Pakistan Navy interested in J-11Bs

[SQ8]

A couple of things..

The F-16 block 60 uses the APG-80.. not the APG-79.. and the GE F110 -132 was chosen specifically since it can provide the power for the radar and cooling at FULL power mode... read up a little...
Im a communications major and my field of work is all in Signal processing.. so I get exactly what Dr Copp has copied in from textbooks.
Perhaps if somebody did know about aerial warfare.. they would look beyond the textbook definitions by Dr Kopp, the figures borrowed from brochures and see how this fits operationally. they would be better placed to comment.

I am a little perturbed as to how you are so convinced on the lack of space on the JF-17's ..
The logic of bigger is better doesnt always work out.. otherwise the Mig-25 with its huge antenna should have been able to look beyond the F-7PG.
His analysis of the FA/18.. is rather simplistic.. and uses a building block.. rather than sculpted approach on operational usage.

 

[Dazzler]

@Darky


Not only you did not write a single post on topic in hand but also entangled me into an off topic issue. If you are so concerned about a debate, lets start a new thread shall we?

 

[DARKY]

A couple of things..

The F-16 block 60 uses the APG-80.. not the APG-79.. and the GE F110 -132 was chosen specifically since it can provide the power for the radar and cooling at FULL power mode... read up a little...

Thanks for correcting me on this I thought APG-79 could fit into F-16 nose aswell

Im a communications major and my field of work is all in Signal processing.. so I get exactly what Dr Copp has copied in from textbooks.
Perhaps if somebody did know about aerial warfare.. they would look beyond the textbook definitions by Dr Kopp, the figures borrowed from brochures and see how this fits operationally. they would be better placed to comment.

Its nice to know you hold such position, I my self have been an electronics student currently finishing off my M.Tech at Jamia............If am not wrong Kopp is an aviation freak and has taken several real time sorties in some of the most modern combat planes possibly including F/A-18.......and has several friends in the aviation circles around the world including many pilots serving in RAAF..........so lets not get into this debate about his capabilities I guess he has got better sources than both of us.

I am a little perturbed as to how you are so convinced on the lack of space on the JF-17's ..

I guess the nose part of JF-17 is similar to tejas which I have seen in real time manufacturing thanks to a senior friend of mine who's currently working for HAL........let me tell you its like baby if you compare it with a flanker nose.

The logic of bigger is better doesnt always work out.. otherwise the Mig-25 with its huge antenna should have been able to look beyond the F-7PG.
His analysis of the FA/18.. is rather simplistic.. and uses a building block.. rather than sculpted approach on operational usage.

Here are some figures about different radars used on Mig 25 foxbat;

MiG-25 RP-25 Smerch-A 47 km 100km

MiG-25 Sapfir-25 66 km 140 km

I think they are lot better than what the chinese copy had at that time.
Try comparing Mig 31's radar which could even track smaller targets like cruise missiles.

 

[DARKY]

@Darky


Not only you did not write a single post on topic in hand but also entangled me into an off topic issue. If you are so concerned about a debate, lets start a new thread shall we?

Thanks buddy.......I guess you've already have had numerous such thread in past and some are running even now I guess........I have no intentions
of myself getting abused by your fellows and get a ban myself.

 

[SQ8]

Here are some figures about different radars used on Mig 25 foxbat;

MiG-25 RP-25 Smerch-A 47 km 100km

MiG-25 Sapfir-25 66 km 140 km

I think they are lot better than what the chinese copy had at that time.
Try comparing Mig 31's radar which could even track smaller targets like cruise missiles.

that is 47km for a fighter sized target..
And a Chinese copy performs much better at times than your Russian ones.

 

[DARKY]

that is 47km for a fighter sized target..
And a Chinese copy performs much better at times than your Russian ones.

Thats 100 km detection and 47 km for tracking.
Agreed with 2nd line of yours though at times yes.......any way
I won't disturbed you anymore here as you have additional duties.
Back on topic.

Thanks on your part of discussion feel free to join in anytime.



P.S.
I can't stop myself laughing on Rickshaw considering your post #134................he made my abdomen ache last night........

 

[desiman]

And the same applies to IAF and MKI love affair, just because IAF has it, does not mean it is superior to anything in the sub-continent, let alone in Asia.

actually it is, and thats a fact, feel free to counter it. The MKI is by far the best in Asia.

