Pakistan's Submarine Procurement

[Imran Khan]

 

[EagleEyes]

Pakistan Navy approved it. Pakistan Government approved it. German Government approved it. German company wants to sell it. Now the only thing is.. money. But i dont think that should be a problem despite all the news of economic instability.

 

[was]

All resources to be provided to modernize Pak Navy: PM
Updated at: 0306 PST, Friday, October 10, 2008
All resources to be provided to modernize Pak Navy: PM ISLAMABAD: Prime Minister Syed Yousuf Raza Gilani has said that the government is fully cognizant of the vital role of naval force in protecting maritime security of the country.

The Prime Minister expressed these views while talking to the newly appointed Chief of Naval Staff, Admiral Noman Bashir, who called on him here at the Prime Minister House.

The Prime Minister said the government is aware of the requirements of Pakistan Navy in modernising its fleet and despite financial constraints, would ensure the provision of necessary resources for enhancing its combating potential.

While realizing the prevailing geo-strategic and regional environment, especially in the Arabian Sea, the Prime Minister emphasised that Pakistan Navy should continue to play its due role in the face of contemporary security challenges to safeguard maritime interests of the country.

On the international front, the Prime Minister underscored the need for taking initiatives in the domain of collaborative maritime security to align Pakistan Navy with the contemporary concepts of maritime.

The Prime Minister also felicitated the newly appointed Naval Chief and expressed the confidence that during his tenure Pakistan Navy will touch new heights of professional excellence.

Admiral Noman Bashir informed the Prime Minister that Pakistan Navy is fully capable to thwart any threat.

He said that his new assignment as head of Naval force, he would leave no stone unturned to equip Pakistan Navy in line with the contemporary needs.

 

[metalfalcon]

All resources to be provided to modernize Pak Navy: PM
Updated at: 0306 PST, Friday, October 10, 2008
All resources to be provided to modernize Pak Navy: PM ISLAMABAD: Prime Minister Syed Yousuf Raza Gilani has said that the government is fully cognizant of the vital role of naval force in protecting maritime security of the country.

The Prime Minister expressed these views while talking to the newly appointed Chief of Naval Staff, Admiral Noman Bashir, who called on him here at the Prime Minister House.

The Prime Minister said the government is aware of the requirements of Pakistan Navy in modernising its fleet and despite financial constraints, would ensure the provision of necessary resources for enhancing its combating potential.

While realizing the prevailing geo-strategic and regional environment, especially in the Arabian Sea, the Prime Minister emphasised that Pakistan Navy should continue to play its due role in the face of contemporary security challenges to safeguard maritime interests of the country.

On the international front, the Prime Minister underscored the need for taking initiatives in the domain of collaborative maritime security to align Pakistan Navy with the contemporary concepts of maritime.

The Prime Minister also felicitated the newly appointed Naval Chief and expressed the confidence that during his tenure Pakistan Navy will touch new heights of professional excellence.

Admiral Noman Bashir informed the Prime Minister that Pakistan Navy is fully capable to thwart any threat.

He said that his new assignment as head of Naval force, he would leave no stone unturned to equip Pakistan Navy in line with the contemporary needs.

We hope that both of them will keep their words and wont let the Nation down.

 

[TOPGUN]

How many are we thinking of getting?

 

[metalfalcon]

How many are we thinking of getting?

3 at the moment all to be built in Pakistan by technology Transfer (Thats the main Point)

 

[ejaz007]

Govt to modernise navy despite constraints: PM

ISLAMABAD: The government will provide all necessary resources to the Pakistan navy to enhance its combat potential, despite financial constraints facing the country, Prime Minister Yousuf Raza Gilani said on Thursday.

Talking to the newly appointed naval chief Admiral Noman Bashir at Prime Minister’s House, the premier said the government was aware of the navy’s vital role in safeguarding Pakistan’s maritime interests. Gilani said the navy should continue playing its due role in facing contemporary security challenges facing Pakistan.

