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Stalin killed Netaji, Subramanian Swamy says

Please let me 'ruin'(sic) it. :( Please. :)

You have already ruined it enough .
Do not fill this thread into your anti Nehru and anti Gandhi rants ...

If you truly wish to discuss the issues then create a separate thread and tag people who are interested ( including myself )

If you continue with your off topic anti Gandhi , anti Nehru rants that are not pertinent to the topic of thread ..all such posts will be reported . Be rest assured about that .
 
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You have already ruined it enough .
Do not fill this thread into your anti Nehru and anti Gandhi rants ...

If you truly wish to discuss the issues then create a separate thread and tag people who are interested ( including myself )

If you continue with your off topic anti Gandhi , anti Nehru rants that are not pertinent to the topic of thread ..all such posts will be reported . Be rest assured about that .
Oh, I see.

So you want me to talk about Netaji's murder without bringing in the names of the 'Usual suspects'?

Why? Because your masters are going to be offended? So what are you planning instead to counter that? Do a Charlie Hebdo on me or hire 'secular reluctant fundamentalists' to do the job instead? :azn:
 
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Oh, I see.

So you want me to talk about Netaji's murder without bringing in the names of the 'Usual suspects'?

Why? Because your masters are going to be offended? So what are you planning instead to counter that? Do a Charlie Hebdo on me or hire 'secular reluctant fundamentalists' to do the job instead? :azn:

Do you have ability to understand what is written ?
I doubt so ....let me simplify this further .

I told you that you stop your off topic rants such as how Gandhi did not bat his eyelid when Bhagat singh was hanged etc ...which is not directly related to topic of thread .
If you have anything that directly or indirectly implicates Nehru-Gandhi with Netaji's death ...then do post .while doing so also watch your language carefully.

Or else all your off topic posts will be reported .
 
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Among the leaders he chose only Col Shahnawaz Khan chose to stay in India. As for the rest like General Habib ur Rehman of the INA 1st Division went to Pakistan in 1947 and immediately trained mujaheeds, invaded and captured West Kashmir from evil Hindus. :D

So?

How does change the fact Bose had authoritarian leaning and a secular leader?

And Gandhi gladly accepted Bhagat Singh's hanging without batting an eyelid. :P

So?

We are discussing Nehru, lets not shift the goalposts.

I don't hate Rahul Gandhi. I hate his politics. Not him. Nehru was no giant. He was a wannabe, a despot and a dreamer. :) And I am being more respectful to him than I should be. I don't deny his contributions (actually one) - that of ruling India non stop for 20 years. That gave us some stability. But that was not his primary intention. His Cabinet was a paper one, he ruled almost by diktats, made a mess of foreign policy, screwed up the military, institutionalized anti Hinduism as dominant state narrative etc. Nehru fans love him for these very reasons. But I don't for the same. :D

The problem with your posts is they are not backed up by facts. I understand you consider Nehru to be so and so, however as long as you dont put your facts where yout mouth is, they remain, mere opinions.

Nehrus foreign policy, namely non alignment is still being follower by India. Which is why we have good relation with both Iran and Israel, russia and ussr.

That being said Nehru wasnt devoid of blunders, his policy towards China was disastrous to say the least.

There are many other things for which Nehru deserve the credit - helping the nacent democracy to survive and grow, pioneering heavy industries, IIT/IIMs, 5 years plan, making india a nuclear power etc etc.

Was he without any fault? Could he have done more to overall literacy instead of focusing on elite institution? Did he **** Mrs Mountbatten?

These are valid question and one has the right to ask? However instead of indulging in a meaningful criticism all we do is to peddle weird conspiracy theories !
 
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Interview: "On Bose death, Nehru committed the original sin"
Posted by: Vicky Nanjappa Updated: Tuesday, January 13, 2015, 15:43 [IST]

Bengaluru, Jan 13: Will the mystery surrounding Netaji Subhash Chandra Bose ever be solved? Was Netaji killed in an air crash or was he eliminated by Russian dictator Stalin as claimed by Dr Subramanian Swamy? These are all mysteries and once the government de-classifies the files the truth will be known to all.

