Z-10 or T-129 Atak or AH-1Z for the Pakistan Army?

[Bilal.]

nope they have a CM of their own: SOM (missile) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

and about WZ-10, maybe China isnt ready to transfer the tech of its front line attack helicopter, meanwhile the turkish one is based on A129, so not much problems there

Not only they have demonstrated independent development of cruise missile via SOM project but IIRC they have an active program to develop a 2500 km ranged one, if they lacked technology to do so they wouldn't have had such a program in active state.

 

[RAMPAGE]

How is T-129 weapons package better than WZ-10? And engine would matter, since it would allow WZ-10 to carry 16 Hellfire class AKD-10 while having better armour protection and performance. As for avionics/sensor/EW again WZ-10 is at par.

Not to mention the lower RCS due to Radar-absorbent paints !!!!

and then the biggest factor to consider WZ-10.

This baby is Damn sexier than T-129 !!!

 

[DANGER-ZONE]

T-129 > WZ-10.

It carries a better weapons package on top of a state of the art sensor/avionics suite.

But the question is who will give the damn weapons to Pakistan ! I am sure you are counting EU or US made weapons like Hellfire. I don't see any of the western weapon except the TURKISH ones, arming PAK T-129. So whats the benefit of getting T-129. Even the non turkish made Equipment and Avionics of T-129 will come with strings attached.

 

[Kompromat]

@DANGER-ZONE

Checkout UMTAS and Cirit.

 

[S.Y.A]

Not only they have demonstrated independent development of cruise missile via SOM project but IIRC they have an active program to develop a 2500 km ranged one, if they lacked technology to do so they wouldn't have had such a program in active state.

they have the money, the main part is that. otherwise we too had tomahawks to copy from but our CMs still far from reaching their full potential because of less funds available.

 

[Bilal.]

they have the money, the main part is that. otherwise we too had tomahawks to copy from but our CMs still far from reaching their full potential because of less funds available.

Lots of project that made it to media in the good days of our economy have disappeared, among them 1000km Babur-II which was supposed to be ready in a couple of years after 2005 test.

 

[Neptune]

Not to mention the lower RCS due to Radar-absorbent paints !!!!

and then the biggest factor to consider WZ-10.

This baby is Damn sexier than T-129 !!!

Unfortunately dear, gunships are supposed to be deadlier rather than looking "sexy".

T-129 A&B variants already come with a RCS lower than WZ-10. In fact, the C variant is even more stealthy and lower radar crossed when compared to the A&B models, to be used for cross-border ops.&spec. ops.

 

[Soldier-X]

YUP, WE SHOULD GO FOR T-129 FROM TURKEY

 

[araz]

I thought the T129 is the one that is in development, I mean actual development as in only has prototypes? Not that the WZ isn't still needing work, but it is out now and being mass produced.

The magusta on which the 129 is based is an established workhorse. So even though the turks will apply their own avionics to it it comes from good pedigree. This is what has resulted in the PA interest.

 

[araz]

Sir Gi what about the EW suite, don't you think that it's superior to T-129's ???

besides we have experience with BM/KG300G jamming pod !!!!!

Armament aside, which Gunship do you think has better avionics and Airframe ?????

Bhai.
The engine was and continues to be a problem. It is untried and therefore you cannot risk it with a commitment of a billion dollars plus. Nothing would have pleased us and PA more if it was really ready. The fact that it us not even in PAs reckoning is a significant pointer.The tech that we are going for would help in establishing a foundations of heli building and maintenance which would prove to be a sound start. You cant base it on a maybe.I hope you understand where Iam coming from.
Araz

 

[-SINAN-]

Exactly, there are 6 odd "prototypes" of T-129 where as 60 odd active duty WZ-10s.

There is currently 7 T-129 joined into TAF inventory.

Source:

And more to come....

We have Simulator for T-129 shown in IDEF-2013 and As far as i know, Atak is the only attack helikopter that can switch the role of gunner and pilot, great for training purposes.

T-129 also comes with CİRİT and UMTAŞ missiles.

Cirit can fire behind obstacles, hills , etc without being seen and it's the only 2,75” Laser Guided Missile for attack helicopters in the world.

UMTAŞ, equivalent of hellfire

 

[Bilal.]

WZ-10 has AKD-10 which is hellfire equavalent:

http://m.youtube.com/index?&desktop_uri=/#/watch?v=9CMsTtuhcuc&feature=related

Moreover, once it's powered by WZ-16 turboshaft, it will be able to carry 16 of them.

Cirit is nice but unlike apkws it is only loaded in dual or quad launchers as far as I have seen, probably due to the effect of rocket exhaust on delicate seeker head(apkws has pop out seekers on fins for this very reason) because of which it cannot be loaded in densely packed launchers, due to this it doesn't add much firepower.

 

[Bilal.]

Interview of chief designer WZ-10:

http://m.youtube.com/index?&desktop_uri=/#/watch?feature=related&v=vgyEL12821A

 

[nomi007]

purpose of discussion is not to criticize the Govt.
but i appreciate the govt dicission to import of helicopter
but there is miss understanding b/w arm forces and govt as always
like
COAS requested russian delegation 2 months earlier for mi-24
many experts suggested Chinese equipments
but govt is chooses other
why Chinese wz-10 is better because

• low price
• good record of china to deliver equipments on time
• no fear of sanctions specially war time
• modification by our own need in future
• in future we can also join Chinese in medium role helicopter program

 

[-SINAN-]

WZ-10 has AKD-10 which is hellfire equavalent:

http://m.youtube.com/index?&desktop_uri=/#/watch?v=9CMsTtuhcuc&feature=related

Moreover, once it's powered by WZ-16 turboshaft, it will be able to carry 16 of them.

Cirit is nice but unlike apkws it is only loaded in dual or quad launchers as far as I have seen, probably due to the effect of rocket exhaust on delicate seeker head(apkws has pop out seekers on fins for this very reason) because of which it cannot be loaded in densely packed launchers, due to this it doesn't add much firepower.

If i don't remember wrong (feel free to correct me) , the pod on the far left is the new launcher for the Cirit. Which houses 12 cirit on one pod.

T129B version will be loaded with 8 UMTAS, 12 CIRIT and 2 AIM-92 Stinger missiles.

Which makes it a multi-role heli. I don't know much about the WZ-10 but with the configuration you provided it fills the tank-hunter role which will be useless against asymmetric warfare ( aka: taliban)

Source: https://www.tai.com.tr/en/project/atak