UAE, Pakistan and Mirage 2000-9s

[帅的一匹]

It's a good point my friend

But if the f16 are embargoed then thunder being a decent low cost fighter will be trampled to death by three hundred plus flankers and rafales.

The thunders would struggle without a big brother to support

I think the Republican always in favor of Pakistan more than Democratic?

 

[araz]

Correct I am agree



I think you miss out J-10B/C option



Just in case if M2K9 is not accessible for Pakistan. Then what do you think about J-10B/C. and is there any comparison between M2K9 and J-10B/C especially is there any Fly by wire for J-10B/C

It is simply a case of PAFs assessment of the capabilities of J10B/C and the advancements of JFT. Our forever meagre pockets do not help either.
An AESA equipped JFT with a chin mounted Aselsan pod and 4+2 combo will do just fine. If we get a more powerful engine we might get DERs which can increase the number of BVRs to 6+2 which would be more than enough for the Indo Pak arena. The whole Warfare strategy is changing and I dont see planes loitering in an arena for long. It would be more of a case of shoot and scoot reload and shoot some more. So rather than missile load sortie rates would be a more important aspect to remember.
The other aspect to remember is what serves us best against an adversary which is bigger and more well equipped. I dont think you can field a 4/4.5 gen plane against a 4.5 generation platform. You have to take a technological leap to be ahead of the curve for your forces to remain relevant . If you look at that aspect , in my humble opinion we need to have a fifth generation platform by 2023-25 to remain relevant.
A

 

[Cool_Soldier]

By the is there any real negotiation going on between both parties?

 

[Zarvan]

In my opinion Pakistan should try to first get either SU-35 or Eurofighter than if we want we should go for these other wise no.

 

[Fyaaz Khan]

why pakistan is going for this old coffin boxes ?
Pakistan must spend this amount and extra efforts to make JF17 more better and capable, JF17 will be the back bone of PAF. its a very bad idea to buy these old used Mirage for Pakistan Air Force.

Cheif should concentrate on development and better avionics system for JF17's up coming version. and better engines from Russia.

 

[araz]

why pakistan is going for this old coffin boxes ?
Pakistan must spend this amount and extra efforts to make JF17 more better and capable, JF17 will be the back bone of PAF. its a very bad idea to buy these old used Mirage for Pakistan Air Force.

Cheif should concentrate on development and better avionics system for JF17's up coming version. and better engines from Russia.

Read the posts again . These are anything but coffin boxes for a nation which is still flying mirages which are relics of the fities and sixties.
A

 

[Hammad ur Rehman]

This is a good idea that if it is possible then PAF should acquire all the UAEAF Mirage-2000-9s as well as Qatari AF's Mirages to form 4 combat squadrons. These will be a good replacement for Mirage III/Vs.

However, this may not happen.

Just look at today's picture of HH Sheikh Mohammad Bin Zayed Al Nahyan & Modi. Due to our refusal to join the war against Houthis UAE will punish Pakistan & that is why it has gone closer to India. Although India has very close ties with their nemesis Iran with sizeable investment plans but their ties will grow strong due to smart moves by Modi. Look how stupid their previous PMs have been they never visited UAE for more than 30 years despite some 2.6 million NRIs some of whom are very wealthy & own large share of properties. Now Modi is going to encash their influence in UAE. This will happen even though majority of the Indians lives in Dubai & not in Abu Dhabi but both Mohammads now work closely.

Compare to this our Presidents & PMs (both current & exs) visit UAE almost every month or even live there. Very very bad diplomacy.

I wonder what happened to the 30 something UAEAF Mirage Vs retired earlier, did they find their way to PAF as scrap for spare parts use. May be in early good times it is possible.

Also UAE till now has not signed on to the Rafale contract & thus 2000s will not be available soon until they are fully replaced. May be they are waiting for the USA to release F-35s!!!

They have also not signed on the contract for some 30 additional F-16 E/Fs so may be f35s!!!

Also if they buy Rafales then they have already put a condition on Dassault to buyback the 2000s so we will have to negotiate with French with may be a higher price which will make it unfeasible.

In case UAE controls 2000s then Pakistan will have to literarilly beg them to sell them to us & forget about a free transfer as those days are gone. This may have been easy if the late Sheikh Zayed had been alive (God bless his soul).

I believe I have detailed almost all scenarios & it seems that it is not possible so pls. wish something else.

 

[New World]

Their money,their pilots life,their blood,they can waste whatever they want
Their idea is so ridiculous,let them be

and our Site also. Let us to do what we want..

