US Def Sec Ashton Carter Witnesses India's Pakistan Obsession in Delhi

[Peshwa]

Earlier we have had this so called People to people contacts

Do you know The people to people contact was at its BEST just prior
to 2008 Mumbai attacks

We had cricket tours ; Pakistan players played in the IPL --First IPL

And then out of the blue we had Mumbai 26/ 11

In fact on that DAY ; Pakistan Foreign minister was in New Delhi

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Now coming to another point

Even at the BEST of times The Number of Visas given to people
were 5000 Per year ; Maximum

But did it solve any thing

No because the Number of people who hate India is nearly 90 Percent of the population

You might be right in quoting many of these examples, but my experience with this has been very different.
My hostility towards Pakistan is now limited to the actions of their military and spy agency, post interacting/living with them (pakistani civilians) in real life...from an individual perspective, I find Pakistanis no different than Indians.

I am not claiming that my solution is the right one, just using my own personal experience to expand to the larger population. People to people contact can only help alleviate some of our issues and misconceptions.

But you're right in your own views based on some of the examples you have provided.
Let's just agree to disagree on this point.

 

[Bad Guy]

Because another Indian agents got caught after Jhadev's revelations, whole spy/terrorist ring is busted now........

http://www.thenews.com.pk/latest/113821-Arrested-RAW-agents-make-startling-revelations

Jhadev aka monkey (code word) has made revelations that won't come out on T.V due to their sensitivity but progress is being going on the leads he is providing. You should observe China's behavior in coming days, it will get more harsh on India. Game is on !!!

http://zeenews.india.com/news/india...py-agency-raw-defect-to-the-west_1876978.html
We have a state where 70% population is RAW agent
Prime minister is raw agent
President is raw agent
Finance minister is raw agent
Chief Minister of two biggest provinces are raw agent

Where main party is raw agent
Main opposition party is raw agent
Even 3 rd largest party is "trained" by raw
They buy fight jets to prevent raw agents entering from space
Ships and submarines to prevent "illegal entry" of raw agents
Where raw agents carry "genuine" Indian fake passport for their identification being raw agent
Where security agencies use RAW code words to communicate easily with raw
Where largest number of cases are filed for "suspicion" of being raw agent
P. S. And No its not Bangladesh

Come on Indian members, why trolling RAW agents?

 

[Stephen Cohen]

You might be right in quoting many of these examples, but my experience with this has been very different.
My hostility towards Pakistan is now limited to the actions of their military and spy agency, post interacting/living with them (pakistani civilians) in real life...from an individual perspective, I find Pakistanis no different than Indians.

I am not claiming that my solution is the right one, just using my own personal experience to expand to the larger population. People to people contact can only help alleviate some of our issues and misconceptions.

But you're right in your own views based on some of the examples you have provided.
Let's just agree to disagree on this point.

Pakistan's India policy is Driven by Pakistan Army and ISI who are
totally against ANY Reconcialiation with India

Infact their policy is known as No war No peace

They dont want war to break out but at the same time they dont want relations to improve

Secondly the Pakistanis you met were in a foreign country or neutral setting as you said

What about the 200 Million who live in Pakistan

How many you have met or talked to

 

[Peshwa]

Pakistan's India policy is Driven by Pakistan Army and ISI who are
totally against ANY Reconcialiation with India

Infact their policy is known as No war No peace

They dont want war to break out but at the same time they dont want relations to improve

Secondly the Pakistanis you met were in a foreign country or neutral setting as you said

What about the 200 Million who live in Pakistan

How many you have met or talked to

The Pakistanis I met/am friends with abroad are pure bred pakistanis, part of the same 200 million.
I'm not referring to Americans of Pakistani origin. and to be honest, quite a few, more than I can count the digits on my body. Of course I have come accross some bad eggs as well, but then again, there are Indians who I can say are equally bad!
The strange thing is that I'm not the only one who shares such experiences.

And the remaining 200 MM Pakistanis will benefit from meeting and interacting Indians in real life rather than rely on incompetent media (same as India), and misconceptions inculcated through education mediums and their own military/spy agencies.
What I'm saying is that we shouldn't be frogs living in a well...don't rely on preconceived notions, let people meet and interact and make these conclusions about each other for themselves.
And most importantly NOT rely on the pathetic sample available on PDF to make such perceptions.

 

[Stephen Cohen]

The Pakistanis I met/am friends with abroad are pure bred pakistanis, part of the same 200 million.
I'm not referring to Americans of Pakistani origin. and to be honest, quite a few, more than I can count the digits on my body. Of course I have come accross some bad eggs as well, but then again, there are Indians who I can say are equally bad!
The strange things is that I'm not the only one who shares such experiences.

