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Selex ES radar & other technology on JF-17?

@hellfire while your points are valid they are moot. The PAF will certainly use cruise missiles in any conflict (conventional unless faced with mortal threat). It is why they were developed. Their use may or may not trigger a nuclear response from India (which has a no first use policy). If India assumes that all missiles (and i mean non-ballistic in this case) will have nuke tips and it miscalculates and crosses the nuclear threshold first then it is going to cause the nuclear war, not pakistan and it will deal with the International fallout. Yes millions will die on all sides and could start a nuclear holocaust. That ambiguity is the entire point of Pakistans non-declarence of no first use. It must fit into India's calculus if they will mistakenly be the ones that cross the threshold. This is precisely why even a low scaled conflict and the risk of IAF strikes against Pakistan is so dangerous and as a result unlikely. The risk of mistake and nuclear conflagration is too high for both sides. It is all that has prevented war in the last 18 years. It is also the reason PAFs development of conventoonal strike is so important. Believe it or not, if India understands Pakistan is statisfied with a conventional deterent, it lowers the risk of nuclear war, but for that to work PAF must have a competent conventional strike deterent and Flankers (and JH-7B IF FLANKERS ARE UNAVAILABLE) alomg with small numbers of H-6K are so valuable.

As for India's ability to monitor Pakistan this we already know, but with PAFs larger number of AWACS and their ability to see deep into indian territory, Pakistan will also know about a strike long before it reaches Pakistan. Additionally IAF does not have the means to take out the H-6K from inside india if it sits deep in Pakistan. But H-6K does have the ability with Babur to hit radar and FOBs of IAF from deep inside Pakistan. Will it cripple IAF... No but woll limit its ability to perform actions in Pakistani airspace to a great degree if their strike packages need to return to airbases much further off.

I don't know why people on PDF continue bringing H-6K & JH-7 family into discussion when PN & PAF have rejected them, India can hit those birds with ease and due to there limitations PN & PAF are not interested.

PAF is currently struggling to fill the numbers of 4th gen fighter jets to replace extremely aging fighter fleet. PAF & PN will go for J-11 or similar jet (if available/possible) due to multi role capabilities, if not possible then standoff munitions & more advance submarines are their way to go for now.

In any future conflict with India PAF will work with PA and both will use there assets for combined deep strikes against priority targets using long range weapons (now even PN is slowly coming in this picture).

I thought PAF rejected Jh-7b based on it's old design, engine and payload.
If Chinese redesign it to be 4 or 4.5 generation fighter/bomber than there is a possibility that PAF might consider it.


may be this kind of design.........
images786513_JH_7B.Phunutoday.vn.jpg

images786553_images786515_JH_7B9.Phunutoday.vn.jpg

You are right about rejection, I had discussed it with PN people and they said that China it self is working for future replacement of JH-7 series with new aircraft and there are many projects under progress in China which are not public and those are on radar of Pakistan.
 
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the max they can build can do is 25/pa but they are building 16 pa. but thats at pac. chengdu is the same. it can 30+ from both facilties combined

They need to buy more IL76 aircraft, so the product rate at PAC will become higher :)
 
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I believe in glory and valor of our armed forces..........but...........I just couldn't find a single line of your comment with which i can disagree.

I am civilian, knows nothing about war and its toys but even if i was called to outline/set the objective of war with enemy. I will make sure that children and women of enemy nation won't be able to sleep at night peacefully. Bombs must be dropping everywhere here and there around their homes. There must be chaos and panic. Stock market should be collapse faster than our eye brinks. Tourists and investors should be in line to get out of enemy country and all beautiful land of enemy, blessed with greenery, should be destroyed in a way that no one can even recognize that once there was a greenery there...

