Safe nuclear does exist, and China is leading the way with thorium

[Aramsogo]

You can also make hydrogen through electrolysis. The pumping water is actually used to increase efficiency of nuclear reactors at night.

 

[Zeeshan360]

@below freezing - U have great knwledge abt such things . Good !!

 

[Vinod2070]

This can work. There are 3 factors in favor of solar: 1.) thin film photovoltaics that use 1% of the material for half the efficiency. Wafers are one of the largest costs, but you don't need wafers for thin film. 2.) the process equipment is expensive right now because there is a near monopoly on them by Applied Materials. With Chinese process equipment companies rising, the costs will drop. 3.) Mechanically stable thin films integrated into buildings, as either wall elements or windows, can make the space issue irrelevant if every building is installed with them.

This is great. It should really take off once the costs are competitive. Surprising that one company has the monopoly and is killing the market in such a sensitive field.

You don't need a battery though it would be the best thing to have. Electricity indeed can't be "directly stored" but it can be converted to stable form. You can use solar power to pump water up a gravity gradient in 1 tunnel and when you need electricity, open another tunnel with a turbine. Or use it to spin a heavy, frictionless wheel (possibly one suspended in a magnetic field) that when needed can be attached to a generator to generate electricity by reducing the spin rate. Don't know about the efficiency of this though.

This pumping up water and then running a turbine business can't be very efficient. I guess at most you will get <65% efficiency.

The second one, not sure if it has been tried practically in any significant manner. Storage of electricity is a big problem as of now, needing you to install peak capacity when a much lower capacity could have done if we could store the energy.

 

[Skull and Bones]

You don't need a battery though it would be the best thing to have. Electricity indeed can't be "directly stored" but it can be converted to stable form. You can use solar power to pump water up a gravity gradient in 1 tunnel and when you need electricity, open another tunnel with a turbine. Or use it to spin a heavy, frictionless wheel (possibly one suspended in a magnetic field) that when needed can be attached to a generator to generate electricity by reducing the spin rate. Don't know about the efficiency of this though.

Electrolysis of water seems to be a good idea, and it's quite efficient. But storing Hydrogen and Oxygen near any residential area is hazardous, so this idea won't find many takers. And electrolysis requires pure water (without any impurity, impurities degrade the life of electrodes.), so additional costs and energy has to be spared for purifying process. But this idea is great for industrial purposes.

And now for the pumping water up part, there's nothing as frictionless in the practical world, its in theory only. So there'll be huge energy loss by friction and won't be efficient.

So, as of now the most efficient idea is to sell the excess amount of energy to the power grid, and buyback from them when required. Absolutely hassle free,efficient and cheap.

 

[mughaljee]

how much time this technology will take in commercial purpose ?

 

[tanlixiang28776]

how much time this technology will take in commercial purpose ?

A couple of years.

 

[Skull and Bones]

how much time this technology will take in commercial purpose ?

Which technology?
We're talking about a lot of technologies here, ranging from safe nuclear plants, solar powers or other renewable sources.

Nice to have a constructive arguments with our Chinese and Pakistani friends.

 

[below_freezing]

Electrolysis of water seems to be a good idea, and it's quite efficient. But storing Hydrogen and Oxygen near any residential area is hazardous, so this idea won't find many takers. And electrolysis requires pure water (without any impurity, impurities degrade the life of electrodes.), so additional costs and energy has to be spared for purifying process. But this idea is great for industrial purposes.

And now for the pumping water up part, there's nothing as frictionless in the practical world, its in theory only. So there'll be huge energy loss by friction and won't be efficient.

So, as of now the most efficient idea is to sell the excess amount of energy to the power grid, and buyback from them when required. Absolutely hassle free,efficient and cheap.

Why did I never think of water electrolysis! Great idea for storage, nice and easy. What do you think of a closed cycle though, where pure water is electrolyzed, the gases pumped to a burning chamber like in a coal plant, then the heat used to drive a steam turbine? The water formed just gets condensed, pumped back, and reelectrolyzed. One city could have just 2-3 of these, where all the integrated solar panels feed electricity to these plants which can centrally store H/O and burn it steadily. Or even, if fuel cells can be made massive, just stack fuel cells.

The efficiency would be low (20% for the solar conversion, 40% for the thermal energy for 8% efficiency overall), but sheer volume will make up for it... nm, 8% is pathetic even for "free" energy.

Selling back to the grid though, is probably most realistic.

I just thought of the water pump and the spinning wheel because they seemed obvious, and the wheel actually exists, though it's not frictionless, i was thinking of something suspended in a magnetic field but that's probably way too complicated...

 

[Vinod2070]

Talking of solar energy, there have been talks of beaming the energy from a satellite in a Geosynchronous orbit to earth in the form of Microwaves. The idea is decades old.

Are there any serious plans anywhere around this right now? Or is it considered futuristic?

 

[tanlixiang28776]

Talking of solar energy, there have been talks of beaming the energy from a satellite in a Geosynchronous orbit to earth in the form of Micro waves. The idea is decades old.

Are there any serious plans anywhere around this right now? Or is it considered futuristic?

It works ..........................In Fallout New Vegas.

 

[Vinod2070]

It works ..........................In Fallout New Vegas.

You think it is not feasible? Even in the foreseeable future?

 

[tanlixiang28776]

You think it is not feasible? Even in the foreseeable future?

Anything is possible. Just seems a bit overpriced, difficult, and ineffective compared to feasible power sources like TMSRs.

 

[Skull and Bones]

Talking of solar energy, there have been talks of beaming the energy from a satellite in a Geosynchronous orbit to earth in the form of Microwaves. The idea is decades old.

Are there any serious plans anywhere around this right now? Or is it considered futuristic?

Not feasible, Microwave along with UV rays ionizes the ozone layer and it'll change the structure of water molecules in the earth's atmosphere, which'll adversely affect the plants molecular structure during photosynthesis.

 

[Vinod2070]

Not feasible, Microwave along with UV rays ionizes the ozone layer and it'll change the structure of water molecules in the earth's atmosphere, which'll adversely affect the plants molecular structure during photosynthesis.

I guess it would be a narrow concentrated beam of Microwaves. So should not cause all this on any large scale.

 

[Skull and Bones]

I guess it would be a narrow concentrated beam of Microwaves. So should not cause all this on any large scale.

Still, you'll not get high directivity because of the refraction from the atmosphere and scattering effect.
Still, the ionized water particles will float into the atmosphere and will charge the other molecules in its proximity. The effect will more like radioactivity but far less hazardous though.