He congratulated the naval chief for assuming his office, expressing confidence the navy would improve under his command. The admiral informed the prime minister that the navy was capable of defeating any threat. Noman also visited Chief of the Air Staff Air Chief Marshal Tanvir Mahmood Ahmed at the Air Headquarters. They discussed matters of professional interests. staff report


Daily Times - Leading News Resource of Pakistan

 

[IceCold]

Government will do this, govenment will do that blah blah blah. All words and not action. These are all political statements made by leaders. In reality government is committed to nothing other then the opening up of our borders first to the US and now to India as well.
Anyways see it to believe it. Once the contract gets signed only then we should cherish the news, other then that its the same only story " We are committed".

 

[maqsad]

Four questions:

1. How many billions in foreign exchange is this project going to eat up.

2. Why are german submarines with TOT being purchased now when PN already has purchased a french package with TOT. Were the Agostas not good enough? Wasn't the point of getting the Agostas with TOT so that the PN could manufacture extra submarines locally without having to bleed billions in forex?

3. I am assuming these subs have some technology or capability which puts them in a class well above the French subs. Otherwise any sane person would just build more Agostas and save a ton of money. What are those capabilities?

4. Why even pay extra for TOT if nobody is going to actually use the technology to mass produce the prototypes--or does TOT actually result in cost savings even if further R&D is not done? For instance the nodong missiles were originally reverse engineered and then after that(I am guessing) Pakistani engineers and scientists started producing more customized indigenous missiles. Wasn't the whole idea of TOT for the French subs so that an indigenous submarine industry would get started?

 

[HAIDER]

As we seen last few years, even we do not have enough resources, but still buying state of the art weapons. Its all because China, end evaluator of these weapons are China. China is facing embargo since last 10 years. They have to update its defence in pre-existing geo conditions. As we all know south Korea has recently adopt 214 fleet. China is still behind in sub technology, all Russian akula class or klub class are not proven lethal yet. So, best to update their subs are Pak Agosta and German 212 or 214 class. Both subs are totally different classes both carry European and American weapons. But Russian are not capable of adopting anyother weapon. Extremely limitation in Russian class.

 

[SurvivoR]

So in other words is China funding partly for this procurement?

 

[fatman17]

Four questions:

1. How many billions in foreign exchange is this project going to eat up.

2. Why are german submarines with TOT being purchased now when PN already has purchased a french package with TOT. Were the Agostas not good enough? Wasn't the point of getting the Agostas with TOT so that the PN could manufacture extra submarines locally without having to bleed billions in forex?

3. I am assuming these subs have some technology or capability which puts them in a class well above the French subs. Otherwise any sane person would just build more Agostas and save a ton of money. What are those capabilities?

4. Why even pay extra for TOT if nobody is going to actually use the technology to mass produce the prototypes--or does TOT actually result in cost savings even if further R&D is not done? For instance the nodong missiles were originally reverse engineered and then after that(I am guessing) Pakistani engineers and scientists started producing more customized indigenous missiles. Wasn't the whole idea of TOT for the French subs so that an indigenous submarine industry would get started?

ToT dosnt mean "independence". one still has to depend on the supplier for spare parts and in the agosta case, there are issues as French Navy does not operate this system. the probable switch to the german sub improves the spare parts availability due to a large industrial base /sector behind this segment.

 

[Kasrkin]

Still begs the question though? Which ones are better? Dont get me wrong, I'm all for diversifying our sources. But it does make me wonder...will the French Agosta's be like our F-16s and the German 214 like our J-10s or the other way round (if you know what I mean)?

 

[fatman17]

Still begs the question though? Which ones are better? Dont get me wrong, I'm all for diversifying our sources. But it does make me wonder...will the French Agosta's be like our F-16s and the German 214 like our J-10s or the other way round (if you know what I mean)?

i would like Jliu our RAN naval expert to comment on your post. as far as i remember both platforms are at par with maybe specific advantages. what these are we would have to wait for Jliu!

 

[Black Stone]

So in other words is China funding partly for this procurement?

That could be true, as I am aware the Pakistani financial situation is not good. Besides, who knows what Pakistan and China are upto. The Chinese could help Pakistan financially and in return Pakistan shares some tech/info with them.

The Chinese hunger for western tech. and since they are under embargo, this seems like a good loophole.