Nearly 100 People Still Missing After Condo Building Collapses in Florida, Officials Reveal

[Hamartia Antidote]

And who can forget the iconic Crockett theme?

Already in post #22

 

[KAL-EL]

Already in post #22

Ohh well.. Referenced it from #27

 

[OIO]

They are pretending to rescue. It is too sad. They are waiting for a suitable time to announce that the rescue is over. The victims are just missing and not dead.

 

[Hamartia Antidote]

Oh and the first season when they introduced the white Testarossa was awesome. lol

Hey you are the South Florida traveler with the boating.

Ever try the convertible thing? Seven mile bridge, etc

 

[Gomig-21]

Of course there were plenty of other artists with memorable songs

lol, Ted Nugent I barely remember that episode. He really acted the dying in that scene lmao. Great stuff.

Nah, I'll take the Daytona Spyder convertible any day. When I took a 45+ day vacation in Florida I rented a convertible for the entire time. That was money sooooo sooooo well spent. Talk about clearing your head. I highly recommend that as therapy.

45 days?! Wow, that's a good bit of time I wish I could take that much time out of work. The most is 2 weeks and we're mostly on the water as you probably know. We did stay on Colonade Road for a week a couple of times and hit South Beach for some super expensive curbside restaurant and watched all the fancy cars drive by and the humanity. Also the building where the famous scene in Scarface with the chainsaw massacre in the hotel bathroom is still there. Always fun to see it and compare to how different it was back then to now. Love Florida, my wife has always wanted to move down there. So do I for that matter. Which boater and avid fishing freak wouldn't, right? Oh and the yachts mama mia. Scary how rich many people are down there. And of course, there's the negative side to all that wonderful stuff in the crimes and crazy stuff that just seems to happen in FLA lol.

I agree, the white Testarossa was flat out awesome.

And who can forget the iconic Crockett theme?

Indeed! I mean it's no Enzo (my favorite BTW) or Laferrari, but it has it's own beautiful charm with those very recognizable side gills.

They are pretending to rescue. It is too sad. They are waiting for a suitable time to announce that the rescue is over. The victims are just missing and not dead.

Come on, bro. Pretending to rescue? Unless you ever really had to deal with any situation remotely close to that, you can't understand the difficulty of dealing with massive piles of incredibly heavy concrete that is pancaked 12 stories or whatever it is and the large amount of people that could be alive under there. It's a no-brainer that there probably is a majority of the 159 people or so that are unaccounted for are probably and unfortunately dead. But even if one little girl that is stuck in a pocket and can be saved, it's worth taking the precautions to save that individual.

Not only that, it's still a search & rescue effort but they're also dealing with a plethora of adversity. The rain yesterday complicated things as water kept rising in the basement of the adjacent/remaining building and under the rubble. The engineers had to come in and post the entire concrete floors that are still attached to the standing building so that they don't bring it down also. Now they're dealing with a massive fire under the rubble that they need to contain and are using foam, water etc. This is not an easy and clear cut removal of an empty building that was demolished on purpose and the cleanup takes a few days. This is a major undertaking with the most important thing to consider and that is lives that can still be saved.

 

[Gomig-21]

Hey you are the South Florida traveler with the boating.

Ever try the convertible thing? Seven mile bridge, etc

Seven mile bridge for sure, bro. Route 1 from Miami and get on it just before Key largo and head to Islamorada to and to several of the other keys. Usually we just get on the boat at Islamorada and head out to Alligator lighthouse for some awesome, clear water and fishing and swimming. Further up you can have a ton of fun catching spinner sharks and all sorts of incredible marine life. Just talking about it is soothing!

 

[Hamartia Antidote]

45 days?! Wow, that's a good bit of time I wish I could take that much time out of work. The most is 2 weeks and we're mostly on the water as you probably know.

Unusual circumstances. The Media company that hired me for a 1 year contract ran out of money after 6 months. So i felt I had worked my butt off for nothing. It was February and snowing. Decided to take a Florida vacation to calm down and skip the winter. They called me up 45 days later saying they got more funding and to fly back.

