Hindu Ramayana and Islam (Allah) in a religious text!

[Bangalorean]

The post by LadyGaga sums it all up. Many people on this forum (and outside) cannot fathom the concept of not having a prophet, or one religious book, and many people secretly think of "idol worshippers" as lowly and inferior (just look at some comments on unmoderated sites like youtube). In one of the comments above by one of the posters, he is barely able to hide his ridicule, he asks, "What is wrong with you people"?!

 

[Valiant_Soul]

The post by LadyGaga sums it all up. Many people on this forum (and outside) cannot fathom the concept of not having a prophet, or one religious book, and many people secretly think of "idol worshippers" as lowly and inferior (just look at some comments on unmoderated sites like youtube). In one of the comments above by one of the posters, he is barely able to hide his ridicule, he asks, "What is wrong with you people"?!

The post by LadyGaga is indeed commendable for her effort, but that is not all. There is much to delve into before we can finally come to an understanding of the world as seen through the ancient "Hindu" philosophy. Trust me, there is a lot to be understood.

 

[indushek]

Don't know what is wrong with you people.
as far as my understanding goes in hinduism almost every thing is god or cast of god or some thing like that.Apparently this is the reason you worship stones(carved in particular shape),animals(monkey,elephant,cow),reptiles(snake) and even human beings(ram,krishan).
just one question:How the creation of god becomes god himself?

Does god himself told you people i am also present in these things so you can please me through worshiping these things,or its just justification of your mind.you people want to please god in your way,but why not in a way that god told you?

Excellent questions there u know.

In hinduism there are two schools of thought advaita and dvaita. In one thought god resides from the smallest atom to the largest thing in the universe. In the other all the things which we see are gods creation and have to mix with the ultimate one finally.

According to the first thought we can worship anything or anyone as you are worshipping the god only. The basic principle is that there is no existence without god of any thing so we are his manifestations. The other thought says that we have been created by him and are seperate from him so will join him finally after performing our karma on this earth. Karma is also present in the first concept too.

Infact the texts like vedas and puranas propound themselves lot of different ideas i.e that there is only one god to various gods. This religion is like a river ever changing its course.

Idol worship is mainly done with the basic concept that, a person while praying for god cannot completely concentrate on him due to human tendency of distraction of mind. Add to this that u cannot imagine what u are praying which confuses the mind on what it has to concentrate, however if a manifestation of the god is present before u , u can concentrate on that to train ur mind well.

Hope i have answered even to some extent.

 

[Speaker]

Nice..but if u say \"Allah\" does it literally mean one entity or god in general?

Allah is just a placeholder for the concept of god. And everyone knows the concept of god is not the invention of any one particular religion. Malaysia is one of the countries where Islam spread through peaceful means (basically trade) and people would have tried to cross over mythology with words used for god in other civilizations (maybe the Arab and Persian traders they interacted with).

Does god himself told you people i am also present in these things so you can please me through worshiping these things,or its just justification of your mind.you people want to please god in your way,but why not in a way that god told you?

God may or may not have told people what to do. There is no way one can prove it conclusively. It is just a matter of faith. It is the same faith that lets you, Christians and Jews believe that there was a prophet who was given the word of god directly. We should not question others if they do things to please god in "their way".

It was not me who claimed that rather some points posted by someone and according to our faith there is NO idiol as god.

Idols are a symbol of god. No one states technically that it is god himself/herself. We immerse idols of god in oceans and lakes. It doesn't mean we are drowning them. There are sentiments attached with idols. It is similar to a religious book. The Quran is not god, but you will feel hurt if someone burns or tears it. It is similar with idols or pictures of god.

Reading, studying something for understanding is one thing and reciting beliefs of others, other than Islam and believing in that is another thing. Reciting it as a belief by a Muslim is negating Islam.

I think you are implying the concept of niyat here. I don't know why the same logic is not extended to Mr. Kalam. Maybe he is also reading it as a religious text to gain knowledge, and not necessarily challenging the omnipotence of Allah, or the Prophethood and finality of Prophet Muhammad. But anyway, this is off topic.

The Bhagvad Gita is not the Hindu equivalent of the Bible or the Quran. Hinduism has many religious texts including the Upanishads which are probably the most thorough treatises of Hinduism. You would be surprised to know that many of them ignore the concept of God & a couple of them dismiss the idea entirely as being irrelevant.

Actually we can't call these "religious texts" since Hinduism cannot be technically classified as a religion. It is a system of belief based on cultural values and customs, passed on over generations with time. We believe it is god who chose this way of life for us, but we don't have incentives or disincentives to compel people to follow this path to salvation.

 

[JanjaWeed]

@LadyGaga.. Thank you for sharing that excellent e-mail, which is spot on!! i do get lot of q's about the same subject. Atleast now i can explain it better.. Cheers for that!!

 

[*Awan*]

And where is the place for Allah in this entire system of existence?

