Wanted: a strong liberal voice

[HAIDER]

please redefine Liberalism in this era ?. ...Liberalism in Muslim world always exist in every century and different shapes ..

 

[Multani]

This is NOT what I am looking for. These are funding for NGOs.. this is no PROOF that they are involved with certain anti-state activities. There is ample proof that seminaries and all these zakat collecting organizations are involved in breeding ignorant and barbaric terrorists who are a stain on Islam.
Islamic charities and the ‘War on Terror’ dispelling the myths - Humanitarian Practice Network
CIA Report on NGOs With Terror Links - Wikisource, the free online library
http://www.econstor.eu/bitstream/10419/84554/1/DIIS2006-07.pdf

Terrorism, murder, killing cannot be equated with NGO's.

To judge the work of the NGO's and their funding, we need to use Usool of Deen and see whether their work is detrimental to Islamic values in the country or not. This is the concern of muslim circles in Pakistan, so that is how it should be addressed.

Yes but if the person is a liar and what makes you wrong is being paid puppet of USA and kufr like most liberals and specially NGOS are and betraying Pakistan and Islam

What you are talking about is the rhetoric used on the street by the common Pakistani. What other members on these forums are worried about is terrorism, killing, and murder by designed human devils called TTP.

These are two separate, incomparable issues.

Secualrists are taking funds from kufr are busy in bashing Islam and Pakistan but when trouble hits weather you like it or not its religious organisations who are helping poor people weather its Jamat ud Dawa or JI Khidmat foundation or great Edhi these USA funded secular pets run away

This is true. But I believe it has been repeated a gazillion times on PDF before.

Mullahs have always been taking funds from Kufr and they sell their "Imaan" very cheap ... This is a "undeniable" fact ...

Regarding Abdul Sattar Edhi , here is what he believes :

“I am Muslim but I am a Humanitarian above all, because the basic principles of all religions are rooted in humanity"

He said he is Muslim first. Show the quote in Urdu too.

A Muslim is a Humanitarian by DEFAULT. That is the BASIC Islamic belief, that western liberals and perennialists seem to get loose on.

This is proof of their ignorance of Islam.

 

[Multani]

Very few Mullahs have taken funds but all seculars and NGOs guys take funds from kufr and sell their Iman

It is part of Iman to stop those human devils called TTP.

ALOT of mulla's do. Your beloved Jamat-i-Islami submitted applications to USAID to give them funds to open a TV Channel. Hahha I am not making this up. The hypocrisy, the sheer audacity with which the maulvis display is mind numbing. Hum karein to chalo theek hai, Islam ka nara to nahin lagate na. Woh bc kis dozakh main jalenge Allah ji janay. Kamaskam meri wali se zada tez ho

Yes, it is a fact that the Jamat e Islami organization in North America [ under the banner of ISNA/ICNA ] is well funded, promoted, and manipulated by U-S funding

Look at all their big mosques in North America.

 

[Dubious]

The numbers hasnt increased, it has more or less plateaued. Even reduced if you look at figures i have.



Such is the nature of people sure, but my point and my irritation is when someone proposes violent Islam/Sharia as the end all be all they themselves are the biggest hypocrites. These maulvi types ki filain hain mere paas. These vile beings would eyeball all the party "girls" and drink and for the public they will be momineen ke amir. Countless are the same. Badmouth Ameeca pichli pocket main paisa bhi amreeca ka lete hain. Their kids go to US, i know of a maulvi of JI whose kid drives a benzo, E class brand new. College going kid, now a sophomore. Makkar, munafiq log.

If I do it, atleast i dont sully my religions name along with it. They do and that boils my blood no matter how pakka i am on my highway to hell



It's one thing to leave for US for a better life yet you wanna drag the same things that you ran away from?

Oh i lived in San Fran. I have an idea of jahil arbeez ( Muslims ). Yaar itna hi shauq tha amreeca jaane ka to ab haya shaya yaad agayee. Apnee baree main to gfs but aurton ke mamlay main qaidi bana do. This gutter soch is unfortunately seen in maulvi types (mostly). Brooklyn is not a nice place, me no going there no more. It's mostly a low cost neighborhood and you know the type that it pulls.


Agar pardhay likhay is type k hain then there is no solution but brutality with them. Pyar main to woh apke pet main churi daldenge aur ihsaas bhi nahin hone denge. Unfortunately the ills we go through in Pak, Sharia cant eradicate it. My solution is genocide. Plain and simple. Well nobody's gonna agree with it.


When a leader says that TTP are not terrorists but brothers, tell me what do the parents, families, sisters, wives, husbands, kids feel who lost their loved one in terror attacks. I mean IK has lost a lot of support from the youth by his childish immature political antics. He should learn from Nooras the politics.



Point is drones have collateral because terrorists live with their families knowing full well they are putting them in danger. So when "innocent" ( not really if they associate with scum ) die they make all the hue and cry. The problem is the average Pakistani still thinks TTP is right and the rest are wrong. I wish them all nothing but drones. But Allah unko zaleel kar raha hai, i am just watching the show. Shitty leaders, the jhoot that everyone says in everything, the helplessness, worse security situation and the zillat that they face anywhere in the world.

You realize an army operation achieves less results, costs infinitely more, no issue of IDPs ( which range in 3 to 4 million ), less blow back and negligible loss of life compared to drones. Drones have put fear in the hearts of terrorists. And i support drones. Unfortunately collateral damage is part of the 21st century warfare. So a civilian casualties are gonna happen like it or not.

I am sorry to say it is this insenstivity towards life which I loathe! It has caused nothing but pain...Maybe many of you can still watch the news I stopped after America invaded Afghan and then followed by Iraq...
I stopped when I saw Pakistan sink into disaster 1 crap hitting it after another...from floods to no electricity to stupid rulers on every level
I stopped when I went there and saw the state...People still breathing bad mouthing everything and everyone they can and not realizing they need to get up...No news agency can slap them awake unless they wish to wake up!

