This to Generals for this !

[CivilianSupremacy]

Pakistan Army is undoubtedly by far the biggest enemy of People of Pakistan. All of our rights, our budgets, our land, our respect everything is being torned apart from such military.

They are extension of british. Infact british Raj was much better as they were atleast logical & reasonable people. But the ones who replaced them in colonial headquarters (cantonments) are worst. The british designed cantonments near to cities to occupy & control cities and its resources. There was no LOC by then whole requirements were to subdue local population. Pak army instead making its bases towards LOC, uses civil population centers as human shields and they theymselves even being chaukidaars have all the security around themselves only (around cantonments only) . What a tyranny we live in. We share same cities but law is only applicable to bloody civilians. Police cannot dare to raid in cantonments even if a junior officer murder someone in the city.
Only good thing happening in current times of extreme oppression is that people knowing the true reality of this monster army.

 

[Imran Khan]

there must be a law army numbers always must be less then police numbers . if you want to increase army then increase police too .

idea # 2 we can outsource our defense . 10bn$ per year contract is too high and i am sure contractors will defend us far better then paksitani army . we will not give land to contractors . contractors will obey us . contractors will not dictate us . contractors will not involve in politics . and last but best we can replace contractors anytime

best thing they will not blackmail us that we are shaheeds . if they do we will say saaly pesy liye thy tum ne .

 

[Maula Jatt]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1637844942956421120

All Thanks to juranili rule

 

[Mav3rick]

So the 12 graders want more humiliation. Unless pak has financial stamina. Things won't go till next year.

Well, since there are successful illiterate all over the world ruling companies which hire graduates and post graduates at interim positions, your argument of 12th grader goes down the drain from where you had pulled it out of.

As for financial stamina, we are getting weaker day by day. There is no clarity what is going on, even amongst the know how, there is confusion as to why the IMF program is not progressing. All evidence points to reluctance of the Saudi to provide money before the IMF program whereas IMF wants solid assurances that the 7 Billion USD shortfall will be plugged with funding from the 3 countries. The ED's from these countries may be asked to confirm to the board that once the IMF program is signed, their countries will release their pledges.

 

[truthseeker2010]

Well, since there are successful illiterate all over the world ruling companies which hire graduates and post graduates at interim positions, your argument of 12th grader goes down the drain from where you had pulled it out of.

As for financial stamina, we are getting weaker day by day. There is no clarity what is going on, even amongst the know how, there is confusion as to why the IMF program is not progressing. All evidence points to reluctance of the Saudi to provide money before the IMF program whereas IMF wants solid assurances that the 7 Billion USD shortfall will be plugged with funding from the 3 countries. The ED's from these countries may be asked to confirm to the board that once the IMF program is signed, their countries will release their pledges.

you are mistaking indian graduates with ur company employees.

The world or your brotherly countries are fed up wid ur financial and moral corruption. Hence there is no 'clarity'.

 

[villageidiot]

There is a difference between lawful orders and illegal orders. As long as soldiers are following lawful orders, soldiers are expected to maintain order and discipline. Soldiers de-escalated the situation by leaving. The movement for democracy just needs these soldiers to only follow lawful orders. It will be these solders that will be needed to man the polls. Don’t lump them all into one group, give the young men hope that they will be lead by IK once again.

The example of Shaheed Rashid Minhas comes to mind. Why was he honored? For disobeying his superior to serve a higher goal.
What is the higher honor, between disobeying your superior officer to save an aircraft and disobeying him to save the lives of fellow citizens who you've swore to protect?

 

[Maula Jatt]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1637744790581260288

 

[VCheng]

It's not surprising. I'm more surprised at the person who's surprised this is happening.

The reaction you are seeing is anger and it'll continue unless we do the course correction.

However, I do believe the reputational damage to the institution is done. They've done what India couldn't do in 75 years.

This, too, shall pass. Surely. Just give it some time.