What..you want me to take the next flight back to Boston...oh mannnn..I'm having such a great time with the convertible.

my wife has always wanted to move down there. So do I for that matter. Which boater and avid fishing freak wouldn't, right? Oh and the yachts mama mia. Scary how rich many people are down there. And of course, there's the negative side to all that wonderful stuff in the crimes and crazy stuff that just seems to happen in FLA lol.

I actually was walking into open houses while I was there. Some places were spectacular at a fraction of the cost up here. Screened in pools...wow.

 

[FairAndUnbiased]

The problem is most people outside the US think there is only farmland outside the city limits. They simply don't understand our definition of a developed country. They also don't understand the US moved away from dense city living in the 1950's. Just like the Chinese started moving into cities in the late 1990's.

His pictures of high rise living gets the same reaction here as Chinese people in cities would react to pictures of farming village life. it's a progression he doesn't understand because they have not got there yet.

China: farming village->1990's multi-story apartment living in cities.
US: farming village->1880's multi-story apartment living in cities.->1950's suburban/city fringe single family homes.

East Asia is just 70 years behind us in their thinking of what "good living" means.

I think you forget your US history and context. Urbanization in the US was always about poor immigrants squeezing into tenements owned by slumlords. All the rich of the 1880s up to 1950s had estates in the country. The poor had no choice.

After WW2 there was a construction boom to accommodate returning vets and to make use of the industrial buildup. The cheapest land was in the suburbs and so new houses were built. Thanks to redlining, white families knew they would not live near minorities. And hence the move to the suburbs: to avoid minorities and the urban poor as the push and low cost big houses as the pull.

Meanwhile Asians have had a vibrant urban culture since the Han Dynasty in China and the Tokugawa era in Japan. Same with Southern Europeans in Rome and Athens. The city was never associated with poverty but wealth. Urban residents weren't slum dwelling immigrants, they were shop owners and professionals even in 200 BC.

In my personal experience, there's also a psychological element. Americans are very touchy about their space, much moreso than Chinese or Italians.

 

[Hamartia Antidote]

I think you forget your US history and context. Urbanization in the US was always about poor immigrants squeezing into tenements owned by slumlords. All the rich of the 1880s up to 1950s had estates in the country. The poor had no choice.

After WW2 there was a construction boom to accommodate returning vets and to make use of the industrial buildup. The cheapest land was in the suburbs and so new houses were built. Thanks to redlining, white families knew they would not live near minorities. And hence the move to the suburbs: to avoid minorities and the urban poor as the push and low cost big houses as the pull.

Meanwhile Asians have had a vibrant urban culture since the Han Dynasty in China and the Tokugawa era in Japan. Same with Southern Europeans in Rome and Athens. The city was never associated with poverty but wealth. Urban residents weren't slum dwelling immigrants, they were shop owners and professionals even in 200 BC.

In my personal experience, there's also a psychological element. Americans are very touchy about their space, much moreso than Chinese or Italians.

Aren't you completely forgetting about the affects of the Industrial Revolution,

availability of new homes built with piped-in natural gas lighting in urban areas, and then the advent of electricity in the 1880's accelerating a population shift from the farmlands to "modern" cities with power plants for lighting/manufacturing jobs/trolleys/subways etc.

Farmers->1880's electricity move to urbanization->1950's suburbanization.

 

[FairAndUnbiased]

Aren't you completely forgetting about the affects of the Industrial Revolution,

availability of new homes built with piped-in natural gas lighting in urban areas, and then the advent of electricity in the 1880's accelerating a population shift from the farmlands to "modern" cities with power plants for lighting/manufacturing jobs/trolleys/subways etc.

Farmers->1880's electricity move to urbanization->1950's suburbanization.

that explains urbanization's pull but not the push - the influx of poor immigrants from Italy, Poland, etc. in the 1880's-1910's. 13 million Italians left Italy in the this era. They formed the core of the US urban poor and were culturally very different than the frontier homesteaders the US had previously attracted. Even today, Italians and Jews are overrepresented in highly urban regions like NYC.

