NATO & Afghan Forces attack Pakistani Soldiers in North Waziristan

[53fd]

afghans hate pakistan because of how we pushed the taliban on them, and before that how we treated their refugees for our war in their country.

The Afghan Taliban are ethnic Afghan Pashtuns, their own people, not Pakistanis. Mullah Omar is from Kandahar, not from Pakistan. Jalaludin Haqqani is from Paktia, Hekmatyar is from Kunduz, all provinces in Afghanistan, not Pakistan. So don't say that everyone in Afghanistan hates them, and it's all Pakistan's fault, that's what Afghanis lie about so much.

In fact, Taliban is still in control of over 90% of Afghanistan. They have more local support than the puppet nationalist leaders like Karzai or the US, who are deemed as foreign invaders.

 

[Ahmad]

And bro ill put my hand on my heart and say I have come across many Afghans here in the Uk, abd most of them still say Taliban rule was better. Now am not supporting Taliban here, but there are a significant number of Afghans who will still opt for Taliban. Atleast thats what I have come across here.

Many Afghans you have met, but it doesnt mean most afghan love the taliban.

 

[Ahmad]

afghans hate pakistan because of how we pushed the taliban on them, and before that how we treated their refugees for our war in their country.

The Afghan Taliban are ethnic Afghan Pashtuns, their own people, not Pakistanis. Mullah Omar is from Kandahar, not from Pakistan. In fact, Taliban is still in control of over 90% of Afghanistan. They have more local support than the puppet nationalist leaders like Karzai or the US, who are deemed as foreign invaders.

I wont go off topic, but the surveys have shown strong support to Karzai, on the other hand the taliban are enjoying maybe 6-8% support. Yes the taliban are ethnic pashtoon in afghanistan and the same thing is in pakistan, TTP is also ethnic pashton. and by the way, the taliban dont controll 90% of the country.

 

[mautkimaut]

I agree with you and Ice but the only thing we have to be careful about it that if we do what we should be doing it will clearly play in the hands of the indians and others who want us and the Afghans as enemies. So it has to be a very calculated response like it is said kay sanp bhi marjaye and lathi bhi na totay. Because remember it is only a few of the @##es and not all. Most of the Afghans neither want to make an enemy or us nor do they want to be our enemy as well.

wo.wo.wo.wo.....hold your horses right there.It was a skirmish between regular Afghanistani soldiers and Pakistani soldiers,why drag India in between, I can understand you guys feel india is sponsoring terrorists but, this is done by regular army of afghanistan,
India is not a party to this

 

[53fd]

I wont go off topic, but the surveys have shown strong support to Karzai, on the other hand the taliban are enjoying maybe 6-8% support. Yes the taliban are ethnic pashtoon in afghanistan and the same thing is in pakistan, TTP is also ethnic pashton. and by the way, the taliban dont controll 90% of the country.

Please, check the edits I made in my last post. Anyways, I do not believe any surveys showing STRONG support for Karzai, and very little support for the Taliban. Here's the reason why:

This is at the end of 2010. Taliban have been getting stronger and stronger against the US and Afghan forces. If the Afghans hated the Taliban, and loved Karzai and the US so much, and Pakistan was the only factor supporting the Taliban, the Taliban would have been decimated quickly, as there are many more ISAF, NATO, US forces numerically in the region as compared to the Taliban. Yet, the Taliban gets stronger.

I would also like to point out the various times where NATO and ISAF forces 'accidentally' killed the Afghan forces last year. The US and international forces are seen as nothing but foreign invaders in their country.

 

[Ahmad]

Please, check the edits I made in my last post. Anyways, I do not believe any surveys showing STRONG support for Karzai, and very little support for the Taliban. Here's the reason why:

This is at the end of 2010. Taliban have been getting stronger and stronger against the US and Afghan forces. If the Afghans hated the Taliban, and loved Karzai and the US so much, and Pakistan was the only factor supporting the Taliban, the Taliban would have been decimated quickly, as there are many more ISAF, NATO, US forces numerically in the region as compared to the Taliban. Yet, the Taliban gets stronger.

