Will rafale and s400 completely tilt balance

[The Maverick]

Guys at present my guess is at best Indian air power is marginally superior by a max 2 to 1
Ie India has around 400 4th gen fighters against paf 200 thunders and f16.
Paf has more awacs India better Sam's ie s300 and spider
My question is that $14 billion has been spent on 36 rafales and 5 regiments ofs400 long range Sam cover. Both systems arrive pretty much as we speak ie rafale next month onwards and s400 from January 2021.
To date the paf have answered this by ordering 50 block 3 and more awacs.
Simply is this keeping the ratio the same or have the Indians taken a decisive lead which needs to reduced by another new addition to paf and what does it need to be ie Sam or fighter

 

[Trango Towers]

Guys at present my guess is at best Indian air power is marginally superior by a max 2 to 1
Ie India has around 400 4th gen fighters against paf 200 thunders and f16.
Paf has more awacs India better Sam's ie s300 and spider
My question is that $14 billion has been spent on 36 rafales and 5 regiments ofs400 long range Sam cover. Both systems arrive pretty much as we speak ie rafale next month onwards and s400 from January 2021.
To date the paf have answered this by ordering 50 block 3 and more awacs.
Simply is this keeping the ratio the same or have the Indians taken a decisive lead which needs to reduced by another new addition to paf and what does it need to be ie Sam or fighter

Always remember in the history of warfare it's not the one with the biggest armies and more weapons that wins. It's always the one with the best tactic training disciple and the win to fight hard that wins...now look at the mighty indian army and airforce how it was humiliated on feb27 2019. How panic spread through its ranks. Pakistan even knew where its military head was and gave himachal wake up call. So if you give a ordinary man in the street the best football boots does he become messi or Ronaldo or Pele?

 

[Zapper]

Guys at present my guess is at best Indian air power is marginally superior by a max 2 to 1
Ie India has around 400 4th gen fighters against paf 200 thunders and f16.
Paf has more awacs India better Sam's ie s300 and spider
My question is that $14 billion has been spent on 36 rafales and 5 regiments ofs400 long range Sam cover. Both systems arrive pretty much as we speak ie rafale next month onwards and s400 from January 2021.
To date the paf have answered this by ordering 50 block 3 and more awacs.
Simply is this keeping the ratio the same or have the Indians taken a decisive lead which needs to reduced by another new addition to paf and what does it need to be ie Sam or fighter

With the number of retiring aircrafts, 36 Rafales though a potent addition aren't really a game changer. We need to quicken the pace of LCA's production along with MWF's development and quickly bringing it upto IOC phase by 2025

 

[Mighty Lion]

Yes

 

[The Maverick]

With the number of retiring aircrafts, 36 Rafales though a potent addition aren't really a game changer. We need to quicken the pace of LCA's production along with MWF's development and quickly bringing it upto IOC phase by 2025

The numbers are due to.go up.vis tejas.thats what this project is about replacing mig27 and mig21 low end of the air force with a Indian built cost effective 4th generation fighter

The two purchases I mention are on paper world class force multipliers both hyper expensive.

Rafale is silver bullet and the best 4th generation fighter on.the planet arguably

The s400 a long and meduim.range defends designed to tackle fifth gen fighters and ballistic missles

There impact could be huge
It's impact on Indian finances is a whopping 14 billion dollars

Did it create a bigger decisive gap or not and the thread is to understand what the Pakistanis think the paf needs to do if anything to reduce the gap or do they think the thunders block 3 and more awacs is perfect solution to keep status quo and balance

 

[Fighting Falcon 01]

Guys at present my guess is at best Indian air power is marginally superior by a max 2 to 1
Ie India has around 400 4th gen fighters against paf 200 thunders and f16.
Paf has more awacs India better Sam's ie s300 and spider
My question is that $14 billion has been spent on 36 rafales and 5 regiments ofs400 long range Sam cover. Both systems arrive pretty much as we speak ie rafale next month onwards and s400 from January 2021.
To date the paf have answered this by ordering 50 block 3 and more awacs.
Simply is this keeping the ratio the same or have the Indians taken a decisive lead which needs to reduced by another new addition to paf and what does it need to be ie Sam or fighter

India never had a decisive edge even when they purchased s 300 and mirage 2000s PAF surely lacks cash but always makes decisions that keeps them in the game
To counter Rafael:
50 plus block 3s armed with PL 15s will be used which can engage Rafael and su 30s from 150 to 170 km the 27th feb episode will be repeated when su 30s could not shoot because their missile range was less as compared to AIM 120C5s now the question arises what can IAF do to counter this threat??
More awacs were purchased so that we can keep eyes on Rafael and ensure that all sectors are being watched better situational awareness is key in modern air warfare
Just PL 15 has made su 30s mig 29s and mirage 2000s useless because the BVRAAMS are inferior to PL 15s

And about S400
PAF simply needs good intelligence so that we can target them with RAAD ALCM with range of 550km raad is a terrain hugger so detection will not be easy I doubt India will deploy s400 near the border where we can take it out so the bottom line is no system is invincible it is the professionalism and training of pilots and ground crews which makes the difference

 

[The Maverick]

So fighting falcon
In your eyes there is no change to gap despite Indian huge investment because paf once again have found solution at a fraction of the cost.