 

[ali_raza]

For the statement you have made you have my heartfelt sympathies. Just to update you, the M2k-9 stands for Mirage2000-9 built by Dassault of France, and NOT the UAE Air Force.

Btw, our first four Air Chiefs were Pakistani, we have always had trainers / instructors form PAF, either on deputation, or on contracts. So if they haven't imparted any knowledge, or refined our air war doctrines, then it is a sad day for PAF, and Pakistanis as a whole, as well. Please accept my heartfelt condolences.

Do not forget to let the PAF know, that since the M2k-9 "does not inspire trust in you," you would rather not see it in PAF colors, IF an opportunity arises.

u cant single out the whole institution for thinking of one person.people need proper exposure to multiple countries to understand meaning of diplomacy

 

[mrrehan]

In my opinion Pakistan should try to first get either SU-35 or Eurofighter than if we want we should go for these other wise no.

 

[Humble Analyst]

u cant single out the whole institution for thinking of one person.people need proper exposure to multiple countries to understand meaning of diplomacy

You are right but right now UAE is in love with India and some reasons are absurd, some Pakistan gave them. So highly unlikely they will sell to Pakistan.

 

[Basel]

Some idiots were claiming that the M2K-9's are old and obsolete. Here is something for you to digest:

View attachment 371052

Only Obsolete tech production is stopped.

 

[-BAJWA-]

And because the Chinese president visited China, it was impossible of buying anything from China? Is this your logic?

 

[ali_raza]

You are right but right now UAE is in love with India and some reasons are absurd, some Pakistan gave them. So highly unlikely they will sell to Pakistan.

this is not something that we should start to think that UAE is our enemy no1.
markets are changing there shapes globally people are taking different sides doesn't matter.why not adjust accordingly.
even if they don't sell to us then what.m sure this is not as big thing as we make it up.see the bright side.
u r getting closer to russia.
cpec is becoming a reality.
with the class of leadership we have.its still big achievement what we r getting.
UAE is not against us and never will be.some frictions came but will be over

 

[ziaulislam]

This is a good idea that if it is possible then PAF should acquire all the UAEAF Mirage-2000-9s as well as Qatari AF's Mirages to form 4 combat squadrons. These will be a good replacement for Mirage III/Vs.

However, this may not happen.

Just look at today's picture of HH Sheikh Mohammad Bin Zayed Al Nahyan & Modi. Due to our refusal to join the war against Houthis UAE will punish Pakistan & that is why it has gone closer to India. Although India has very close ties with their nemesis Iran with sizeable investment plans but their ties will grow strong due to smart moves by Modi. Look how stupid their previous PMs have been they never visited UAE for more than 30 years despite some 2.6 million NRIs some of whom are very wealthy & own large share of properties. Now Modi is going to encash their influence in UAE. This will happen even though majority of the Indians lives in Dubai & not in Abu Dhabi but both Mohammads now work closely.

Compare to this our Presidents & PMs (both current & exs) visit UAE almost every month or even live there. Very very bad diplomacy.

I wonder what happened to the 30 something UAEAF Mirage Vs retired earlier, did they find their way to PAF as scrap for spare parts use. May be in early good times it is possible.

Also UAE till now has not signed on to the Rafale contract & thus 2000s will not be available soon until they are fully replaced. May be they are waiting for the USA to release F-35s!!!

They have also not signed on the contract for some 30 additional F-16 E/Fs so may be f35s!!!

Also if they buy Rafales then they have already put a condition on Dassault to buyback the 2000s so we will have to negotiate with French with may be a higher price which will make it unfeasible.

In case UAE controls 2000s then Pakistan will have to literarilly beg them to sell them to us & forget about a free transfer as those days are gone. This may have been easy if the late Sheikh Zayed had been alive (God bless his soul).

I believe I have detailed almost all scenarios & it seems that it is not possible so pls. wish something else.

about the availability part i think the 32 earlier batch mirages from UAE and qatari UAE are available even now, the only issue is that UAE is extremely unlilkey to give up them at cheaper price, if at all UAE plans to given them free, a likly candidate will be iraq or any other arab country inculding Egypt(multiple new report regarding Iraq through offical channels exist)

second issue would be weapons, upgrades and futre support setup, that would be difficult to establish without France help
the only way this is happening if UAE is super helpful in giving up not only them free but also convincing France for good deal in absence of any further f-16s for PAF and if PAF is not ready to scarfice some range and is not fine with f-16s and thunders for strike role
this is very unlikley