And the remaining 200 MM pakistanis will benefit from meeting and interacting indians in real life rather than rely on imcompetent media (same as India), and misconceptions inculcated through education mediums and their own military/spy agencies.
What Im saying is that we shouldn't be frogs living in a well...dont rely on pre conceived notions, let people meet and interact and make these conclusions about each other for themselves.
And most importantly NOT rely on the pathetic sample available on PDF to make such perceptions.

ALL this is empty words

I dont know your age But if you have observed India Pakistan relations from 1999
Then I dont see ABSOLUTELY any hope at all

The Last hope died with Pathankot

You should go to Pakistan and SEE for yourself the level of extremism

In such an environment ; Anti India feelings ; words; actions and huge Rallies are just
as freely available as Oxygen

And what about the Pakistan Army

Even if These 200 MILLION people want they cannot change the Army's out look
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Are you Aware that here is a theory going around that
The peace process is Sabotaged purposefully

This is what happens

1 The peace process gets Underway
2 Some people in Pakistan dont want it to move forward

3 They sabotage it by terror attacks

4 India gets angry ; Then MANY harsh words are spoken here in India

5 NOW the Pakistani people on whom you are pinning your hopes GET upset by India's accusations and belligerence

6 So we are back to square one

SO the question is :

To save the MYTHICAL peace process should India keep quiet after the Terror attacks

Will it lead to any change in the attitude and behaviour of Pakistan Army

Man mohan Singh tried that ; It led to MORE attacks on the LOC

 

[EAK]

lol, in Sachin , IA beat PAK by a DAY... this is what happened , when you came last in the race , you started crying like a baby whose lollypop has been take.

In Kargil we taken back land , while in siachin , you tried and get killed.

carry on ... you are proving my point of being brain washed ..

 

[wiseone2]

Well that's exactly what i mean and you proved my point...

Kargil ; Do you know what happened in siachin ..it's the same case but media fed you establishment story
Indian Parliament and mumbai ; how many people have died max 300 ..Pakistan lost 40000+ to stooges like yadav and their institutions funded terrorists.. in response you guys ignore these reality in media and talk about snakes biting back.. well then when they bit back US some years back then where were your media why it couldn't say that snakes they funded and given weapons are biting back..

My point was media is a tool which makes up peoples mind .. it has to show the positive rather then negativity all the time..and your media has to get out of establishment control to perform that role..

i know what happened in Siachen. it was poorly demacrated. indian army seized it.

of course india conducts espionage activities in pakistan. i would expect no less of the indian government. India is not responsible for any of the bombings in pakistan. there is no simply no evidence for it. india stands to gain nothing. your establishment has a lot for answer for it.

for all the faults india has a relatively open political system with a lot of breathing space for various interest groups in the country. the establishment is not as heavy handed as pakistan's. pakistan could do well to emulate it. in fact if pakistan had adopted the indian system you would still be intact.

Where did i mention in my post Americans can't prop up or help Indians economically? what did you perceived from post?

"If Pakistan wasn't there, how easy would be for US and west to contain China with the help of India. Again, Pakistan spoils the game...Big time !!! China is going towards Gwadar, Pakistan is going for economic glory it once had and India is going nowhere....

Source: https://defence.pk/threads/us-def-s...bsession-in-delhi.427386/page-3#ixzz46OVUPioz"

This is your own quote. Tell us how do we interpret it

 

[Sully3]

Indias Pakistan Obsession has failed to bring any meaningful result as the world simply does not care what India thinks about Pakistan.

When the Indian complain to forgein diplomats about Pak all they say is what are you going to do? War not an option because the 2 countries will nuke each other, so all the crying and throwing hissy fits falls on deaf years. Prime example of this was with the f16 sales, every single embassy in the world was laughing at India a country 5 times the size of Pakistan being scared of 8 planes.

Also recently Paksitan has made big effort to direct the worlds attention to Indian funded terrorism so the world is getting a clear picture about Indians.

US won't achieve anything strategic from India other than a competition to chinas economy. With Iran and Afghanistan bordering Pakistan it will always remain a key security partner of the US.

 

[shree835]

Please report if it is violation of rules. news can be put from other blogs for discussion that is not an offence

Article headings can also be manipulated ...???

 

[Alpha Fighter]

carry on ... you are proving my point of being brain washed ..

me or you , ask everyone outside PAK.... their enough of proof exist which shows you PAK citizen was brainwashed, Eg, in 1971 , PAK news paper Headline" PAK winning War against India" and same day, PAK soldiers surrendering in Lacs".... lol , this is called brain washed and lied fed.

 

[PaklovesTurkiye]

we have wold famous terrorist released from Indian jail against highjack plane , call Masood living in PAK.... why all world knows terrorist are PAK and live in PAK?

and no Secret agent ever kept his own real passport, lol, you kidnap him,

moreover the dead body of the Indian you send is without heart and stomach, you poisoned him and taken out proof..... you are habitual liars , tell something which real.

Masood Azhar....hmm......I request you to take this case to International court of justice rather than to China, US etc. Once and for all.

