1971, a story of fear, loss and hope

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

I've had Pakistani neighbors, Pakistani friends and Pakistani teachers. Some of them are obviously of a different racial makeup. Others, I couldn't tell till they told me they were from Pakistan. There are differences, but we're a lot closer than you think. How could we not be, looking back at history.



Most of the sources I've read never attributed Indian involvement before 1971, till after the migration crisis. What source are you getting this from?

I beg to differ. Pakistanis are VERY different to indians in every way. The vast majority are. I see this everyday here in London UK. Only a small minority are like indians. In all my 35 years, I have never seen an indian/bengali who I have ever felt any connection to or empathy towards whatsoever. Nor do they resemble us.

 

[Centaur]

On a national level people in Pak have moved on.

Few nationalists like me mourn the loss. .
There try to justify and make sense of it to satisfy themselves...

Majority doesn't care.

Reason being... It's been almost 5 decades... Several generations have passed..

Yes but Pakistan concept isn't just that we should stay under the same flag (although I prefer it), we can fulfil it in another way brother.
Bagladesh and Pakistan will be best friend again I hope. An also in Bangladesh no hate for Pakistan except some misunderstanding.
Bangladeshi commoners value Muslim brotherhood a lot specially brother of own root, that share the same martyr blood.
The blood of Pakistan concept was islam and I strongly believe that only such nationality is true, others are just a worst Nazi like propaganda.
I strongly believe like Mr Jinnah that Muslims are separate nation.
Socially we can mix with non Muslim that's not a problem, that's natural.
But in order to for a nation only religion can play the role, no other things as religious views control our life style.
Like a bangladeshi and iranian or Pakistani can marry a Arab Muslim men women and can easily form a family simply because of religion.
No problem will arise.
But if a religious person Mary from another religion this family won't survive because of different life style.
So religion is the key to form a family, and a nation too.
Two nation system is forever, no one can change it. So only Islamic nationalism is true ( Hinduism for Hindus I have no problem), other nationality and patriotism is just deception.

Pakistan concept zindabad.
@DESERT FIGHTER

bangladesh was 56% of our population?????????? Those figures are irrelevant bacause bangladeshis were NEVER really a part of the REAL Pakistani people or race. The conjecture you have spouted is irrelevant in the modern context due to the fact that Pakistan is a safe space for a unique race of people. bangladeshis/indian Muslims have got nothing to do with it.

Hmm I understand now Mr racist. Let's put a full stop here.
Who reject history I have no interest to argue with him/them thanks.

Again I was not talking about west Pakistan.
I was talking about Pakistan movement and West Pakistan's participation was negative. They just finally joined and when pirs were convinced by leaders.

Even Jinnah was not west Pakistani. He is Indian so muhajir


I don't want argument with someone who is racist, love to push words and completely either ignore history or try to make own history . Good luck and good bye.

 

[Max]

So According to you,Bengalis are inferior while Pakistanis like you are much superior. Even Najam Sethi once said to TV channel,how the West Pakistani Polititcans discriminated and mocked the East Pakistanis.

no i didnt said that, i said bengali suffer from inferiority complex.. I dont consider anyone inferior except bharatis

so First understand then quote.

Yeah, elite did all the discrimination, on public level bengali cant even mention a single racial attack on them in west Pakistan aka non bengali territory..

Still 3 million bengali are illegally living in Pakistan..

 

[Centaur]

i said bengali suffer from inferiority complex

Few secular Bengalis who are ashamed of their Muslim parents.
Majority Bengalis are not, thank you.

 

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

Yes but Pakistan concept isn't just that we should stay under the same flag (although I prefer it), we can fulfil it in another way brother.
Bagladesh and Pakistan will be best friend again I hope. An also in Bangladesh no hate for Pakistan except some misunderstanding.
Bangladeshi commoners value Muslim brotherhood a lot specially brother of own root, that share the same martyr blood.
The blood of Pakistan concept was islam and I strongly believe that only such nationality is true, others are just a worst Nazi like propaganda.
I strongly believe like Mr Jinnah that Muslims are separate nation.
Socially we can mix with non Muslim that's not a problem, that's natural.
But in order to for a nation only religion can play the role, no other things as religious views control our life style.
Like a bangladeshi and iranian or Pakistani can marry a Arab Muslim men women and can easily form a family simply because of religion.
No problem will arise.
But if a religious person Mary from another religion this family won't survive because of different life style.
So religion is the key to form a family, and a nation too.
Two nation system is forever, no one can change it. So only Islamic nationalism is true ( Hinduism for Hindus I have no problem), other nationality and patriotism is just deception.

