Pakistani educated anarchists and How Altaf H. won Punjab

[Norwegian]

Bhuttoism, was anything but 'socialism'............actually an exact opposite of it. On paper and in speeches, equality for all. Please tell me how that works for PPP or any of it's followers?

Bhuttoism (Roti, Kapra, Makan) was nothing but forced socialism of entire Pakistan that destroyed our corporate and industrial sector base once and for all:
Nationalization in Pakistan - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

In socialist economics equality for all means everyone is equally poor. Just look at rural sindh

 

[SQ8]

Bhuttoism, was anything but 'socialism'............actually an exact opposite of it. On paper and in speeches, equality for all. Please tell me how that works for PPP or any of it's followers?

As I said, the concepts have nothing to do with the personality worship inculcated in our society.Be it Bhutto, Shahbaz Sharif or Imran Khan.

 

[SQ8]

Ideology of PTI is same as ideology of Pakistan; establishment of a Muslim Welfare state where rule of law, justice governs all aspects of Pakistani society. What has this to do with the cult of Bhuttoism is beyond my understanding. IK is no admirer of socialist economics or class debates. His economics advisor Asad Umar hails from Pakistan's corporate sector as well as Jahangir Tareen from Industrial Sector.

That is a rather vague statement, the PML(N) also says that..how is it different from what they say?
The example of bhuttoism you have not understood is exactly what these vague public consumption statements are about.

Musharraf's finance advisor Shaukat Aziz also hailed from the same sectors but left after the biggest financial scam in Pakistan's history and a hollow consumer finance based revival. That gives me no trust in the PTI gentlemen either as they are just as likely to do the same and leave IK red faced like Musharraf was.

 

[Norwegian]

Musharraf's finance advisor Shaukat Aziz also hailed from the same sectors but left after the biggest financial scam in Pakistan's history and a hollow consumer finance based revival.

He tried to sell off defaulting Steel Mills to an international buyer so that they may bring in new technology in order to improve production. And remember who blocked this sale? Yes, same old corrupt former CJ of Pakistan who did nothing to investigate election 2013's rigging and disparities:
http://www.dawn.com/news/1140591

 

[Donatello]

Ideology of PTI is same as ideology of Pakistan; establishment of a Muslim Welfare state where rule of law, justice governs all aspects of Pakistani society. What has this to do with the cult of Bhuttoism is beyond my understanding. IK is no admirer of socialist economics or class debates. His economics advisor Asad Umar hails from Pakistan's corporate sector as well as Jahangir Tareen from Industrial Sector.

Asad Umar ran Engro into the ground. Go figure. The guy cashed in on his corporate benefits at the right time and left.

 

[Norwegian]

Asad Umar ran Engro into the ground. Go figure. The guy cashed in on his corporate benefits at the right time and left.

When he took over Engro, what was its revenue. And when he moved out, what was it then? I am tired of defending PTI leaders 24/7 if people like you cannot do research on your own:

Even within the core fertiliser business, Umar took Engro from being a local player to a globally competitive one, leading the firm into the $1.1 billion project that set up the world’s largest single-train urea manufacturing plant in Pakistan.

Umar’s 27-year career at Engro began in 1985, when the company was still a subsidiary of ExxonMobil, the global oil giant. “I still remember the exact figure of my first salary: Rs8,170 per month. My boss at the time said ‘Well, frankly they are paying you too much.’” As CEO of Engro Corporation, Umar was paid Rs68.6 million for the year 2011, which comes to a monthly salary of Rs5.7 million.

In addition to his salary, Umar, 50, was also paid in stock and currently owns about 2 million shares of the company, with options to buy another 924,000, according to Engro’s latest available financial statements. At Monday’s closing price of Rs102.47 per share, that puts the value of Umar’s stocks and options at over Rs300 million.

Corporate titan: After 27 years at Engro, Asad Umar calls it a day – The Express Tribune

 

[Donatello]

It wasn't just Asad Umar, it was the whole team. He spent millions on management consulting through Mckinsey to improve performance, plus some of his father's army connections to the General Musharraf and his go aheads for various projects

Asad Umar hails from a Army 'General' family. He made it into Engro because of his 'connections'........wasn't really the best at IBA

Asad Umar saw the energy shortages beforehand etc, and hence left before the revenues started going down for the new 1 billion USD Engro Fertilizer plant.. Same with Engro foods.

The real guy for Engro was Shaukat Mirza.

How do i know all this? My dad worked for senior management position in Engro, in 1990s when engro was still part of Exxon Pakistan.

Asad Umar is a very good friend of ours. Truth however, is truth.

 

[Norwegian]

How do i know all this? My dad worked for senior management position in Engro, in 1990s when engro was still part of Exxon Pakistan.

So why did he join PTI to be exact?

