Pakistan Army's T-129 ATAK Helicopter Deal | Updates & Discussions.

[CriticalThought]

Pakistan is under the impression from Turkey, approved of turboshaft from US for PA will not be a problem - Wrong

Pakistan is under the impression Turkey can quickly replace American engine with domestic one - Wrong (earliest 2026)

I am sure Philippine Armed forces will also think twice getting TA-129. Duterte, president of Philippine is not on very good term with US.....

Well it's a moment of shame for Pakistan as well. We have neglected our own economy, education, and industrial base for so long now, and depended completely on foreign aid to such an extent, that we are now a joke. Countries like America play with us like cat plays with mouse.

If we had our own technological base, we could help our brother countries through R&D. But today, we have nothing to offer at all.

 

[dBSPL]

Pakistan is under the impression from Turkey, approved of turboshaft from US for PA will not be a problem - Wrong

Pakistan is under the impression Turkey can quickly replace American engine with domestic one - Wrong (earliest 2026)

I am sure Philippine Armed forces will also think twice getting TA-129. Duterte, president of Philippine is not on very good term with US.....

While its is China who prove itself. When there is the impression that RD-93 engine will be blocked by India for JF-17. China step up and promised no such problem for the project and delivered. And now we are talking about blk 3 with AESA going to serve PAF soon.... China is a big power with leverage on Russian. Russian badly need Chinese money. Turkey which the most a regional power has no such leverage on western countries and USA.

The military certification process of this engine will take place before, but if Pakistan expects all transactions to be completed, including easa standards, yes you are right, the earliest delivery date is 2026.

Turkey won with nearly 10 years by providing structural and powertrain technology transfer from AW design. During this time, however, quickly completed its shortcomings in the avionics field. From the begining , the ultimate goal is to have directly design capability.

The project, called ATAK-2 program, is the product of this purpose. T129 Atak-1 project model similar to some Russia-China cooperation in many respects.

Turkey's ATAK T129 solution for urgent needs and expectations were more than equalize the battlefield. Thanks to this variant, which has a successful system engineering, we saw the effectiveness of both Turkish subsystems and became ambitious in many tenders around world. For example, the primary variant of this helicopter, A 129, has much weaker ECM equipment and a weaker engine and transmission. In terms of avionics, completely jumped upper class(T129B2).

For us, it doesn't matter what system Pakistan will choose. The only important thing is to eliminate the urgent needs of our Pakistan.

 

[royalharris]

Check the decision maker＇s account

 

[dBSPL]

Check the decision maker＇s account

You represent the newly growing Chinese generation here quite well. Denigration,slandering, arrogance and ignorance. You're really competing with the United States. Now , i believe.

 

[royalharris]

Calm down
It is USA who slap your fat face

If your fat face can feel pain，you should punch back

 

[dBSPL]

In some little dog's dreams... but

 

[HRK]

Use z-10s engines (WZ-9s or the new ones) in T-129.

and Why would China sale Z-10 engine instead of selling us Z-10 ... ???

 

[Beast]

and Why would China sale Z-10 engine instead of selling us Z-10 ... ???

Precisely but most importantly. It not interchangeable... We are talking about million dollar hardware, its not toy that just plug and play.. A new engine fitted in needs redesign and plenty of testing before approved for use. And these will take another 2-3 years of intensive testing..

Why not just buy Z-10ME, you can used it immediately. Tested and combat ready.

 

[Zulfiqar]

and Why would China sale Z-10 engine instead of selling us Z-10 ... ???

It might not.

I wasn't that serious when I suggested that and was talking from technical point of view and not political.

I know it will take years for requalification with another engine but it is doable provided that the dimensions match. F-16 is qualified with several engines in order to diversify supply chain. It shares engine with F-15 as well.

Similarly one prototype of atlas cheetah (a mirage in essence) used Russian engine.

It can be done if the chinese allow provided that engine has similar dimensions/characteristics.

Considering that in future our political alignment will differ significantly from US. It's certainly a wise choice to diversify supply chain of core components.

Alternatively we can go fo Z-10 ME.