Pakistan concept zindabad.
@DESERT FIGHTER


Hmm I understand now Mr racist. Let's put a full stop here.
Who reject history I have no interest to argue with him/them thanks.

Again I was not talking about west Pakistan.
I was talking about Pakistan movement and West Pakistan's participation was negative. They just finally joined and when pirs were convinced by leaders.

Even Jinnah was not west Pakistani. He is Indian so muhajir


I don't want argument with someone who is racist, love to push words and completely either ignore history or try to make own history . Good luck and good bye.

It's not racism. But reality. bengalis and indians ARE NOT the same race as Pakistanis. That is a fact. Is it also racism to say that Pakistanis are not the same race as Germans?

 

[Centaur]

My dear brother... Indians were directly attacking Pak troops since March of 1970.

In fact people like former Indian COAS VK singh have written biographies on which they boast about Indian soldier's in lungis fighting Pak troops and shouting Joy Bangla slogans to great their own GOC.

Yes brother I agree. But the problem is common folk vowed to ignore the truth, and that's the bitter reality.Indian agents from R&AW was very active and they were hiding in civilian commoners dress lungi.

And common folks don't want to understand that a war can't be won by real lungi gamcha force ( mukti bahini traitors) with 45 days guerrilla training.
Still even after 26 March Pakistan was surviving, muktis and their master R&AW (both were using lungi uniform) even failed to hold a single village before India suddenly directly attacked Pakistan (both side) with brute force
India had long time preparation and Pakistan govt failed to realized that.
Yahyha should take military action long before 26 March and also needed to fortify the East Pakistan atleast since 1 year before.
But sadly Pakistan failed to fortify East Pakistan. And the disaster happened. so if he did India must be defeated like 1965 war where Bengalis had vital roles in army.
If east was fortified, India would not win even in a full scale war, and history was not isolated and here we would be discussing as peoples of a same country (named Pakistan) instead of different. . what a disaster because of brainless power hungry political leaders.
@DESERT FIGHTER

 

[Homo Sapiens]

In spite of the overwhelming Hindu majority, Hindus were severely under-represented in government, police and the military. Of 1765 officers in the State Army, 1268 were Muslims, 421 were Hindus, and 121 others were Christians, Parsis and Sikhs. Of the officials drawing a salary between Rs.600–1200 per month, 59 were Muslims, 5 were Hindus and 38 were of other religions. The Nizam and his nobles, who were mostly Muslims, owned 40% of the total land in the state

It was a medieval kingdom ruled by the medieval set of norms.What do you expect? Muslim rulers there set up administrative and economic structure in a way which will ensure the dominance of minority muslim rules.It was not a democracy,it can't be.Otherwise there will be no Nizam.Very much typical of how any medieval kingdom operated.This type of sectarian distribution of wealth and power was also present in non-muslim ruled but Muslim majority states,such as Kashmir.So Nizam was no more evil than his peers.It was the legacy he inherited,many of which are not compatible with the notion of universal equality and not acceptable.

 

[Mage]

Yes but Pakistan concept isn't just that we should stay under the same flag (although I prefer it), we can fulfil it in another way brother.
Bagladesh and Pakistan will be best friend again I hope. An also in Bangladesh no hate for Pakistan except some misunderstanding.
Bangladeshi commoners value Muslim brotherhood a lot specially brother of own root, that share the same martyr blood.
The blood of Pakistan concept was islam and I strongly believe that only such nationality is true, others are just a worst Nazi like propaganda.
I strongly believe like Mr Jinnah that Muslims are separate nation.
Socially we can mix with non Muslim that's not a problem, that's natural.
But in order to for a nation only religion can play the role, no other things as religious views control our life style.
Like a bangladeshi and iranian or Pakistani can marry a Arab Muslim men women and can easily form a family simply because of religion.
No problem will arise.
But if a religious person Mary from another religion this family won't survive because of different life style.
So religion is the key to form a family, and a nation too.
Two nation system is forever, no one can change it. So only Islamic nationalism is true ( Hinduism for Hindus I have no problem), other nationality and patriotism is just deception.