However, US culture was established by Anglo and German homesteaders, who were the 'default' 'white American' culture. For example, Trump's grandfather was a German immigrant but went to the frontier instead of staying in the urban center, only returning to NYC when he already made money. As time went on, other white immigrants assimilated to Anglo-German homesteader values and subconsciously wanted to play ranch owner but without the work, hence why so many suburbanites drive pristine pickup trucks.

 

[Hamartia Antidote]

in the 1880's-1910's. 13 million Italians left Italy in the this era. T

4 Million

U.S. Immigration Timeline: Definition & Reform ‑ HISTORY

A timeline of U.S. immigration shows how, from the 1600s to today, the United States became a nation of people from hundreds of cultures, languages and beliefs.

www.history.com

Yes, being poor meant the most likely place to find a roof and a non-farm job most likely was the city...

However, US culture was established by Anglo and German homesteaders, who were the 'default' 'white American' culture.

Yes, these early settlers were more likely independently minded tough adventurers than your typical needy urban dwellers looking to work for someone else. Hence the gun-culture. So yes, they would not likely want to live in crowded cities...

As time went on, other white immigrants assimilated to Anglo-German homesteader values

Uh huh..hmm...not sure if I'm sold on that logic...seems people choose to live where they are most comfortable.

Now I will state something that most white people like their "space" and their "quiet". This is in total opposition to East Asians who don't mind crowded subway cars or being constantly in a noisy area. So this more likely explains much of the appeal of the suburbs.

and subconsciously wanted to play ranch owner but without the work, hence why so many suburbanites drive pristine pickup trucks.

I'm not German and don't own one but I do know a certain pickup driving suburbanite who being from Egypt..sits at the crossroads of East and West. His opinion should be enlightening.

Hey @Gomig-21 what's the allure of pickup trucks and how did you let yourself be brainwashed by the Anglo-Germans into living in the suburbs? You should be living in a crowded downtown Boston high-rise like a normal person.

Oh and your opinion of crowds vs quiet.

 

[FairAndUnbiased]

4 Million

U.S. Immigration Timeline: Definition & Reform ‑ HISTORY

A timeline of U.S. immigration shows how, from the 1600s to today, the United States became a nation of people from hundreds of cultures, languages and beliefs.

www.history.com

Yes, being poor meant the most likely place to find a roof and a non-farm job most likely was the city...



Yes, these early settlers were more likely independently minded tough adventurers than your typical needy urban dwellers looking to work for someone else. Hence the gun-culture. So yes, they would not likely want to live in crowded cities...



Uh huh..hmm...not sure if I'm sold on that logic...seems people choose to live where they are most comfortable.

Now I will state something that most white people like their "space" and their "quiet". This is in total opposition to East Asians who don't mind crowded subway cars or being constantly in a noisy area. So this more likely explains much of the appeal of the suburbs.



I'm not German and don't own one but I do know a certain pickup driving suburbanite who being from Egypt..sits at the crossroads of East and West. His opinion should be enlightening.

Hey @Gomig-21 what's the allure of pickup trucks and how did you let yourself be brainwashed by the Anglo-Germans into living in the suburbs? You should be living in a crowded downtown Boston high-rise like a normal person.

Oh and your opinion of crowds vs quiet.

reference to 13 million Italians.

people live in places that are economically accessible and legally allowed to, then they will consider other factors.

I'm sure black folks don't love living in the inner city filled with crime, hence why they picked an ex-Republican cop as mayor of NYC. They just can't afford to live elsewhere because of redlining that denies them loans and also denies their neighborhoods investment. In fact, the model postwar suburb of Levittown explicitly forbade blacks from buying homes there.

 

[Hamartia Antidote]

reference to 13 million Italians.