His arsh(throne)

 

[*Awan*]

ya every atom is made by god and god itself resides in it....

its up to you whome you want to worship... if you are hindu you may create your own god.... you can worship any one and any where because where ever you pray and what ever you pray ..its sure GOD is present there....

you even dont need any idol to worship.... or you can worship your books, musical instruments because god is even there too...

did you get my point??

you gone nuts.
how creation of god became god himself.
sorry for following lines.
by your logic na-auzbillah god is also present in toilets,urine,semens etc etc.
why you people can't think once before posting



After reading your posts i decided it no more possible for me to argue with you people.if some of have problems with above line simply write edit your post without quoting me and i will edit my post.
at the i only say
FOR YOU YOUR RELIGION FOR ME MY RELIGION.

 

[gubbi]

by your logic na-auzbillah god is also present in toilets,urine,semens etc etc.
why you people can't think once before posting

Semen contains spermatozoa which fertilize ova to give rise to new life. So, omnipresence of God is being challenged, I see.

 

[justanobserver]

deleted......

 

[rohitshubham]

Don't know what is wrong with you people.
as far as my understanding goes in hinduism almost every thing is god or cast of god or some thing like that.Apparently this is the reason you worship stones(carved in particular shape),animals(monkey,elephant,cow),reptiles(snake) and even human beings(ram,krishan).
just one question:How the creation of god becomes god himself?

Does god himself told you people i am also present in these things so you can please me through worshiping these things,or its just justification of your mind.you people want to please god in your way,but why not in a way that god told you?

The God actually sees the faith in us .. if we seek the God from our heart ,then the way doesn't really matter... Moreover everything that God created is divine creation and hence are respected

 

[gubbi]

^^

Uncalled for. Delete it. Lets not start this. Untill now, this thread is going great. Lets not spoil it.

 

[LaBong]

I remember posting this while replying Zakir long time ago. He probably tried committing suicide after witnessing such unbelievable shirk done by fellow Muslims!

 

[GentlemanObserver]

You see this is why i don't like discussing religion, it's a very complex and personal thing. Lets just end this discussion here shall we. It's really starting to drag.

 

[LaBong]

Something interesting i received in my email.
@ MODS if this is violating any forum rules please delete it.

Excellent explanation of Hinduism which is not just a religion but way of living life




WHY U R A HINDU....!

Four years ago, I was flying from JFK NY Airport to SFO to attend a meeting at Monterey ,
CA An American girl was sitting on the right side, near window seat.
It indeed was a long journey - it would take nearly seven hours.

I was surprised to see the young girl reading a Bible unusual of young Americans. After some time
she smiled and we had few acquaintances talk.I told her that I am from India

Then suddenly the girl asked: 'What's your faith?' 'What?' I didn't understand the question.

'I mean, what's your religion? Are you a Christian? Or a Muslim?'

'No!' I replied, 'I am neither Christian nor Muslim'.
Apparently she appeared shocked to listen to that. 'Then who are you?' 'I am a Hindu', I said.

She looked at me as if she was seeing a caged animal. She could not understand what I was talking about.

A common man in Europe or US knows about Christianity and Islam, as they are the leading
religions of the world today. But a Hindu, what?

I explained to her - I am born to a Hindu father and Hindu mother. Therefore, I am a Hindu by birth.

'Who is your prophet?' she asked.

'We don't have a prophet,' I replied.
0A

'What's your Holy Book?'

'We don't have a single Holy Book, but we have hundreds and thousands of philosophical and sacred scriptures,' I replied.

'Oh, come on at least tell me who is your God?'

'What do you mean by that?'

'Like we have Jesus and Muslims have Allah - don't you have a God?'

I thought for a moment. Muslims and Christians believe one God (Male God) who created the world
and takes an interest in the humans who inhabit it. Her mind is conditioned with that kind of belief.

According to her (or anybody who doesn't know about Hinduism), a religion needs to have one Prophet,
one Holy book and one God. The mind is so conditioned and rigidly narrowed down to such a notion that
anything else is not acceptable. I understood her perception and concept about faith. You can't compare
Hinduism with any of the present leading religions where you have to believe in one concept of god..

I tried to explain to her: 'You can believe in one god and he can be a Hindu. You may believe in multiple
deities and still you can be a Hindu. What's more - you may not believe in god at all,
still you can be a Hindu. An atheist can also be a Hindu.'

This sounded very crazy to her.. She couldn't imagine a religion so unorganized, still surviving
for thousands of years, even after onslaught from foreign forces.

'I don't understand but it seems very interesting. Are you religious?'
What can I tell to this American girl?

I said: 'I do not go to temple regularly. I do not make any regular rituals. I have learned some of
the rituals in my younger days. I still enjoy doing it sometimes.'

'Enjoy? Are you not afraid of God?'