This is called aggression. This is how you strike fear in enemy's heart. This is how all warrior nations fight. US & UK bombed the hell out of Dresden (German historical, cultural city and mostly civilian populated at that time, no significant troops were there). Germans still haven't forgotten the merciless bombing of Dresden

An internal UK RAF memo spreads some light on the reason for the bombing:

“Dresden, the seventh largest city in Germany and not much smaller than Manchester, is also far the largest unbombed built-up the enemy has got. In the midst of winter with refugees pouring westwards and troops to be rested, roofs are at a premium. The intentions of the attack are to hit the enemy where he will feel it most, behind an already partially collapsed front, to prevent the use of the city in the way of further advance, and incidentally to show the Russians when they arrive what Bomber Command can do.”

RAF January 1945

Now, here in Pakistan, everything is contrast of what it should be. From our diplomacy to military, everything is in defensive mode. Heck, and we are facing a very strong and highly motivated enemy just standing right next to us, which is trying her best to maintain superiority over Pakistan in everything at all cost. What do we guys think, why Indians always try to stop any western stuff going to Pakistan? Because they want to make us desperate and helpless, they are trying to corner us, they are trying to over match us in everything. In short, they are trying to lower down the cost of war and damage they'll have if war with Pakistan happens.

I am tired of this defensive approach, Indians went for Nukes, we went for Nukes. Indians bought Rafaels, we are looking to counter it. The only thing we have made which India doesn't have, are tactical nukes, even these we developed in response to Cold start Doctrine. India is driving us crazy and we are looking stupid. How about if we become trend setter instead trend follower, how about we set and make our own destiny instead of cursing and relying on it.

You said: There is technology available that you can put an exoskeleton on a donkey to make it roar and deadly as a lion---or in other case you can put in an endoskeleton as well.

It is nothing new. It is called ART OF WAR by Sun Tzu.

'Appear weak when you are strong, and strong when you are weak.'

It is all about perception making and management. Don't know about us but Indians have well learnt it. Thats why they are keep repeating Pakistan and terrorism in same breath and sentence. We need to understand this.

Be innovative or die.


Heck, now, its a matter of time when militaries will be make their stuff and soldiers invisible. Read.

Phantom Bogey; Hyperstealth's Deceptive Decoy Technology - Soldier Systems Daily

Hyperstealth's Light Bending "Quantum Stealth" can bend laser beams

We need aggressive and innovative diplomacy and military not traditional one who is always in defensive mood and look stupid.

Hi,

I thank you for the post---.

I I had discussed it with PN people and they said that China it self is working for future replacement of JH-7 series with new aircraft and there are many projects under progress in China which are not public and those are on radar of Pakistan.

Hi,

Nothing better is expected when two illeterates talk---. You think those PN or PAF types are extremely literate in what they are saying back to you---.

They are full of B S.
 
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Hi,

I thank you for the post---.



Hi,

Nothing better is expected when two illeterates talk---. You think those PN or PAF types are extremely literate in what they are saying back to you---.

They are full of B S.

I don't agree with you because those people are well versed about issues and tech.
 
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Your pictures says it all. There are only so much aircraft i can airlift. If i had more airborne transporters, the "in-country" product will rise. Get a hint.
Somehow Bilal I don't agree with you. I believe the air lifting of JF-17 kits to PAC is nowhere near the critical path.
 
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Your pictures says it all. There are only so much aircraft i can airlift. If i had more airborne transporters, the "in-country" product will rise. Get a hint.
but how fast can china build the jf-17. example, if i had 100 747-400f's and i sent them to chengdu do you think they will have enough to fill the planes up straight away?
 
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but how fast can china build the. i i had 100 747-400f'sand i sent them to chengdu do you think they will hve enough to fill the planes up.
I'm curious as to why an Englishman would be interested in Pakistan's affairs?
 
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I don't know why people on PDF continue bringing H-6K & JH-7 family into discussion when PN & PAF have rejected them, India can hit those birds with ease and due to there limitations PN & PAF are not interested.