Anuj Dhar's latest book India's Biggest Cover up has gone into details of this mystery. In this interview with Oneindia, Dhar said had there been a Congress-led government at the Centre, there was no chance of the files being de-classified.

However, he has full faith that the government of the day will de-classify these mystery files.

Dr Subramanian Swamy recently said that Bose was killed by Stalin. What are your views on this?

Going by available data, I am convinced as a researcher and former journalist that Netaji was in Soviet Russia after August 1945, when he reportedly died in an air crash.

The story of the crash had been planted by the Japanese to let Bose make good his escape to the only country which could have given him shelter at that point in time.

In fact, months before the Second World War ended, Bose had been preparing his next move to keep his struggle on. He wrote a letter to Russian ambassador in Tokyo in October 1944, seeking Russia help in Indian freedom struggle.

Soviet Russia and Japan had remained friends till about the end of the war in 1945. There are intelligence reports suggesting that Netaji made a secret trip to Soviet Russia in December 1944 to discuss Indian situation.

From the start, Subhas Bose had been pro-Russia in his outlook and the Russians reciprocated. They saved Netaji's life in 1941 by helping him escape to Berlin.

Otherwise, he would have been apprehended and executed in Kabul. To think therefore that the same Russians, the same Stalin regime, would eliminate him after he had been given shelter in their country defies logic.

But then, a strong suspicion persists in New Delhi circles in view of Stalin's brutal track record. However, suspicion is not evidence. Dr Swamy is correct, in my view, when he says that Bose was in Russia. He is rendering national service yet again by flagging the matter. However, there is no evidence as of now to show that Netaji was killed in Russia.

Do you have any expectation that this government will declassify the files?

For the first time we have a government whose several ministers either publicly or privately have committed themselves to do something about the settling the controversy surrounding Netaji's fate. Hence, I do expect that this government would do something, provided it sees widespread public outrage.

While denying me relevant information in November last year, the Prime Minister's Office stated that there was no larger public interest in seeking release of classified Netaji files. Now, the onus is on the public to belie this misconception.

The Modi government, unlike that of Dr Manmohan Singh, is susceptible to public pressure over the Netaji matter. Come hell or high water, a Congress-led government would have never told the truth; but one led by BJP would buckle under pressure.

It is said that Bose faked papers to escape to China. Your views:

Today it stands established that the news of Netaji's death in an air crash in Taiwan was planted by his Japanese benefactors in order to create a smokescreen so that he could escape to Soviet Russia, via Manchuria.

The entire story of Netaji's death was based on the statements of a few "eyewitnesses", including his fiercely loyal ADC Habibur Rahman.

Colonel Rahman's interrogation reports, declassified in 1997, clearly bring out that he was not being truthful about his leader's death. He even dropped hints to Netaji's brother that he was acting under Subhas's orders.

In order to make the story of death appear believable, the Japanese passed off the body of a solider named Ichiro Okura as that of Netaji's. The ashes kept in the Renkoji temple in Japan today are of this Japanese solider only. That's the reason why our Government, which knows the truth, hasn't carried out a DNA test on these remains.

Was Nehru aware that Bose was killed by Stalin?

There is considerable data on record to show that Government of India received enough intelligence to suggest that Netaji could have been in Soviet Russia. Nehru sent his own kid sister Vijayalakshmi Pandit to Soviet Russia as free India's first representative.

But she wasn't even granted an audience with Stalin, who, on his part, hated Nehru. Stalin viewed India suspiciously as a commonwealth state. Therefore, to think, as Dr Swamy does, that Stalin got Netaji killed in connivance with Nehru makes no sense.

Officially, Government denies that the issue of Netaji was ever taken up with the Russians in the Nehruvian era. Unofficially, it has been alleged that both Pandit and her successor Dr Sarvepalli Radhakrishnan came to know about Netaji's presence in Soviet Russia but the government left Bose out in the cold.

Why do you think the government of the day did not act on Bose issue?

