What's new

T-LORAMIDS Tender | Updates & Discussion

What is the best option for the T-LORAMIDS Program


  • Total voters
    67
POLITICS - Turkey ‘cannot ignore’ Western concerns over missile deal

Murad Bayar, the head of Turkey’s defense procurement agency, has dismissed claims that his organization has ignored Western concerns regarding a controversial air and missile defense system Turkey intends to buy from a Chinese manufacturer.

“Absolutely, there are some concerns that we can accept,” said Bayar, head of the Undersecretariat for Defense Industries (SSM), pointing to “information security” and “interworking.”

“We have accepted it and are taking precautions. Our Western allies may be concerned as they don’t have all the details, but we are acting openly. If they want, we can explain it to them,” Bayar said.
Citing “a few risk points” in the Chinese proposal, Bayar told daily Hürriyet that U.S. and European companies still had time until April to improve their tender offers.

“Actually, we received the tender offers and the decisions were made by the executive committee last September. For us, the tender procedure was over and the ranking turned out to be 1) China 2) the European offer 3) the American offer. If the negotiations had been concluded with the first offer [China], the deal would have been done. However, if it’s not possible, which sometimes happens because of complex details involved. For instance, we still haven’t been able to conclude the Sikorsky tender after 2.5 years, as problematic issues come up. This could happen with the Chinese offer, too,” said Bayar.

The bid to construct a long-range air and anti-missile system from China Precision Machinery Export-Import Corp. (CPMIEC), which won the tender Sept. 26, 2013, came in at $3.44 billion. The Chinese contender defeated a U.S. partnership of Raytheon and Lockheed Martin, offering the Patriot air defense system; Russia’s Rosoboronexport, marketing the S-300; and the Italian-French consortium Eurosam, maker of the SAMP/T Aster 30.

After asked if there were problems with the current Chinese offer, Bayar said there was “a few risk points,” although they were not at a stage that could block the process.

Admitting that they’re not “completely convinced” yet, he said: “If we decide that we can’t do it with China, then we’ll move to the second offer, which is the European one. The deadline was previously the end of January, but now we have extended it to the end of April. If they improve their offers, we could consider them. This is what the foreign minister said.”

Following criticism from NATO partners, Foreign Minister Ahmet Davutoğlu announced at the Munich Security Conference earlier this month that the second and third companies in the SSM’s ranking could still renew their offers. In addition to the price, Turkish authorities said the assurance of joint production in Turkey and guarantees of technology transfer were the main factors in convincing them to opt for CPMIEC.

Bayar, meanwhile, also defined the Cyprus crisis of 1974 as a “historic breaking point” for Turkey’s defense industry. “Until then, Turkey supported its military needs mostly through NATO. In 1974, Turkey was obliged to solve a national security problem of its own by its own means,” he said.

The subsequent arms embargo imposed on Turkey by the U.S. Congress was “so heavy” that it “shook” Turkish authorities, who consequently allocated more resources to developing a national defense industry.

“Today, the river is changing its course. Until the 1990s, the river had been flowing predominantly through the purchase or licensed production of foreign [defense] products. Now, the course of this river has changed toward the native development and production of them,” Bayar said.

Emphasizing that Turkey now saved around $4 billion annually through its defense policies, Bayar said the national defense budget of the country should actually exceed the current level of $16 billion.

CPMIEC is blacklisted by the United States, which implemented sanctions against the company in January 2013. “The sanctions are for two years [to continue for one more year]. The U.S. had imposed and then abolished the same sanctions in the past. This is an issue about America’s foreign policy,” Bayar said.

Touching on Turkey’s possibly response if Washington slapped an embargo on Ankaraover CPMIEC as it did in 1974, Bayar said: “Such an option should be carefully examined. This would mean an escalation. I believe that it wouldn’t be a logical action for anybody. This individual issue should be evaluated in itself.”

As its longest serving head, Bayar is not sure if his term at the helm of SSM will be renewed. Speaking in perhaps his last interview as the SSM’s head, he said he was ready to account for 400 projects that the agency developed over the last 10 years.

In the past 30 years that Bayar served in the SSM, the agency saw just four different heads. “This is the nature of this business. There are very significant investments. We used a part of the national resources in changing the course of the river,” he said.
 
Last edited:
.
Good news from DIMDEX 2014

CPMIEC official Wu Yang: Deal has reached it's final stage

Türkiye, Çin füzelerini almaya çok yaklaştı haberi - Güncel - Star Gazete

HQ-9 LR-SAM & HT-233 passive phased-array radar.jpg
 
. . . .
Greece too buy non Nato stuff like S-300 and no issue. I dont see why Turkey shall have problem intergrating with Chinese one onto Nato system.
 