'God is a friend. No- I am not afraid of God. Nobody has made any compulsions on me to perform these rituals regularly.'

She thought for a while and then asked: 'Have you ever thought of converting to any other religion?'

'Why should I? Even if I challenge some of the rituals and faith in Hinduism, nobody can convert me
from Hinduism. Because, being a Hindu allows me to think independently and objectively,
without conditioning. I remain as a Hindu never by force,but choice.' I told her that Hinduism is not a religion, but a set of
beliefs and practices. It is not a religion like Christianityor Islam because it is not founded by any one person
or does not have an organized controlling body like the Church or the Order, I added.
There is no institution or authority. 'So, you don't believe in God?' she wanted everything in black and white.

'I didn't say that. I do not discard the divine reality. Our scripture, or Sruthis or Smrithis –
Vedas and Upanishads or the Gita - say God might be there or he might not be there.
But we pray to that supreme abstract authority (Para Brahma) that is the creator of this universe.'

'Why can't you believe in one personal God?'

'We have a concept - abstract - not a personal god. The concept or notion of a personal God, hiding behind the clouds of
secrecy, telling us irrational stories through few men whom he sends as messengers, demanding us to worship him or
punish us, does not make sense. I don't think that God is as silly as an autocratic emperor who wants others to respect him
or fear him.' I told her that such notions are just fancies of less educated human imagination and fallacies,
adding that generally ethnic religious practitioners in Hinduism believe in personal gods.
The entry level Hinduism has over-whelming superstitions too.


The philosophical side of Hinduism negates all superstitions.

'Good that you agree God might exist. You told that you pray. What is your prayer then?'

'Loka Samastha Sukino Bhavantu.. Om Shanti, Shanti, Shanti,'

'Funny,' she laughed, 'What does it mean?'

'May all the beings in all the worlds be happy. Peace, Peace, Peace..'

'Hmm ..very interesting. I want to learn more about this religion. It is so democratic, broad-minded and free' she exclaimed.

'The fact is Hinduism is a religion of the individual, for the individual and by the individual with its
roots in the Vedas and the Bhagavad-Gita. It is all about an individual approaching a personal
God in an individual way according to his temperament and inner evolution - it is as simple as that.'

'How does anybody convert to Hinduism?'

'Nobody can convert you to Hinduism, because it is not a religion, but a set of beliefs and practices.
Everything is acceptable in Hinduism because there is no single authority
or organization either to accept it or to reject it or to oppose it on behalf of Hinduism.'

I told her - if you look for meaning in life, don't look for it in religions; don't go from one cult to another or from one guru to the next.

For a real seeker, I told her, the Bible itself gives guidelines when it says ' Kingdom of God is within you.' I reminded
her of Christ's teaching about the love that we have for each other. That is where you can find the meaning of life.

Loving each and every creation of the God is absolute and real. 'Isavasyam idam sarvam' Isam (the God)
is present (inhabits) here everywhere - nothing exists separate from the God, because God is present everywhere.
Respect every living being and non-living things as God. That's what Hinduism teaches you.

Hinduism is referred to as Sanathana Dharma, the eternal faith. It is based on the practice of Dharma, the code of life.
The most important aspect of Hinduism is being truthful to oneself. Hinduism has no monopoly on ideas.-
It is open to all. Hindus believe in one God (not a personal one) expressed in different forms.
For them, God is timeless and formless entity.
Ancestors of today's Hindus believe in eternal truths and cosmic laws and these truths are opened to anyone
who seeks them. But there is a section of Hindus who are either superstitious or turned fanatic to make this
an organized religion like others.. The British coin the word 'Hindu' and considered it as a religion.

I said: 'Religions have become an MLM (multi-level- marketing) industry that has been trying to expand the
market share by conversion. The biggest business in today's world is Spirituality. Hinduism is no exception'

I am a Hindu primarily because it professes Non-violence - 'Ahimsa Paramo Dharma' - Non violence
is the highest duty. I am a Hindu because it doesn't conditions my mind with any faith system.
A man/ woman who change 's his/her birth religion to another religion is a fake and does
not value his/her morals, culture and values in life.

That's an excellent post. *tipped hat*

 

[AR]

you gone nuts.
how creation of god became god himself.
sorry for following lines.
by your logic na-auzbillah god is also present in toilets,urine,semens etc etc.
why you people can't think once before posting



After reading your posts i decided it no more possible for me to argue with you people.if some of have problems with above line simply write edit your post without quoting me and i will edit my post.
at the i only say
FOR YOU YOUR RELIGION FOR ME MY RELIGION.

i think thats the beauty of hinduism..... you may think these things are bad or un holy.... but in the light of hinduism these are too a part of creation of god....
there is nothing you have to edit in your post....

have you ever thought why is cow's urine is sacred and used in ayurveda...

dear its your perception to see things nothing is bad..... hinduism is more wider and more deeper than you can even think of...