Initially all leaders -- Gandhi, Nehru and others -- felt that Bose was alive. Making a statement as the Home Member (Minister) Sardar Patel said as late as October 1946 that the interim government was not in a position to confirm the news of Bose's death.

A sudden turnaround came towards late 1946 as Jawaharlal Nehru announced that Bose had died in Taiwan.

This was the original sin and from that time it has become a sort of gospel for our government and official historians. Ministers come and go but this eternal truth remains the same.


All efforts have been made since that time to twist evidence and narrative so that it can conform to the gospel as spoken by Nehru. Eventually Patel also fell for it and today for the BJP the trouble would be that if Nehru's stand is shown to be false, so would be Patel's.

Given the current situation of our government sitting on piles of classified records and refusing to seek access to the secret Russian records, getting all the answers and explanations is not possible. The gap is at times filled by conspiracy theories.

It was stated once in Parliament by a member that the reason for Nehru's changed stand was his meeting with Louis Mountbatten, the Allied commander who crushed Japanese army/INA challenge in SE Asia and would be first Governor General of free India.

It was stated by that particular lawmaker that Mountbatten asked Nehru a simple question. "If Bose comes back to India, who will be the Prime Minister?" Bose did not die in Russia, but the role of the Indian established, especially of Nehru, was most negative in the entire matter.

Interview: "On Bose death, Nehru committed the original sin" - Oneindia
 
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@SarthakGanguly
Offensive posts were reported . since you had replied to post with offensive language ..your reply got also removed ( although it was not reported ) .

You are welcome for meaningful discussion . avoid resorting to uncivil language .
 
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@SarthakGanguly
Offensive posts were reported . since you had replied to post with offensive language ..your reply got also removed ( although it was not reported ) .

You are welcome for meaningful discussion . avoid resorting to uncivil language .
I had to unignore you to read this. Quoting me is usually meaningless - 99% of the time I will not be able to read it. :(
 
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ever thought why soon after independence we shifted towards soviet union for our defence supplies?
we were made to....bcos of the greedy bastards like nehru...Soviet union blackmailed nehru saying that they would release bose if we dont buy from them...bose was a popular figure and a worthy pm candidate...so our greedy bastard sold the nation so he could bcom the pm!

Nehru was the first PM of India and did a relatively good job of it. Stop conjuring stupid conspiracy theories to satisfy your morbid fantasies.
 
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I had to unignore you to read this. Quoting me is usually meaningless - 99% of the time I will not be able to read it. :(

It is ok ..if you choose to ignore the post.
I had to reply because you tagged me ...to the post who was using offensive language against Mr Nehru .
 
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So?

How does change the fact Bose had authoritarian leaning and a secular leader?



So?

We are discussing Nehru, lets not shift the goalposts.



The problem with your posts is they are not backed up by facts. I understand you consider Nehru to be so and so, however as long as you dont put your facts where yout mouth is, they remain, mere opinions.

Nehrus foreign policy, namely non alignment is still being follower by India. Which is why we have good relation with both Iran and Israel, russia and ussr.

That being said Nehru wasnt devoid of blunders, his policy towards China was disastrous to say the least.

There are many other things for which Nehru deserve the credit - helping the nacent democracy to survive and grow, pioneering heavy industries, IIT/IIMs, 5 years plan, making india a nuclear power etc etc.

Was he without any fault? Could he have done more to overall literacy instead of focusing on elite institution? Did he **** Mrs Mountbatten?

These are valid question and one has the right to ask? However instead of indulging in a meaningful criticism all we do is to peddle weird conspiracy theories !
I brought Bose because he was not just pushed to the wall, but simply toppled and dumped from the balcony so to speak. He was quite simply a nationalist. His authoritarianism could never be proved.

Incorrect. I was not even born when Nehru ruled. All my opinions have been from books. Books that are written by stalwarts - ranging from Communists to Marxists to Congressis. Being a Kashmiri, I have sufficient soft spot for him as well. But that's where it ends. The folks who like him like him because of ONE and ONLY ONE reason. - He was 'secular'.