 

[Multani]

So by that means Turkey is a traitor, Azerbaijan as well , so are all the Central Asian states , Tunisia as well , Egypt soon to be and others are following the trend. Indonesia is one too then. Damn so many Kafirs , right?
So what do we do , slay them right ?

Never hated the word "MR" before so much!

Wait. For fairness, he is using the words "traitor" and "kufr", I havn't seen him calling muslims kafir in this thread. And neither has he asked them to be slayed.

 

[M. Sarmad]

He said he is Muslim first. Show the quote in Urdu too.
A Muslim is a Humanitarian by DEFAULT. That is the BASIC Islamic belief, that western liberals and perennialists seem to get loose on.
This is proof of their ignorance of Islam.

And Now Madrassah bred morons will tell us what is Islam ..... !!!

 

[Multani]

So you must be the bearded caveman terrorist hiding under some rock in Waziristan, using the internet created by infidels to shower us with your hypocrisy. Tsk Tsk...

Picture Courtesy: Pakistan Votes (can be found on Facebook)

Canadian Pakistanis are not like you

 

[Informant]

I am sorry to say it is this insenstivity towards life which I loathe! It has caused nothing but pain...Maybe many of you can still watch the news I stopped after America invaded Afghan and then followed by Iraq...
I stopped when I saw Pakistan sink into disaster 1 crap hitting it after another...from floods to no electricity to stupid rulers on every level
I stopped when I went there and saw the state...People still breathing bad mouthing everything and everyone they can and not realizing they need to get up...No news agency can slap them awake unless they wish to wake up!

We dont have the luxury to cry for everyone, it is our deep slumber that has brought the wrath of God upon us. IF this turned me into an insensitive megalomaniac then so be it.

Pakistan is not going to wake up, and I believe it is for the best this country suffers from a humiliation so bad that it has no other option. But this dheet qaum is well, beghairat pretty much. No turning back.

 

[Multani]

But majority(80percent plus) of Turks and Azeris support Secularism , what about the rest Egypt , Tunisia ,Indonesia etc?

That is not true.

 

[Khan_patriot]

Here is a tip about our own mentality...anyone holding tasbih should do good and anyone eating kasam should be good when in reality it isnt the case so why prepare ourselves with a mentality that is failing? I have seen women fighting holding tasbih, holding tasbih pausing to do chuglian and then continuing with the tasbih in fact I have seen women doing chuglian and the beads moving in the hands...wonder what they were counting how many chugliyan words they used or how much ghunna they got?!

Thats absolutely right, a good rule if thumb is to stay away from anyone trying to come off as God fearing, I have personally learnt to despise a man with a beard or a woman with a tasbih in public because they have proven to be the biggest hypocrites I have seen.....

 

[EyanKhan]

That is not true.

Oh but it is

Wait. For fairness, he is using the words "traitor" and "kufr", I havn't seen him calling muslims kafir in this thread. And neither has he asked them to be slayed.

He does in all the other threads and you can get the gist of it from his comments not to mention his comment on a bloody revolution in Indonesia?

 

[Multani]

please redefine Liberalism in this era ?. ...Liberalism in Muslim world always exist in every century and different shapes ..

Yes, this is what Ghazi and Romi should be writing about.

 

[Multani]

We dont have the luxury to cry for everyone, it is our deep slumber that has brought the wrath of God upon us. IF this turned me into an insensitive megalomaniac then so be it.

Pakistan is not going to wake up, and I believe it is for the best this country suffers from a humiliation so bad that it has no other option. But this dheet qaum is well, beghairat pretty much. No turning back.

Such a ghaleez thing to say. Reeks of ghalazat. Allah paak protect Pakistan and its people from the evil of these people .

Don't wish humiliation for my country and my people. Wish it for yourself

 

[Informant]

Such a ghaleez thing to say. Reeks of ghalazat. Allah paak protect Pakistan and its people from the evil of these people .

Don't wish humiliation for my country and my people. Wish it for yourself

Pakistan is the gutter of the world man, all the terrorists come here for training. OBL was found here. We are getting what we deserve. I dont believe in fantasies of Islam ka Qila which this country never was never will be.

I'm just not delusional. Doesnt mean i dont love my country.

 

[SQ8]

Your problem is that you make too much assumptions dear .... And what you are trying to assert here is totally incorrect ... But may be you are too arrogant to accept the facts that go against your opinions !!

As far I am concerned , My understanding of religion is a bit different ... I don`t believe in any of Mullah`s nonsense (words of Jinnah), I believe in a "secular socialist democracy" . Which according to Allama Muhammad Iqbal (And a lot of other scholars) is perfectly Islamic . !!! ... ... Now if you could understand that , You would realize that your assumption is wrong , once again ....



Yes , that was a political murder .... PMLN is the main culprit

Absolutely not.. I state what I see from first hand experience(already said that before if you bothered to read it but selective screening is possible in haste). Moreover, If I am wrong.. disprove me.. you cant do that since you have already discarded opinion on experience. I am still open to it. . As Emerson says

But why should you keep your head over your shoulder? Why drag about this corpse of your memory, lest you contradict somewhat you have stated in this or that public place? Suppose you should contradict yourself; what then? It seems to be a rule of wisdom never to rely on your memory alone, scarcely even in acts of pure memory, but to bring the past for judgment into the thousand-eyed present, and live ever in a new day. In your metaphysics you have denied personality to the Deity: yet when the devout motions of the soul come, yield to them heart and life, though they should clothe God with shape and color. Leave your theory, as Joseph his coat in the hand of the harlot, and flee.