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PAKISTAN REMOTE SENSING SATELLITE (PRSC-EOS)

As with a lot of our R&D orgs, SUPARCO is what it is, sadly.

However, I think SLVs -- and satellite manufacturing -- are of strategic value for SATCOM, IMINT and SATNAV purposes across the PA, PN, PAF and SFC. Moreover, sustaining a space presence will require recurrent satellite production and launches. The cost will pile up and dependency on a foreign power for such a critical area isn't tenable in the long-term.

I don't know if SUPARCO will handle the bulk of the work though. The SLVs are likely a NESCOM type project (since it involves BM rocket tech), while the satellite design and configuration will likely be determined by the armed forces directly. tbh in this case, I think the right move is to completely remove the military/security aspects of space out of SUPARCO so that it can return to its roots as a research institute. I'd rather give SUPARCO a chance to return to what it originally was while leaving SLVs and defence satellites to NESCOM. @JamD
Hmmm SUPARCO lol.

I hope the SLV program is liquid fueled based. I am not sure if NESCOM has expertise in that. Of course there's KRL's Ghauri expertise and I have heard things about a liquid fuelled engine program at SUPARCO too.

Solid fueled SLVs tend to be limited in size and capability but of course are much simpler. Perhaps the final stage plus apogee kick motor can be the only liquid fueled engines. Not sure. But I do agree that SUPARCO should focus on the satellites and not on the SLV.
 
Whatever satellite SUPARCO wants to launch up in space, will be comparable, or inferior to a final year project of a student from a western university. SUPARCO needs to only invest in military satellite technology, which they should have done a long time ago. Indian satellites can monitor LOC in a very detailed manner, while Pakistan is still launching satellites that only reply "HELLO WORLD" to questions. And the funny part is, that each and every single sensor on these satellites is ordered from Ali Express and then taped up in a box, which is then sent back to the fuckin' Chinese, so they can yeet it into space. Its a joke to be honest.
 
Money spent on hq relocation from Karachi to Islamabad. Now Mr Jawad Ch will himself cook biryani and will make satellite in his kitchen.
and that will somehow increase the productivity of suparco? i wonder when will the govt move railway hq, pcb etc from lahore to islamabad?
As with a lot of our R&D orgs, SUPARCO is what it is, sadly.

However, I think SLVs -- and satellite manufacturing -- are of strategic value for SATCOM, IMINT and SATNAV purposes across the PA, PN, PAF and SFC. Moreover, sustaining a space presence will require recurrent satellite production and launches. The cost will pile up and dependency on a foreign power for such a critical area isn't tenable in the long-term.

I don't know if SUPARCO will handle the bulk of the work though. The SLVs are likely a NESCOM type project (since it involves BM rocket tech), while the satellite design and configuration will likely be determined by the armed forces directly. tbh in this case, I think the right move is to completely remove the military/security aspects of space out of SUPARCO so that it can return to its roots as a research institute. I'd rather give SUPARCO a chance to return to what it originally was while leaving SLVs and defence satellites to NESCOM. @JamD
suparco has been a part of shaheen missile program and abdali too, i think. it has the expertise.
 
Siasat dot pk is better for promotion of political parties by supporters, disguised as innocent discussion.
Maryam Nawaz media wing has infiltrated everywhere.
If you want to manipulate people's opinion, at least be honest about it and tell your motives.

I am not a supporter of noon league, but all discussion an attempt to get your opinion across to someone? If you can argue the facts or point out falsification then go ahead.

I don't care about the success of any specific party, i want to see the success of Pakistan.
 
If you can argue the facts or point out falsification then go ahead.
For this I will ask you to check official budgetary documents specially statistical supplement of previou tenure. I don't want to divert thread topic therefore not mentioning anything related to allocation of funds by PML-N you will be surprise to know the contradiction in his post ....

In the end I would only say he is a known political troll who most of the time post off-topic political rants and try to derail the threads.
i want to see the success of Pakistan.
The person you are defending had openly declared that He is NOT PAKISTANI and PROUD on his UK nationality, therefore my simple question to this political creed

Why do they want a particular political party to rule Pakistan while they don't even consider themselves as Pakistani .... ???

Koi logic hai ... ???
 
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For this I will ask you to check official budgetary documents specially statistical supplement of previou tenure. I don't want to divert thread topic therefore not mentioning anything related to allocation of funds by PML-N you will be surprise to know the contradiction in his post ....

In the end I would only say he is a known political troll who most of the time post off-topic political rants and try to derail the threads.

The person you are defending had openly declared that He is NOT PAKISTANI and PROUD on his UK nationality, therefore my simple question to this political creed

Why do they want a particular political party to Pakistan while they don't even consider themselves as Pakistani .... ???