.
So what exactly is going on?
in the link @ post #787 CPMIEC said that the process is going well and close to finishing.


Greece too buy non Nato stuff like S-300 and no issue. I dont see why Turkey shall have problem intergrating with Chinese one onto Nato system.

Turkey has stated several times that it has the capability to create its own software for integrating with nato.
but for some reasons Turkey gets politically pressured a lot by western nations. either that, or Turkey is deliberately stubbornly sticking to the Chinese system while delaying the process in order to wait for better deals from the west. i believe the first one.
 
.
in the link @ post #787 CPMIEC said that the process is going well and close to finishing.




Turkey has stated several times that it has the capability to create its own software for integrating with nato.
but for some reasons Turkey gets politically pressured a lot by western nations. either that, or Turkey is deliberately stubbornly sticking to the Chinese system while delaying the process in order to wait for better deals from the west. i believe the first one.

The west will not offer better deal. The only option turkey has is Chinese missile. The deal will be signed soon.
 
.
The west will not offer better deal. The only option turkey has is Chinese missile. The deal will be signed soon.
right, in addition we also get ToT and other extras. compared to the other proposals, the chinese deal is better.
 
.
I thought turkey was messing with Raytheon etc to get better deal.
They still might be you never know.


Raytheon... Ok ok you win turkey we lash 1 Billion off price.
 
.
As latest reports indicated that The requirements of T-LORAMIDS tender changed and The project model is arranged as co-development, co-production for Long range air defence missiles to be selected. Such reports clearly pointed out risen Chinese chance with latest arrangements on tender.

I mean Turkey will use Chinese systems/expertise/some subsystems to develop a Turkish FD-2000 equivalent togather with China and integrate Turkey's network centric warfare environment (I think). Most probably, Exporting rights of Turkish FD-2000 will be owned We will see...

I know its a late response, but Turkey will gain a lot of advantages by just exporting it to Azerbaijan or all those African and middle eastern countries. Recently, when i heard from Bayar, he said, the main goal was a SAM against aircrafts, but not missiles because all of them have low probability against missiles. I think, they choosed HQ-9 because it can search and track stealth fighters with its passive radar which is going to be very important against 5th generation aircraft. However, Turkey will also work on its other radars against Ballistic missiles.
 
.
I know its a late response, but Turkey will gain a lot of advantages by just exporting it to Azerbaijan or all those African and middle eastern countries. Recently, when i heard from Bayar, he said, the main goal was a SAM against aircrafts, but not missiles because all of them have low probability against missiles. I think, they choosed HQ-9 because it can search and track stealth fighters with its passive radar which is going to be very important against 5th generation aircraft. However, Turkey will also work on its other radars against Ballistic missiles.

I'm sure after the result of this project we will start our indigenous advanced(More advanced then FD-2000) long range air defence system... Both for naval, land...

I think this deal with China has so many good ways and one of them is this deal will be our step to jump a boost for advanced air defence family...
 
.
I'm sure after the result of this project we will start our indigenous advanced(More advanced then FD-2000) long range air defence system... Both for naval, land...
Actually, that was the part of deal. They will purchase FD200 and also coproduce another system that all export rights will be in Turkey's hand. within 3-4 years,(in 2016-turkey will also start producing its own long range radar) Turkey will have all these technologies and might start exporting them.
 
.
Actually, that was the part of deal. They will purchase FD200 and also coproduce another system that all export rights will be in Turkey's hand. within 3-4 years,(in 2016-turkey will also start producing its own long range radar) Turkey will have all these technologies and might start exporting them.


The roadway was something different than current until the day when SSIK meeting held but Something went out of planned schedule and other options were driven background and selected 12 batteries of Chinese system. That's why Our honourable proud institutes Aselsan/Roketsan is ripping themselves to develop domestic Long range SAM at present. They know very well that Once production of 12 batteries(288 ready to fire missiles simultaneously) of Chinese SAM commenced, There would be no need of development domestic missiles.
 
Last edited:
.
Indeed NATO is retarded. :lol: If China and Turkey are able to do a clean job and secretly of studying and modifying the system. There is nothing NATO can do about it.

We Chinese are not really close to Russian. Both come together is becos of strategic need. Turkish need not worry so much of these factor. Rather its you who cannot accept the advancement of China.

As for NATO, I think most of the western member are more leaning towards Greece if war happen between them happens due to religion and racist factor. Turkey was enrol into NATO to counter Soviet Union but Turkey is not crucial any more since Soviet had dissolves. Remember how EU try to keep Turkey out for so many years.
Dude, you are really godd about the region. ALl of your posts are true and i really appreciate your politic view. keep it up ;)
 
.
Back
Top Bottom