Pakistan concept zindabad.
@DESERT FIGHTER


Hmm I understand now Mr racist. Let's put a full stop here.
Who reject history I have no interest to argue with him/them thanks.

Again I was not talking about west Pakistan.
I was talking about Pakistan movement and West Pakistan's participation was negative. They just finally joined and when pirs were convinced by leaders.

Even Jinnah was not west Pakistani. He is Indian so muhajir

Oh boy.....if religion is the only basis to form a country then ask your oil rich Arab brothers to merge their rich countries with our poor countries.

Muslim ummah concept is a farce. Your Pakistani brothers don't consider you as brothers. They see you as dark skinned, short inferior Bengalis. Your Arab brothers see you as kaala labourers. It seems only you are interested to be brothers to every Muslims while they don't seem to be willing to accept you as brothers.

 

[Centaur]

Oh boy.....if religion is the only basis to form a country then ask your oil rich Arab brothers to merge their rich countries with our poor countries.

After the age of caliphate Muslims became scattered sheep without shephard.
Oil rich Arabians are waahabi. They fought against ottoman caliphate as puppets of enemies,made ottoman empire weak and then captured Arabia.
So current nationalism outside religion are just a propaganda of enemy and deception too propogate enemy imperial powers and their side kick wahabis. However not talking about softer version called salafi.
I was born and raise in a salafi/ahlehadeed family too but no reason to hate them. Even though they are takifiri batalion who love to takifir to other Muslim.
And I was talking about caliphate right? Don't even think that real caliphate is like AL qayeda or isis type hypocrites. first one was propagated by wahabism and another one ( ISIS) is zinonist product.
Real Islamic caliphate is total opposite.

Islamic caliphate should be safest place for common folks; both Muslim and non Muslim .

Like during inquisition Jewish peoples fled and lived a honorable and prosperous life under a Muslim caliph who follow the Islamic law.

http://www.aish.com/jl/h/cc/48951681.html?mobile=yes

 

[Mage]

After the age of caliphate Muslims became scattered sheep without shephard.
Oil rich Arabians are waahabi. They fought against ottoman caliphate as puppets of enemies,made ottoman empire weak and then captured Arabia.
So current nationalism outside religion are just a propaganda of enemy and deception too propogate enemy imperial powers and their side kick wahabis. However not talking about softer version called salafi.
I was born and raise in a salafi/ahlehadeed family too but no reason to hate them. Even though they are takifiri batalion who love to takifir to other Muslim.
And I was talking about caliphate right? Don't even think that real caliphate is like AL qayeda or isis type hypocritesz first one was propagated by wahabism and another is zinonist product.
Real Islamic caliphate is total opposite.

Caliphate should be a safe peoples for common folks doest matter what's their religion. Like during inquisition Jewish peoples fled and lived a honorary and prosperous life under a Muslim caliph who follow the Islamic law.

http://www.aish.com/jl/h/cc/48951681.html?mobile=yes

We have to live in our time. We can't go back and live in 7th century or go forward and live in 25th century. We live in 21st century. And there is no caliphate for us. There is one Bangladesh which we(Bangladeshis) can call home. So we better do our part for that him instead of dreaming of past and future caliphates. However if you want a Islamic caliphate right now perhaps you could migrate to Mosul or Raqqa.

 

[Centaur]

We have to live in our time. We can't go back and live in 7th century or go forward and live in 25th century. We live in 21st century. And there is no caliphate for us. There is one Bangladesh which we(Bangladeshis) can call home. So we better do our part for that him instead of dreaming of past and future caliphates. However if you want a Islamic caliphate right now perhaps you could migrate to Mosul or Raqqa.

I am not trying to go back to 7th century. Ottoman caliphate isn't the product of seventh century. It existed even 90 years ago.
I am not also against Bangladesh, I just want Bangladesh to be more Islamic ( not wahabism though) and that's all. And I already said that isis is actually zionist product, and it has no relation with islam. thank you.