Koi logic hai ... ???

Bro if you know those details please share. TBH i don't remember many sattelite launches in the last few years, or ever for that matter.
 
Bro if you know those details please share. TBH i don't remember many sattelite launches in the last few years, or ever for that matter.
bro it will be a time consuming exercise as I will have to fetch data of all previous years one by one .... therefore I would ask another interested member to do it.

All I can now is that the main reason the Total figure of allocation of funds for space program was seen inflated in PML-N government due to Chinese grant .....
TBH i don't remember many sattelite launches in the last few years, or ever for that matter
not related to Satellite launch but development and upgradation of Satellite manufacturing facility and other programs
 
Here's a labelled graphic that I made using my best estimates. Corrections are welcome.
1630601087379.png

  1. Solar Panels: I have shown these in the deployed position. There are three in total. Two fold out, one is on the "back".
  2. Orbit-boosting thruster: I suspect that that is what it is because it is in the center of the satellite. In case you are thinking why it's on the wrong side for boosting the orbit, I believe that the orbit is boosted by changing the attitude first, boosting, then returning to Nadir. Also, no thrusters can be on the bottom (Nadir) of the satellite because that's where the main camera's aperture is and you cannot have thrusters spewing gas and other garbage near it.
  3. Attitude-control, cold-gas thrusters: Pretty obvious that these are attitude control thrusters. Again, they have to be on the opposite side of the camera aperture.
  4. Nadir-pointing, cold-gas thrusters: Since this satellite needs to point exactly down wherever it is in orbit, it will require constant attitude corrections in one particular direction to keep it pointing down. I believe these are dedicated thrusters for that. This also lets me guess the direction in which the orbit should be:
    1630600320739.png
  5. Star Tracker: I believe this is a star tracker because both sensors are pointed away from Earth and this is mounted on the side opposite to the side facing the sun (and therefore the sensor is in shade).
  6. Main camera aperture: this is probably where the camera's aperture is. The yellow thing is probably a cover that should not be there in orbit (sorry didn't have time to photoshop it off).
  7. Mystery: I honestly don't know what those are, suggestions are welcome. EDIT: These are probably covers for antennae. Thanks to @S A L M A N. for pointing this out.
 
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I don't know if SUPARCO will handle the bulk of the work though. The SLVs are likely a NESCOM type project (since it involves BM rocket tech), while the satellite design and configuration will likely be determined by the armed forces directly. tbh in this case, I think the right move is to completely remove the military/security aspects of space out of SUPARCO so that it can return to its roots as a research institute. I'd rather give SUPARCO a chance to return to what it originally was while leaving SLVs and defence satellites to NESCOM. @JamD

The stupid compartmentalization essentially kills several initiatives right at the grassroot levels.

I have seen SUPARCO handing out research projects for Bachelors & Masters students which involved simulations related to satellite fairing loading during ascent and separation, orbital thrusters, etc. The documents had specific mentions of these projects contributing 'to the Pak-SLV project'. These are the exact words. Will try to find these documents again.

And then again, NESCOM should essentially be the go-to place for SLVs. But with the closed chicken coops that our 'strategic' orgs work in, there can be two SLV projects running in parallel for all we know, with nothing to show for themselves.

I hope the SLV program is liquid fueled based. I am not sure if NESCOM has expertise in that. Of course there's KRL's Ghauri expertise and I have heard things about a liquid fuelled engine program at SUPARCO too.

That program at SUPARCO probably just exists on paper.

Just to point out something that may be a sad fact - KRL's work on the Ghauri program dates back to the late 90s and early 2000s. The human resource probably has retired/moved on. The Ghauri, to the best of my knowledge, has not been updated. And based on available literature, KRL probably doesn't manufacture the Ghauri anymore since missile manufacturing was handed over to NESCOM.

Therefore, I highly doubt that any credible liquid fuelled engine development expertise exists at KRL or NESCOM. It has been around 2 decades since the Ghauri program seemingly concluded.

Solid fueled SLVs tend to be limited in size and capability but of course are much simpler. Perhaps the final stage plus apogee kick motor can be the only liquid fueled engines. Not sure. But I do agree that SUPARCO should focus on the satellites and not on the SLV.

If we are aiming for a 'true' SLV along the lines of the Indian PSLV or GSLV, then solid fuelled motors will probably be a better choice since we HOPEFULLY have the experience of designing, manufacturing, testing and flying them.

Obviously, this is a very wild dream to have. The largest missile we have built is the Shaheen-III or the Ababeel - probably with an all-up vehicle mass of less than 40,000 kg.