PAF is currently struggling to fill the numbers of 4th gen fighter jets to replace extremely aging fighter fleet. PAF & PN will go for J-11 or similar jet (if available/possible) due to multi role capabilities, if not possible then standoff munitions & more advance submarines are their way to go for now.

In any future conflict with India PAF will work with PA and both will use there assets for combined deep strikes against priority targets using long range weapons (now even PN is slowly coming in this picture).



You are right about rejection, I had discussed it with PN people and they said that China it self is working for future replacement of JH-7 series with new aircraft and there are many projects under progress in China which are not public and those are on radar of Pakistan.


I heard Chinese are working on Single engine true 4.5 generation fighter; it will be pretty close to KF-X Design.

KFX-E_KoreanAerospaceIndustries.jpg
 
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I don't know why people on PDF continue bringing H-6K & JH-7 family into discussion when PN & PAF have rejected them, India can hit those birds with ease and due to there limitations PN & PAF are not interested

PAF is currently struggling to fill the numbers of 4th gen fighter jets to replace extremely aging fighter fleet. PAF & PN will go for J-11 or similar jet (if available/possible) due to multi role capabilities, if not possible then standoff munitions & more advance submarines are their way to go for now.

In any future conflict with India PAF will work with PA and both will use there assets for combined deep strikes against priority targets using long range weapons (now even PN is slowly coming in this picture).

Bro you may not know why people here keep talking about these birds and the PAF AND PN may hace rejected it, doesnt make it the right decision. Similarly i dont get why you guys keep talking about J-11/16...understand very clearly, CHINA WILL NOT SELL THESE TO PAF SO AS NOT TO PISS OFF RUSSIA!! Please stop with this unreasonable belief that world politics dont matter to the chinese. They rely on Russia for tech for their aviation industry and Russia was already pissed enough that they copied the flankers... They will lose their shit if China sells them elsewhere.

We can argue about the JH-7 all over the place but the fact is that except for the flanker, there is no aircraft available to them which can carry the weapon load the distance that it can (especially in naval attack). Please everyoneake it very clear JF-17 is NOT A GOOD AIRCRAFT FOR NAVAL STRIKE. It cant carry the sufficient payload any significant distance. Even ACM said that it can only carry 2 c802 and will need a center tank. Or it can carry 1 cm400 and need 2 tanks just to get into the range. That is not ideal when facing a CBG. Jh7 can carry significantly more weaponry much farther. And if escorted by F-16 and JF-17, AND carrying a few SD-10 and an AESA (like the one in J16) it is not an easy target to kill.

H-6K. Well anyone who doesnt understand the value of a strategic bomber does not understand air warfare. This beast will sit deep inside Pakistan protected by AWAC and ground radars to suppprt it and fighter and SAM protection, and launch 1000km saturation strikes deep into India. It will be very protected. The fact that u guys do/d9jt understand doesn't mean it wont work.
 
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but how fast can china build the jf-17. example, if i had 100 747-400f's and i sent them to chengdu do you think they will have enough to fill the planes up straight away?

Never underestimate the capability of the Chinese...lol, but they can build about 30 aircraft a year. The big issue is structural parts of JF17 are not Chinese, and those are very hard to build, and come from other places.

Somehow Bilal I don't agree with you. I believe the air lifting of JF-17 kits to PAC is nowhere near the critical path.

Opinions are such...you don't have to agree. When was the last time you went to AMF? I was there last week.

stay curious

Throw him a bone...lol
 
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Opinions are such...you don't have to agree. When was the last time you went to AMF? I was there last week

Thanks for the enlightenment on 1St hand knowledge.

What are the limitations on the Il-76 assets available?

How many Il-76 trips are need for each JF-17 built?

My line of thought being say, 2 il-76 trips for each JF-17 built, then then even at a relaxed pace, 2 return flights per week by a single 76 will allow over 50 FC-1s per year.

That is my reasoning.

Please if you can, kindly share the reality
 
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