 

[countryman]

@Jacksparrow47 I've read your comment - though my interactions with general public of BD has quite an opposite understanding - I wish I could talk about but we don't need to. But I would particularly object your following statement:

also you were taught by Pakistani (west Pakistan for me, because Pakistan is a bigger concept) govt

No! Our government or education system doesn't teach the hate you're referring to. There is hardly any dedicated section for BD except a couple of pages devoted for 1971 war with India (even that section generally discusses Indian propaganda and our weakness) at school level and trust me our students don't even bother to remember any of that at all. Also, at higher education history is optional.

Several years ago, I was literally left crying in my heart when I first interacted with someone from BD. Here I was thinking of a lost brother or a detached limb and he just started spitting all the venom he had for Pakistan just like venomous snake. History wasn't my discipline; I didn't knew much about BD except it was once the part of Pakistan was detached by India but after talking to him I wanted to know the exact truth. I was searching why Pak army would things they blame but along with answers I found the immense of lies and some other bitter realities as well.

Today, I don't care about this and I know what to except because I think I've found the truth I was looking. Even I can understand why people keep pumping up the false propaganda and hatred for Pakistan. That's simply the founding stone or brick upon which BD's whole nationalism is build and if you remove that brick your whole nationalism will fall and you'll be like people with no ideology and nation. That is national agenda of BD - to keep your nationalism alive you must pump that hatred as hard as you can. We all make choices - they made choice for themselves. I'm not a person would hate you for not being the part of Pakistan. Though, we didn't forget the event to make sure our enemy isn't able to sting us in same fashion again but largely, by sentiment, we moved on.

By talking here - all I just want we never find ourselves on cross road - we parted our ways long ago. Let's live our lives. Hatred only gives birth to hatred and there are good and bad people everywhere and I wouldn't want to disrespect or hurt any good people disregarding where they're. I would want to remain neutral instead of giving myself to hatred and I recommend my fellow nationals the same.

 

[Mage]

I am not trying to go back to 7th century. Ottoman caliphate isn't the product of seventh century. It existed even 90 years ago.
I am not also against Bangladesh, I just want Bangladesh to be more Islamic ( not wahabism though) and that's all. And I already said that isis is actually zionist product, and it has no relation with islam. thank you.

Ottoman empire has nothing to do with us or our history. Same with other caliphates. Rather Pala Empire, Bengal Sultanate, Mughal rule, British rule and Pak rule are our history. So lets not feel connected to them(Arabs and Turks, the Caliphates) when they themselves don't feel connected to us. If being more Islamic is being more developed than I have no problem BD going that way. Although it seems the opposite. 7-8 centuries ago Islam was a uniting force. It put aside sectarianism and focused on education and Muslim ruled areas prospered. But what do we see today? First word of Quran that came to prophet was "Ikra" means study...yet mullahs today oppose education. Muslims fight each other in the name of Islam itself.

 

[Centaur]

@Jacksparrow47 I've read your comment - though my interactions with general public of BD has quite an opposite understanding - I wish I could talk about but we don't need to. But I would particularly object your following statement:

No! Our government or education system doesn't teach the hate you're referring to.

There is hardly any dedicated section for BD except a couple of pages devoted for 1971 war with India (even that section generally discusses Indian propaganda and our weakness) at school level and trust me our students don't even bother to remember any of that at all. Also, at higher education history is optional.

well I will be very happy if my statement is wrong, I should have add a word before .
So if really no propaganda of Bengali hating in Pakistan is alive then it's a great think honestly speaking .I am really glad to know that Pakistan govt don't tecah hatred . unfortunately Bangladesh govt is doing it severly since decades .

Several years ago, I was literally left crying in my heart when I first interacted with someone from BD. Here I was thinking of a lost brother or a detached limb and he just started spitting all the venom he had for Pakistan just like venomous snake. History wasn't my discipline; I didn't knew much about BD except it was once the part of Pakistan was detached by India but after talking to him I wanted to know the exact truth. I was searching why Pak army would things they blame but along with answers I found the immense of lies and some other bitter realities as well.