 

[TaimiKhan]

actually it is, and thats a fact, feel free to counter it. The MKI is by far the best in Asia.

 

[Mani2020]

when did you start posting such things?lol.

 

[TaimiKhan]

when did you start posting such things?lol.

Extraordinary stuff requires extraordinary stuff.

LOL

 

[Mani2020]

Extraordinary stuff requires extraordinary stuff.

LOL

haha lol thats why i told you to make some childs pack there bags so we don't have to face this extra-ordinary stuff

 

[Bratva]

actually it is, and thats a fact, feel free to counter it. The MKI is by far the best in Asia.

What about Eurofighter of Saudia Arabia? Oh, You forgot, Saudia Arabia is in Asia......

 

[Mani2020]

actually it is, and thats a fact, feel free to counter it. The MKI is by far the best in Asia.

I think you forgot F-15's of Royal Saudi airforce , they have F-15 eagles and F-15E strike eagle and not to mention the new order put by the Saudi's for F-15 silent eagles , you know what silent eagle is . and ouch what abt Ef-2000 in Saudi inventory

And ouch ouch you also forgot F-15's of Japan, North Korea and i can go on and on

But you know wat i m expecting some stupid logic from you because i know you are best at it, i have confronted you in past and i know with how bogus claims you come up with .

So i m done with it , now show the other forum members your talent with your baseless claims. Good Luck

 

[Avatar]

If this news is true it's a serious insult to the JF-17 Thunder. It costs overwhelmingly less than J-11 B's in terms of both procurement and operation. The Navy gets the smallest portion of Pakistan's defense budget and operates on very tight strings. It's not even thinkable that the Navy would choose to induct completely new dual engined platform while the Air Force (who has a much more generous budget) has already been integrating JF-17 squadrons and also complimenting them to be better than F-16's in "some aspects", and the JF-17 overall being able to take out "any of the current threats". I've also heard that Pakistani pilots have flown Chinese J-11 B's alongside the Chinese in Joint Exercises, perhaps even taken out other Chinese J-11 B's with their J-11B or JFT or possibly both. So I see no reason for Pakistani Navy to induct a new so called Chinese aircraft with controversial origins, performance and Russian engine. I would rather suggest PN to develop a JF-17 Naval version or if you got the money, go for Gripen all the way.

 

[Mani2020]

If this news is true it's a serious insult to the JF-17 Thunder. It costs overwhelmingly less than J-11 B's in terms of both procurement and operation.

Why it would be insult to the jf-17? every airforce or navy strives for diversity , why when india has so called naval version of LCA going for mig-29k or rumors of possible F-35? Why your airforce is inducting western n Russian origin aircrafts when they say that LCA is 4.5th generation aircraft? isn't it an insult for LCA?

The Navy gets the smallest portion of Pakistan's defense budget and operates on very tight strings.

The requirment for navy is not that huge one if you notice currently PN is operating ~30 mirages and that too operated by PAF Naval wing , so the requirements of J-11 will not be huge one so that the navy will not be able to accquire it , Utmost 2 squadrons will be acquired by the navy and that too by soft loans facility provided by China which will be splited over a span of 4-5 years

It's not even thinkable that the Navy would choose to induct completely new dual engined platform while the Air Force (who has a much more generous budget) has already been integrating JF-17 squadrons and also complimenting them to be better than F-16's in "some aspects", and the JF-17 overall being able to take out "any of the current threats".

As already mentioned that airforce requirements are much more than navy in case of numbers , and as already mentioned aircrafts are also operated by airforce wing and don't forget that airforce is not only sticking to jf-17's rather they are also going for FC-20 and f-16's

I've also heard that Pakistani pilots have flown Chinese J-11 B's alongside the Chinese in Joint Exercises, perhaps even taken out other Chinese J-11 B's with their J-11B or JFT or possibly both.

To be honest ,not sure about this part

,go for Gripen all the way

Why should we go for gripen when it also has alot of strings attached by having american engine and many other avionics and is embargoed prone , we are moving away from west so going for gripen will just be insanity at its best, also to your information it was evaluated by PAF many years back and was rejected in favor of f-16 block 52+