It says:
From 1880 to 1914, 13 million Italians migrated out of Italy, making Italy the scene of one of the largest voluntary emigration in recorded world history.[40] During this period of mass migration, 4 million Italians arrived in the United State

4M to the US
9M went elsewhere. Like Brazil ( look here -> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Italian_diaspora )

They just can't afford to live elsewhere

That is true for anybody. Since the median income of black Americans is lower than many other groups they will certainly have a harder time.

because of redlining that denies them loans

Apparently the two black families in my suburban neighborhood didn't get the memo. I guess the guy in the $1,120,000 house was lucky he was an international drug lord or something and had the cash on-hand instead of dealing with those pesky racist banks.

and also denies their neighborhoods investment.

Yes, redlining occurs. If you live in some inner-city neighborhood with a mediocre job banks will distrust you. Black, white, or green...and yes I'm sure many extremely poor black neighborhoods are on no-go lists.

In fact, the model postwar suburb of Levittown explicitly forbade blacks from buying homes there.

Wow you have to search for an example from 70 years ago.

 

[OIO]

lol, Ted Nugent I barely remember that episode. He really acted the dying in that scene lmao. Great stuff.



45 days?! Wow, that's a good bit of time I wish I could take that much time out of work. The most is 2 weeks and we're mostly on the water as you probably know. We did stay on Colonade Road for a week a couple of times and hit South Beach for some super expensive curbside restaurant and watched all the fancy cars drive by and the humanity. Also the building where the famous scene in Scarface with the chainsaw massacre in the hotel bathroom is still there. Always fun to see it and compare to how different it was back then to now. Love Florida, my wife has always wanted to move down there. So do I for that matter. Which boater and avid fishing freak wouldn't, right? Oh and the yachts mama mia. Scary how rich many people are down there. And of course, there's the negative side to all that wonderful stuff in the crimes and crazy stuff that just seems to happen in FLA lol.



Indeed! I mean it's no Enzo (my favorite BTW) or Laferrari, but it has it's own beautiful charm with those very recognizable side gills.



Come on, bro. Pretending to rescue? Unless you ever really had to deal with any situation remotely close to that, you can't understand the difficulty of dealing with massive piles of incredibly heavy concrete that is pancaked 12 stories or whatever it is and the large amount of people that could be alive under there. It's a no-brainer that there probably is a majority of the 159 people or so that are unaccounted for are probably and unfortunately dead. But even if one little girl that is stuck in a pocket and can be saved, it's worth taking the precautions to save that individual.

Not only that, it's still a search & rescue effort but they're also dealing with a plethora of adversity. The rain yesterday complicated things as water kept rising in the basement of the adjacent/remaining building and under the rubble. The engineers had to come in and post the entire concrete floors that are still attached to the standing building so that they don't bring it down also. Now they're dealing with a massive fire under the rubble that they need to contain and are using foam, water etc. This is not an easy and clear cut removal of an empty building that was demolished on purpose and the cleanup takes a few days. This is a major undertaking with the most important thing to consider and that is lives that can still be saved.

I have watched the video. The rescuers are just doing shows. I know that it is difficult, but if they do show-like rescues in China, they will be scolded to death by the people.

 

[Gomig-21]

Looks like 9 dead so far (RIP) and 152 still unaccounted for which unfortunately I think are also killed by the collapse unless they weren't there and just haven't reported yet. But even so, that would probably be a small number also unfortunately.

It also sounds like the wetlands didn't really play much into this collapse so far. Based on the news, there was an engineering inspection done in 2018 and a report issued that there was a lot of spalding in the concrete and that the repairs needed to be done in a timely fashion and would cost $9milion. They never got done and then there was probably a lengthy work stoppage because of the epidemic and they never got to it.

Spalding is basically because the concrete is porous, and the older it is, the more porous it gets to the point where many of these buildings by the ocean and in hurricane alley need to be damp-proofed so that the salt molecules and water don't penetrate those porous sections and get to the rebar. Once they get to the rebar, it's only a matter of time before the rebar starts to corrode and when it corrodes, it expands and weakens both, the metal and the concrete since expansion cracks concrete. So far, that seems to be the offered reason by one of the main engineering companies in the Miami area.