As for his economic policies, this is not the right thread, we had a discussion as @DRAY could point you out. I take it as a mixed bag. Okay for the time being. The Socialist model that is. Disastrous, even suicidal for the long run.
On the aspect of literacy, the IITs and institutes of higher learning were an initiative of Maulana Azad, and NOT Nehru. Besides, given his elitism, it is not an accident that he did not bother much about more mass literacy programs.
Whether he ***-ed Lady Mountbatten is something I am NOT interested in. If he did, good for him, I don't care. That's his personal life. I don't care about his bedroom/s but his PMO office, his Cabinet that remained almost a paper Cabinet for much of his rule. And his perennial ignorance and neglect of the Army and pathological hate for Hinduism could not be missed.

As far as conspiracy theory goes - it's juvenile to dismiss these as conspiracies as the papers are still classified and every theory is just a theory. I am highly disappointed by the partial declassification of the files. I hope the secrets are divulged soon. That should solve all the mysteries. I might still go and salute his numerous statues. Otherwise I will just ignore the bird-pooped neglected remnants of his legacy.

It is ok ..if you choose to ignore the post.
I had to reply because you tagged me ...to the post who was using offensive language against Mr Nehru .
I am afraid you had a misunderstanding. I tagged you because offensive language was being used against someone innocent.
 
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Nehru was the first PM of India and did a relatively good job of it. Stop conjuring stupid conspiracy theories to satisfy your morbid fantasies.

Netaji didn't die in that plane crash, if that was so then there would be barely anything to hide for last 67 years. Revealing whatever happened to Netaji will not going to destroy our foreign relations with any country, it's been 67 years now, that USSR now doesn't exist, Stalin is mostly hated by Russians, Japan & Germany are friendly to US and Britain, Russia on the other hand is unfriendly to US & Britain, Japan and China doing heavy trade, come on, the world has changed. We are left with only one possibility, that revealing what happened to Netaji will only destroy someone very important for us, be it Nehru, Gandhiji, or Netaji himself. I say, reveal it, we have a right to know.
 
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Netaji didn't die in that plane crash, if that was so then there would be barely anything to hide for last 67 years. Revealing whatever happened to Netaji will not going to destroy our foreign relations with any country, it's been 67 years now, that USSR now doesn't exist, Stalin is mostly hated by Russians, Japan & Germany are friendly to US and Britain, Russia on the other hand is unfriendly to US & Britain, Japan and China doing heavy trade, come on, the world has changed. We are left with only one possibility, that revealing what happened to Netaji will only destroy someone very important for us, be it Nehru, Gandhiji, or Netaji himself. I say, reveal it, we have a right to know.

Yes I agree with you. But until we know the facts, let's not come up with stupid hyped up conspiracy theories
 
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In short, Netaji didn't die in that plane crash, he escaped to Russia as confirmed by several spy agencies of that time including British. Later Russia jailed him on demand of British. Either he died in Russian jail, or he was killed there, or he was released at some point on condition of keeping his identity a secret. In that case Netaji came to India and lived in different places and finally died as Gumnaami Baba, as claimed by Justice Mukherjee of Mukherjee Commission off the record.

What Nehru did was:

1. Sabotaging Netaji's original plan to cause a mutiny in India against British inspired by the Azad Hind Fauj by branding him as an enemy of India and saying that 'he will fight against Netaji with a sword'; thus confusing the general public and Indian British army. The mutiny did happen, but later when the Azad Hind Fauj generals were on trial, that Bombay Mutiny was actually one of the primary reasons of our freedom.

2. Nehru signed an agreement with British to hand over Netaji to British if he was ever caught, thereby blocking any possibility of Netaji returning to India.

3. Nehru was instrumental in Netaji's arrest in Russia.

Bull shit
 
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The problem is, conspiracy theories are coming up because the govt. is hiding the files. It's natural human tendency!



Which part? Please point out, then we can discuss.

Perhaps there are no "files". Why would the BJP want to cover up the f up of a founding member of Congress ?
 
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