Your own media/intelligence disagree with you..........http://www.mumbaimirror.com/mumbai/...rd-him-speak-Marathi/articleshow/51579077.cms

I don't know anything about dead body of indian without organs but you should be thankful to Pakistan that Jhadev is still getting good humane treatment despite killer of so many Pakistanis and Chinese. Didn't you see Jhadev in his confession video? He was relaxed and cooperating with us, definitely his organs are at place where they should be.

Has it?! (spoiled India's credibility)
Because I literally don't see any nation talking about this issue except Pakistanis, who's media itself has given up on the nonsensical drama.
As far as Jadhav is concerned, if you feel you have hit a goldmine, so be it..good for you!
We are on the sidelines laughing that your lot are taking directions from a #monkey...lol!
In fact we encourage you in this wild goose chase, all the while the real enemies of Pakistan (home grown islamic terrorists like ttp and jud) sit right under your nose knocking off innocent civilians and military..

We are doing whatever we can to tell and show the world your real face that you hides behind your economic clout, democracy and bollywood.

What do you know about homegrown terrorists? Don't you see the progress regarding operation Prophet Sword? We are neutralizing every trouble maker exist on our soil ( Indian funded and others etc) without any discrimination.

http://zeenews.india.com/news/india...py-agency-raw-defect-to-the-west_1876978.html
We have a state where 70% population is RAW agent
Prime minister is raw agent
President is raw agent
Finance minister is raw agent
Chief Minister of two biggest provinces are raw agent

Where main party is raw agent
Main opposition party is raw agent
Even 3 rd largest party is "trained" by raw
They buy fight jets to prevent raw agents entering from space
Ships and submarines to prevent "illegal entry" of raw agents
Where raw agents carry "genuine" Indian fake passport for their identification being raw agent
Where security agencies use RAW code words to communicate easily with raw
Where largest number of cases are filed for "suspicion" of being raw agent
P. S. And No its not Bangladesh

Come on Indian members, why trolling RAW agents?

Far good and understandable than pigeons and balloons.

"If Pakistan wasn't there, how easy would be for US and west to contain China with the help of India. Again, Pakistan spoils the game...Big time !!! China is going towards Gwadar, Pakistan is going for economic glory it once had and India is going nowhere....

Source: https://defence.pk/threads/us-def-s...bsession-in-delhi.427386/page-3#ixzz46OVUPioz"

This is your own quote. Tell us how do we interpret it

Unless Pakistan is neutralized, India and US can't contain China, regardless of how powerful India becomes with blessings of West.

The number of alleged RAW agents Pakistan has caught over the years would fill a cricket stadium.

China? Who cares what China thinks. China is not India's friend.

You do care what China thinks thats why your officials are sitting in China right now.

 

[Hakikat ve Hikmet]

Every action has an opposite reaction. India is obsessed with pulling Pak down, and China is obsessed with wasting India's energy in tackling Pak. As for India, Pak is like the proverbial carrot that the donkey can't reach...

 

[Manidabest]

I really see that here in Singapore also. My indian friends are always bad-mouthing Pakistan while Pakistanis remain indifferent towards them and discuss more about internal politics.

Indians r small hearted people with dirty thinking

 

[911]

I appreciate your response because it echoes with my experience. As a Singaporean, I'm neutral and did not know about Pakistan before my entry to NUS where I met a lot Indian friends and through them I got know about Pakistan and over like 6 months unconsciously, I developed the feeling that Pakistanis very extremely religious people who are trouble makers for the region and even for much bigger india...they told me incident after incident and showed me international news reports. But a year ago two Pakistani students came to live in the same corridor as mine, initially I was not so open towards them and avoided them but I saw they were gentle and fun-loving people and passionate about studies and fun. When I started questioning them I got some clarifications and got some sort of similar picture as you portrayed. But they only talked about India when asked otherwise their talk was focussed on studies and fun and cricket (which I learned to play with my Indian friends) and yeah I came to know a lot about Pakistani culture and internal politics and how politicians corrupted your economy and system.

But despite what Indians do, I think there are some lack of will or something missing on Pakistan's part that you are not able to present at governmental level. I'm lucky that I got nice Pakistani friends but it is not the case with everyone and thus people rely on media and not many are bothered to do research on foreign affairs and think what the mass media saying is true.
I will visit Pakistan at end of this year as one of my friends is getting married

Cmon, you need to learn a lot about hiding your identity. @Atanz @HAKIKAT what do you say?

 

[cloud4000]

Unless Pakistan is neutralized, India and US can't contain China, regardless of how powerful India becomes with blessings of West.

What exactly does 'neutralized' mean in this case? What can Pakistan do to get in India/US way in containing China?

You do care what China thinks thats why your officials are sitting in China right now.

India has officials in Pakistan too. Does India care what Pakistan thinks? And Pakistan has officials in India too. Does Pakistan care what India thinks.