 

[Imran Khan]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1637744790581260288

اگر استادوں نے سچی تاریخ پڑھانا شروع کر دی تو لینے کے دینے بھی پڑ سکتے ہیں

 

[villageidiot]

Ok. This thread is too heavy.
Let's lighten the mood a bit.

Lar-yo-bar sickos in action under the guise of 'PTI KPK'. Their whining never mattered, won't matter now. Imran should be wary of his party's KPK wing. They would do this shit and hurt his mainstream agenda....

Keep burying your head in the sand. Soon it will be PTI-Punjab. What names will you give them?
Jesus, man, we have seen this before. It used to be traitorous, indian loving Bengalis.
To those blaming IK for this, he hasn't even said 5% of the shit NS, Maryam and Altaf Hussain said. Even months into his ousting, he kept saying the army is more important for Pakistan than him and to not badmouth the army. Now, after the assassination attempt, he just mere stopped saying that. PTI is still saying the respect the army chief (fawad ch. today). What more do you want?
The difference now is the people have access to information and awareness to connect the dots.

 

[FuturePAF]

The example of Shaheed Rashid Minhas comes to mind. Why was he honored? For disobeying his superior to serve a higher goal.
What is the higher honor, between disobeying your superior officer to save an aircraft and disobeying him to save the lives of fellow citizens who you've swore to protect?

That is more a matter of initiative in battle. Commanders have by now, who were once junior officers once upon a time, know the importance of giving subordinates the right of initiative in the heat of battle. But as swift retort showed, a well trained plan is also important in achieving larger operational and strategic goals.

 

[villageidiot]

That is more a matter of initiative in battle. Commanders have by now, who were once junior officers once upon a time, know the importance of giving subordinates the right of initiative in the heat of battle. But as swift retort showed, a well trained plan is also important in achieving larger operational and strategic goals.

Are you saying there is no reasoning involved?
Okay. Let's use another example that someone gave the other day.

If a soldier/policeman is given an order to beat up/shoot someone. He will likely do it, because of the discipline ingrained in him.

What if the target is his family member, lets say his father is protesting for IK? Will any moral reasoning come into play? Any inhibitions?

For almost all non-sociopath soldiers/policemen, the answer is yes. So, that means that those inhibitions are there. They just choose to ignore them because a stranger is not worth more than his job but his own father is. It's a simple matter of selfish interests. Not some higher purpose or the training drilled into him.

 

[lastofthepatriots]

Faujeets look scared

Nah. They looked embarrassed to be honest. They’re like damn.. we support IK too…

These are just grunts no different from the common man.

You either die a hero or live long enough to be the villain..

 

[FuturePAF]

Are you saying there is no reasoning involved?
Okay. Let's use another example that someone gave the other day.

If a soldier/policeman is given an order to beat up/shoot someone. He will likely do it, because of the discipline ingrained in him.

What if the target is his family member, lets say his father is protesting for IK? Will any moral reasoning come into play? Any inhibitions?

For almost all non-sociopath soldiers/policemen, the answer is yes. So, that means that those inhibitions are there. They just choose to ignore them because a stranger is not worth more than his job but his own father is. It's a simple matter of selfish interests. Not some higher purpose or the training drilled into him.

Superior order defense ended at Nuremberg. The oath of an enforcer of the law is to the law and the constitution (which in Pakistan is also Islamic moral law) not the superior officer when they break the law.

Article 227 of the Constitution of the Islamic Republic of Pakistan:
“no law shall be enacted which is repugnant to Islamic Injunctions”.

 

[villageidiot]

Superior order defense ended at Nuremberg. The oath of an enforcer of the law is to the law and the constitution (which in Pakistan is also Islamic moral law) not the superior officer when they break the law.

That's all I wanted to say, sir.

I'd like to add that it isn't just limited to whether some against a defined law but also to morally repugnant orders. Discrimination against Jews was codified into laws. So, it wasn't technically illegal