Liquid engines can be used in the boosters, upper stages or the apogee kick motor, as you pointed out.

Here's a labelled graphic that I made using my best estimates. Corrections are welcome.
View attachment 775048
  1. Solar Panels: I have shown these in the deployed position. There are three in total. Two fold out, one is on the "back".
  2. Orbit-boosting thruster: I suspect that that is what it is because it is in the center of the satellite. In case you are thinking why it's on the wrong side for boosting the orbit, I believe that the orbit is boosted by changing the attitude first, boosting, then returning to Nadir. Also, no thrusters can be on the bottom (Nadir) of the satellite because that's where the main camera's aperture is and you cannot have thrusters spewing gas and other garbage near it.
  3. Attitude-control, cold-gas thrusters: Pretty obvious that these are attitude control thrusters. Again, they have to be on the opposite side of the camera aperture.
  4. Nadir-pointing, cold-gas thrusters: Since this satellite needs to point exactly down wherever it is in orbit, it will require constant attitude corrections in one particular direction to keep it pointing down. I believe these are dedicated thrusters for that. This also lets me guess the direction in which the orbit should be:
    View attachment 775044
  5. Star Tracker: I believe this is a star tracker because both sensors are pointed away from Earth and this is mounted on the side opposite to the side facing the sun (and therefore the sensor is in shade).
  6. Main camera aperture: this is probably where the camera's aperture is. The yellow thing is probably a cover that should not be there in orbit (sorry didn't have time to photoshop it off).
  7. Mystery: I honestly don't know what those are, suggestions are welcome.

Gotta give credit. I can not imagine how you can put in the time and effort to come up with stuff like this. You have my deepest respect.

As for the 'Mystery' parts, could they be antennas? One each for uplink and downlink respectively.
 
The stupid compartmentalization essentially kills several initiatives right at the grassroot levels.

I have seen SUPARCO handing out research projects for Bachelors & Masters students which involved simulations related to satellite fairing loading during ascent and separation, orbital thrusters, etc. The documents had specific mentions of these projects contributing 'to the Pak-SLV project'. These are the exact words. Will try to find these documents again.
I have been seeing those for a decade at least. Truck ki batti if you ask me.



And then again, NESCOM should essentially be the go-to place for SLVs. But with the closed chicken coops that our 'strategic' orgs work in, there can be two SLV projects running in parallel for all we know, with nothing to show for themselves.

That program at SUPARCO probably just exists on paper.
Maybe. But I know some people there that specifically work on those things and they seem very busy people. So I suspect it is more than paper. But I could be wrong.




Just to point out something that may be a sad fact - KRL's work on the Ghauri program dates back to the late 90s and early 2000s. The human resource probably has retired/moved on. The Ghauri, to the best of my knowledge, has not been updated. And based on available literature, KRL probably doesn't manufacture the Ghauri anymore since missile manufacturing was handed over to NESCOM.

Therefore, I highly doubt that any credible liquid fuelled engine development expertise exists at KRL or NESCOM. It has been around 2 decades since the Ghauri program seemingly concluded.
Again maybe. Dr.Ihtezaz Qamar (ex KRL) has been working on building a liquid-fueled rocket engine at IST for the past 7-8 years. I know that sounds like a toy project but he was given an entire lab for his own, and is left to his own devices because of the clout that he has. So MAYBE there was a serious liquid program running somewhere, which was linked with this university-level program run by Dr.Qamar.




If we are aiming for a 'true' SLV along the lines of the Indian PSLV or GSLV, then solid fuelled motors will probably be a better choice since we HOPEFULLY have the experience of designing, manufacturing, testing and flying them.

Obviously, this is a very wild dream to have. The largest missile we have built is the Shaheen-III or the Ababeel - probably with an all-up vehicle mass of less than 40,000 kg.

Liquid engines can be used in the boosters, upper stages or the apogee kick motor, as you pointed out.
I suspect that that is the Pakistani SLV design. Leverage our expertise in solid rockets and have liquid fueled upper stages for the fine control you need for orbital insertion.




Gotta give credit. I can not imagine how you can put in the time and effort to come up with stuff like this. You have my deepest respect.
I know I might look jobless laikin:
1630608149928.png


As for the 'Mystery' parts, could they be antennas? One each for uplink and downlink respectively.
Good point. These are probably covers since they're too oddly shaped for antennas. Just like the yellow cover for the camera.
 