Rafale will.not enhance India enough and s400 is nullified because you already have missles to knock these out .

Am I reading this right

 

[Fighting Falcon 01]

So fighting falcon
In your eyes there is no change to gap despite Indian huge investment because paf once again have found solution at a fraction of the cost.

Rafale will.not enhance India enough and s400 is nullified because you already have missles to knock these out .

Am I reading this right

I am not claiming that both these systems are useless both of them are very capable no doubt but we are not Bangladesh or Somalia we have already taken steps in the right direction to counter these systems we have more awacs than india and on 27th we effectively used a large strike package to beat one of the largest airforce in the world where were 272 su 30s that day where was s300?? Instead you guys killed your own men with that SAM now coming back to topic Do you think S400 is unbeatable??? And Rafael cannot be countered are you implying it is unbeatable??

 

[Foxtrot Delta]

We can balance $400 out with HQ-9C or HQ-21.
& rafale with Block III JF-17 even block 4 with stealth coatings. And Project AZM with PL-15 and PL-XX.

Later on TAI TF-X will also join

 

[airomerix]

So many Indians patting their backs. Mesmerizing.

 

[The Maverick]

To be fair the pl15 will be a headache but we don't know how many and how

I am not claiming that both these systems are useless both of them are very capable no doubt but we are not Bangladesh or Somalia we have already taken steps in the right direction to counter these systems we have more awacs than india and on 27th we effectively used a large strike package to beat one of the largest airforce in the world where were 272 su 30s that day where was s300?? Instead you guys killed your own men with that SAM now coming back to topic Do you think S400 is unbeatable??? And Rafael cannot be countered are you implying it is unbeatable??

In answer Falcon= From a USA air force intelligence officer
https://sofrep.com/fightersweep/how-scary-is-the-russian-s-400-sam-system/

Its scray enough for Fifth Gen fighters what it was intended to defend against. I THINK against Thunders and F16 MLU /52 it will be very very potent ...…. most probably

As For Rafale

True Force multipler instead facing mix of bisons mig29 & mki
PAF will face mki mig29 & the force multiplier Rafale

its a whole new dimension against the Thunder/F16

which is why I asked DO YOU NEED more OR have you ALREADY responded

 

[Muhammad Omar]

We can balance $400 out with HQ-9C or HQ-21.
& rafale with Block III JF-17 even block 4 with stealth coatings. And Project AZM with PL-15 and PL-XX.

Later on TAI TF-X will also join

There's no such thing as JF-17 Block 4 cause the Block 3 is not even final yet and we just saw 1 prototype.

JF-17 Block 3 isn't sufficient to counter Rafales and Block 3 is answer to every threat.

TAI TFX is a long story India is inducting Rafales now and TAI TFX is not gonna happen before 2030-35

 

[The Maverick]

We can balance $400 out with HQ-9C or HQ-21.
& rafale with Block III JF-17 even block 4 with stealth coatings. And Project AZM with PL-15 and PL-XX.

Later on TAI TF-X will also join

Realistcally
Your block 4 AZM is just concepts

The Rafale /s400 is now NOT what you may have in 2040
PL15 is now I agree.

in which case FALCON answered this in realistic terms and that is

your answer is Rafale /S400 = Thunder BLOCK 3 with PL15 & more numbers of AWACS.

AIROMIX = NO ONES patting anyone . These additions are seriously costly and by global standards wordld class additions

Turkey almost lost USA OVER its S400 purchase

I think its worth asking what if more PAF can do now upto 2025 to counter it.

eg.

imo F16/70 x 18 planes is what I would ask for why . Even this would cost $2.5 billion with weapons .

ITS the same ;level as rafale way ahead of your legacy and 52 block falcons
you know the plane well
And is here and ready not some distant project like AZM which may never happen

 

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

S-400 can be neutralized by large numbers of advanced cruise missiles or micro swarm drones armed with munitions:

https://www.rand.org/blog/2020/05/russian-s-400-surface-to-air-missile-system-is-it-worth.html

 

[Foxtrot Delta]

Realistcally
Your block 4 AZM is just concepts

The Rafale /s400 is now NOT what you may have in 2040
PL15 is now I agree.

in which case FALCON answered this in realistic terms and that is

your answer is Rafale /S400 = Thunder BLOCK 3 with PL15 & more numbers of AWACS.

AIROMIX = NO ONES patting anyone . These additions are seriously costly and by global standards wordld class additions

Turkey almost lost USA OVER its S400 purchase

I think its worth asking what if more PAF can do now upto 2025 to counter it.

eg.

imo F16/70 x 18 planes is what I would ask for why . Even this would cost $2.5 billion with weapons .

ITS the same ;level as rafale way ahead of your legacy and 52 block falcons
you know the plane well
And is here and ready not some distant project like AZM which may never happen

You misunderstood my post read it once again.