100 officers and men
Sensors and
processing systems: BEL USHUS
Armament: 6 x 533mm torpedoes
12 x Sagarika (missile) SLBM
Or
4 x K-4