Whatever satellite SUPARCO wants to launch up in space, will be comparable, or inferior to a final year project of a student from a western university. SUPARCO needs to only invest in military satellite technology, which they should have done a long time ago. Indian satellites can monitor LOC in a very detailed manner, while Pakistan is still launching satellites that only reply "HELLO WORLD" to questions. And the funny part is, that each and every single sensor on these satellites is ordered from Ali Express and then taped up in a box, which is then sent back to the fuckin' Chinese, so they can yeet it into space. Its a joke to be honest.
Are you not getting data from Chinese military satellites to monitor Indian border? Or you do not trust them to provide full data ?
 
Here's a labelled graphic that I made using my best estimates. Corrections are welcome.
View attachment 775048
  1. Solar Panels: I have shown these in the deployed position. There are three in total. Two fold out, one is on the "back".
  2. Orbit-boosting thruster: I suspect that that is what it is because it is in the center of the satellite. In case you are thinking why it's on the wrong side for boosting the orbit, I believe that the orbit is boosted by changing the attitude first, boosting, then returning to Nadir. Also, no thrusters can be on the bottom (Nadir) of the satellite because that's where the main camera's aperture is and you cannot have thrusters spewing gas and other garbage near it.
  3. Attitude-control, cold-gas thrusters: Pretty obvious that these are attitude control thrusters. Again, they have to be on the opposite side of the camera aperture.
  4. Nadir-pointing, cold-gas thrusters: Since this satellite needs to point exactly down wherever it is in orbit, it will require constant attitude corrections in one particular direction to keep it pointing down. I believe these are dedicated thrusters for that. This also lets me guess the direction in which the orbit should be:
    View attachment 775044
  5. Star Tracker: I believe this is a star tracker because both sensors are pointed away from Earth and this is mounted on the side opposite to the side facing the sun (and therefore the sensor is in shade).
  6. Main camera aperture: this is probably where the camera's aperture is. The yellow thing is probably a cover that should not be there in orbit (sorry didn't have time to photoshop it off).
  7. Mystery: I honestly don't know what those are, suggestions are welcome. EDIT: These are probably covers for antennae. Thanks to @S A L M A N. for pointing this out.


1630634950603.png


For comparison - payloads for PakTes-1A were provided by SA's Space Advisory Company. I think for that project a few chinese companies, EADS Astrium, Thales Alenia and Telespazio were all solicited for payload bids but were eliminated due to costs.


'' Consequently, all possible Chinese options including WaveLabs, BIT (Beijing Institute of Technology), NIAOT (Nanjing Institute of Astronomical Optics and Technology) and BISME (Beijing Institute of Space Mechanics and Electricity) were explored for Payload of PakTES-1A. 4. Extensive deliberations were made for development of Payload with BISME/CGWIC during last 2 years. The payload offered by BISME was technically suitable for previous configuration of PakTES-1A.

As the satellite is planned to be dual-launched with PRSS-1, BISME’s payload now seems inappropriate for current configuration of PakTES-1A due to its high mass and power requirement. As PakTES-1A is a technology evaluation satellite, KHTT on payload is one of prime objectives of this project but BISME is highly reluctant in offering KHTT on payload.

Further the final financial proposal submitted by BISME was very high (29 M US $) and found unaffordable / infeasible for the very limited budget (9.5 M US $) of PakTES-1 A project. Therefore option of developing Payload from BISME was dropped.''
 
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View attachment 775142

For comparison - payloads for PakTes-1A were provided by SA's Space Advisory Company. I think for that project a few chinese companies, EADS Astrium, Thales Alenia and Telespazio were all solicited for payload bids but were eliminated due to costs.


'' Consequently, all possible Chinese options including WaveLabs, BIT (Beijing Institute of Technology), NIAOT (Nanjing Institute of Astronomical Optics and Technology) and BISME (Beijing Institute of Space Mechanics and Electricity) were explored for Payload of PakTES-1A. 4. Extensive deliberations were made for development of Payload with BISME/CGWIC during last 2 years. The payload offered by BISME was technically suitable for previous configuration of PakTES-1A.

As the satellite is planned to be dual-launched with PRSS-1, BISME’s payload now seems inappropriate for current configuration of PakTES-1A due to its high mass and power requirement. As PakTES-1A is a technology evaluation satellite, KHTT on payload is one of prime objectives of this project but BISME is highly reluctant in offering KHTT on payload.

Further the final financial proposal submitted by BISME was very high (29 M US $) and found unaffordable / infeasible for the very limited budget (9.5 M US $) of PakTES-1 A project. Therefore option of developing Payload from BISME was dropped.''
Where'd you get that PDF?

Also:
1630675057543.png

Startup idea anyone?
 
Attitude-control, cold-gas thrusters: Pretty obvious that these are attitude control thrusters. Again, they have to be on the opposite side of the camera aperture.
Will any electric drive not work? I think that is why its projected age is 5 years. How does Hubble move?
 

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