Where did you need this Bengali? In Western countries ? Well I said we have small percentage of bastards who existed since 1947 who wanted to be a part of India .they were 3-4% in Bengali muslims.

Their successors are still alive and spitting venom to Pakistan . actually it's their job to serve hindutva..common Bengali muslims are totally different.
They can't even speak their good feelings toward Pakistan as current govt is acting hostile . Not because awami league is anti Pakistani ,but because they failed to create any good political support since mujib died .
BNP got the vote of Muslim league although they are no match for Muslim league.just using the support from commoners in order to fill their bank account.here common folks truly are victim.
And since awami league govt is backed by armed forces as democracy is obsolete here. So awami league has no other option but to over react on Pakistan issue .
And exactly the haters taking the chance More than anytime.so please don't judge bangladeshi manirity population because of some poisonous snakes.
And some others are just victim as once I was too.
I thank to Allah that he opened my eyes long ago.
So I also hope that may Allah open eyes of others who are really just victims of the propaganda of the snakes.if Allah can help me he can help others too.
.

Today, I don't care about this and I know what to except because I think I've found the truth I was looking. Even I can understand why people keep pumping up the false propaganda and hatred for Pakistan. That's simply the founding stone or brick upon which BD's whole nationalism is build and if you remove that brick your whole nationalism will fall and you'll be like people with no ideology and nation. That is national agenda of BD - to keep your nationalism alive you must pump that hatred as hard as you can. We all make choices - they made choice for themselves. I'm not a person would hate you for not being the part of Pakistan. Though, we didn't forget the event to make sure our enemy isn't able to sting us in same fashion again but largely, by sentiment, we moved on.

By talking here - all I just want we never find ourselves on cross road - we parted our ways long ago. Let's live our lives. Hatred only gives birth to hatred and there are good and bad people everywhere and I wouldn't want to disrespect or hurt any good people disregarding where they're. I would want to remain neutral instead of giving myself to hatred and I recommend my fellow nationals the same.

Yes what is done can't be undone I know .I just want that there no fasle hatred between two Muslim country exist, and specially between the who was born in same time , and same blood.

@countryman

 

[Mage]

@Jacksparrow47 I've read your comment - though my interactions with general public of BD has quite an opposite understanding - I wish I could talk about but we don't need to. But I would particularly object your following statement:

No! Our government or education system doesn't teach the hate you're referring to. There is hardly any dedicated section for BD except a couple of pages devoted for 1971 war with India (even that section generally discusses Indian propaganda and our weakness) at school level and trust me our students don't even bother to remember any of that at all. Also, at higher education history is optional.

Several years ago, I was literally left crying in my heart when I first interacted with someone from BD. Here I was thinking of a lost brother or a detached limb and he just started spitting all the venom he had for Pakistan just like venomous snake. History wasn't my discipline; I didn't knew much about BD except it was once the part of Pakistan was detached by India but after talking to him I wanted to know the exact truth. I was searching why Pak army would things they blame but along with answers I found the immense of lies and some other bitter realities as well.

Today, I don't care about this and I know what to except because I think I've found the truth I was looking. Even I can understand why people keep pumping up the false propaganda and hatred for Pakistan. That's simply the founding stone or brick upon which BD's whole nationalism is build and if you remove that brick your whole nationalism will fall and you'll be like people with no ideology and nation. That is national agenda of BD - to keep your nationalism alive you must pump that hatred as hard as you can. We all make choices - they made choice for themselves. I'm not a person would hate you for not being the part of Pakistan. Though, we didn't forget the event to make sure our enemy isn't able to sting us in same fashion again but largely, by sentiment, we moved on.

By talking here - all I just want we never find ourselves on cross road - we parted our ways long ago. Let's live our lives. Hatred only gives birth to hatred and there are good and bad people everywhere and I wouldn't want to disrespect or hurt any good people disregarding where they're. I would want to remain neutral instead of giving myself to hatred and I recommend my fellow nationals the same.

Our education system don't teach us to hate Pakistan either. We are taught about the discrimination against Bengalis from 1947-71. 6 point of Mujib, how he wasn't allowed to form govt despite winning election fair and square and about the war. All of them are valid points. No where it tells us to hate Pakistan and Pakistanis.