 

[SQ8]

He tried to sell off defaulting Steel Mills to an international buyer so that they may bring in new technology in order to improve production. And remember who blocked this sale? Yes, same old corrupt former CJ of Pakistan who did nothing to investigate election 2013's rigging and disparities:
Steel Mills at standstill - Pakistan - DAWN.COM

Im still not sure why dragging his topic on is relevant to the idea of personality worship. It was the same Imran Khan who also went gaga for the CJ when Musharraf removed him. Had this been 2007 people would be calling Iftikhar Ch the next caliph Umar in jurisprudence and the PTI would be singing his praises.

The focus is on personality worship and its effects on even the "educated" lot. Not who did what.

 

[SQ8]

So why did he join PTI to be exact?

Because every other misfit did. Sheikh rasheed .. generally popular as a "Shunting" rail engine and a "lota" by every definition of the word .. who was once dissed by IK himself now stands beside him in Jalsas. Today apparently there was a rift regarding a statement against the Shaikh-ul-Islam by the Shaikh-ul-Lota which may lead to a tussle soon. The same way Javed Hashmi was lifted up into the air and thrown to the ground.

All blind personality worship of what and when IK says and no different from the Jiyalas dancing to "Dila Teer Bija" at PPP rallies without care the damage their leaders are causing. All under portraits of Bhutto and Benazir.

 

[Donatello]

So why did he join PTI to be exact?

This is something of a paradox. I routinely argue over this with my dad and he with his colleagues (current and former CEOs of various engro companies.)

I believe he saw that Engro would be in trouble financially in future. Think about this, you setup a 1 billion USD fertilizer plant on a massive foreign loan. You don't have natural gas to fuel it. No fuel, not fertilizer, no fertilizer means no sales. No sales means no profit and hence no ability to pay the loans back in the desired time and above all, your stocks suffer. Same with Polymers. Engro foods was made a joke by then CEO appointed by Asad Umar, they couldn't figure the simple supply chain and logistics.

Asad Umar was the CEO of the WHOLE Engro corp and as such like any CEO was privy to information most would not know, like future financial position, loans etc. He was smart, above all, clever. He had made enough money that he could live a life of luxury retiring early. His quoted salary for tax purposes was 6 million rupees per month. He was issued two Mercedes Benz E class. One as a gift and one as a company car. Travelled first or business class. Plus stock options etc.

My analysis was that he thought (around 2011 when Imran started with his jalsas and people actually started to take IK seriously) that the PTI was the next big thing. He bet on it, because if PTI came to power, Asad Umar would be the Minister of Economic affairs or some other powerful position within IK's cabinet. Like any investor, he gambled. Imagine how much $$$$ he could have minted in the government. Consider that, a SHO posted at a police station in Karachi's DHA area makes around 5-10 million PKR per month.
Politics was an excuse to leave Engro with a clean sheet.

There have been very few corporate leaders in Pakistan who could stand shoulder to shoulder with any corporate leader in the west or the east. One of them was Shaukat Mirza. Tragedy and greed got the better of him, or else, Engro would be at least 5-8 times bigger today than what Asad Umar got it.

 

[Donatello]

Because every other misfit did. Sheikh rasheed .. generally popular as a "Shunting" rail engine and a "lota" by every definition of the word .. who was once dissed by IK himself now stands beside him in Jalsas. Today apparently there was a rift regarding a statement against the Shaikh-ul-Islam by the Shaikh-ul-Lota which may lead to a tussle soon. The same way Javed Hashmi was lifted up into the air and thrown to the ground.

All blind personality worship of what and when IK says and no different from the Jiyalas dancing to "Dila Teer Bija" at PPP rallies without care the damage their leaders are causing. All under portraits of Bhutto and Benazir.

Asad Umar is too smart and clever to be compared to idiots like Sheikh Rasheed or Khattaks or whoever.
The guy really doesn't give a damn about PTI's manifesto.

Read my aforementioned post.

 

[Norwegian]

The guy really doesn't give a damn about PTI's manifesto.

I thought Asad Umar himself compiled economic manifesto of PTI?

 

[SQ8]

I thought Asad Umar himself compiled economic manifesto of PTI?

The operating word is economic for Asad Umar.. for the general Manifesto the operating word is General.

 

[Donatello]

I thought Asad Umar himself compiled economic manifesto of PTI?

Well, he tried to. But IK needed someone he could sell.....like look i got this corporate CEO...so people would assume that PTI has got some great advisers. And BTW what is PTI's economic policy? Because i can't seem to find any coherent one.
Funny thing is, Engro Power Gen (under Asad Umar's vision) was set up using loans from China and other sources and equipment sourced from China. Now, Asad Umar and IK seem to be all against PML-N's Chinese investment.

lol