 

[monitor]

S-400 blowback? Turkey seeks replacement for US-withheld helicopter engines in $1.5bn export deal
Published time: 30 Nov, 2018 13:25

An LHTEC T800-4A engine (non-export CTS800-4N variant) installed on an AgustaWestland AW159 Wildcat helicopter. ©Lutz Blohm via Flickr

• 31

Ankara and Islamabad have agreed to seek replacement engines for 30 Turkish-made attack helicopters after the US blocked supplies. Some Turkish officials say Washington is retaliating for the purchase of Russian-made missiles.
In July, Turkey and Pakistan signedtheir biggest-ever arms deal, ending four years of negotiations. The Turkish Aerospace Industries (TAI) is to produce 30 T129 ATAK multipurpose helicopters for the Pakistani military for $1.5 billion. The model is a derivative from the Italian Agusta A129 Mangusta, which integrates Turkish avionics and weapons with AgustaWestland’s airframe and has some upgrades.

The deal however hit a stumbling block after the Turkish company failed to obtain an export license from the US Department of Defense. The license is required for the US-made parts of the engines that are meant to power the aircraft. The LHTEC T800-4A turboshaft engines are produced by a joint venture of the US-based manufacturer Honeywell and Britain’s Rolls-Royce.

“This is not a technological or financial matter but is purely political at the moment,” a senior Turkish procurement official told Defense News in August, after the problem arose.

With the license problems seemingly nowhere near a resolution, Pakistan and Turkey agreed to seek a replacement variant for the engines, Turkey’s Hurriyet reported on Thursday. Producers in France and Poland are being considered as potential suppliers, provided that new tests are made to confirm performance in high-altitude and bad weather conditions. The US-British engines were tested on the T129 to conform to Pakistani demands in 2016. TAI hopes it will be able to complete the contract in five years, the newspaper reported.

ALSO ON RT.COMNot good news for the dollar? Russia and Turkey ditched US currency for S-400 missile system deal
The US threw a monkey wrench into the lucrative arms deal to punish Ankara for purchasing Russian S-400 long-range air defense systems in defiance of Washington’s warnings, a senior Turkish defense official told Russia’s TASS news agency. The remarks were made during the IDEAS 2018 arms expo in Pakistan’s Karachi this week. The official said a Chinese product may be considered as a replacement too.

Ankara’s purchase of the Russian weapon system is one of many issues marring Turkey’s relations with the US. The two countries have clashed over the past several years regarding Washington’s support of Kurdish militias in Syria and Iraq and US failure to extradite a Turkish cleric accused by Ankara of orchestrating an armed coup, to name a few.

If you like this story, share it with a friend!

• 31

Trends:Pakistan newsTurkey news Turkey-US news
Reporting what the mainstream media won’t: Follow RT’s Twitter account
FROM OUR PARTNERS

Prostate Cancer: The Symptoms You Need to Recognize Early


Tragic Death Leads To Country Music Star Canceling CMA Awards Appearance


Obama gets angry with heckler

• 
  Artificial intelligence may destroy humanity by accident (but it won’t apologize) - by Lee Camp
• 
  Mile High Club: Pilot uses gay dating app Grindr to hit on passenger MID-FLIGHT

Subscribe to RT newsletter to get stories the mainstream media won’t tell you

 

[HRK]

Considering that in future our political alignment will differ significantly from US. It's certainly a wise choice to diversify supply chain of core components.

In case of T-129 it may happen ....

 

[aziqbal]

and whole point of T129 was so Turkey could sell to 3rd parties without any issues

I guess you want predict political issues though

 

[Hakikat ve Hikmet]

Another reason to avoid the US systems in the defense field!!! Hopefully, it's an eye opener for others too!!! IMO, from the Pak perspective, Turkey's getting S-400 is more important than getting license for T-129 engines!!! With S-400 at hands, already field deployed KORAL EW systems to counter it can be further fine tuned along with putting the entire exercise on the learning curve for indigenous HISAR-U AD systems!!!! Anyway, now the efforts will be re-doubled for the already initiated indigenous chopper motors solution!!! Every Sher has a (K)hair associated with it in this Alem-i Hikmet....

As for ATAK-2, TFX, AZM etc. projects, hopefully, more JVs b/w Turkey and Pak may ensue....

They have understood that the era of deceptions is getting over!!! Now, they want to put frustration, hopeless ness etc., directly from the Kitap-i Iblis, into the hearts of the Ehl-i Iman, who needs to slay these ill feelings with Zulfiker....

 

[-------]

and whole point of T129 was so Turkey could sell to 3rd parties without any issues

I guess you want predict political issues though

The whole point of T129 was tech transfer.

 

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

The engine can be replace it is not a big issue, we should drop another order for 30 more helicopters with Turkish Indigenous Engines