I would also like to point out the various times where NATO and ISAF forces 'accidentally' killed the Afghan forces last year. The US and international forces are seen as nothing but foreign invaders in their country.

I didnt say they dont have support, but certainly not most of people support them, as it is metioned here. The same thing can be said about pakistan and its militancy problem.

 

[Ahmad]

Please, check the edits I made in my last post. Anyways, I do not believe any surveys showing STRONG support for Karzai, and very little support for the Taliban. Here's the reason why:

This is at the end of 2010. Taliban have been getting stronger and stronger against the US and Afghan forces. If the Afghans hated the Taliban, and loved Karzai and the US so much, and Pakistan was the only factor supporting the Taliban, the Taliban would have been decimated quickly, as there are many more ISAF, NATO, US forces numerically in the region as compared to the Taliban. Yet, the Taliban gets stronger.

I would also like to point out the various times where NATO and ISAF forces 'accidentally' killed the Afghan forces last year. The US and international forces are seen as nothing but foreign invaders in their country.

in a country which have seen nothing but 3 decades war and weapon in the hands of everyone, insecurty shouldnt be a surprise. even this map dont confirm the claim of 90% controll by the taliban. by the way we are going off topic, lets end it here.

 

[53fd]

I didnt say they dont have support, but certainly not most of people support them, as it is metioned here. The same thing can be said about pakistan and its militancy problem.

How can you say they don't have most of the support of the Afghan people? Pakistan's problem is different: there are no American troops on Pakistani soil, but there are in Afghanistan. Pakistan is in charge of its own destiny, Afghanistan is being run by international forces and a puppet government. Pakistan's militancy problem is more due to the infiltration of terrorist groups from Afghanistan into Pakistan, these groups (AQ, TTP) are clearly not under the control of the Pakistani government, and are being provided safe havens in the border regions of Afghanistan. The Quetta Shura, Hizb-e-Islami, Haqqani network have not attacked Pakistan, because they are clearly under Pakistan's control.

Anyways, there has been a tremendous surge in violence in Afghanistan after 9/11, and despite your 'surveys', Karzai is still seen as a puppet of the West. He has not done anything to make the lives of the Afghan people safer, just made the country more dangerous. And even though the Taliban were brutal and inhumane sometimes, so were the Northern Alliance and Pashtun nationalists, and there wasn't the kind of violence in Afghanistan like there is right now. It's very clear that the Western forces don't give a crap about the Afghan people, they have instigated many situations in Afghanistan, and made Afghanistan and parts of Pakistan a living hell. In 2002, it was perfectly safe to drive from Kabul to Kandahar, now only a mad person would even think about that.

 

[Cynic Waheed]

Many Afghans you have met, but it doesnt mean most afghan love the taliban.

Hence I said ' significant'and not 'most.' I have read ur views in many posts here abt ur country and frankly I agree with ur POV. I also believe that Talibs are not the best way forward. Thats why even I get surprized when I hear this from Afghans I meet. They do give some compelling reasons for supporting their regime though, like quick justice, no thefts dyring their rule etc. I am not a witness to this myself but they must know what they are saying. My underetanding is that there is still suppory for Talibs in ur country, can u deny that?

 

[Ahmad]

How can you say they don't have most of the support of the Afghan people?

Because they dont have, yes can cause problems, but that is different story.

Pakistan's problem is different: there are no American troops on Pakistani soil, but there are in Afghanistan.

I will only say it is different in appearance, the nature is the same. You are under the influence of the US, they pay you and want something in return, they have killed your soldiers, they are attakcing your villages and killing your villagers, what is the difference, i dont know.

Pakistan is in charge of its own destiny

Not quite sure, maybe partially.

, Afghanistan is being run by international forces and a puppet government.

Better than our own parties which are nothing but proxies of others, if nato leaves, there will be flow of blood on the streets.

Pakistan's militancy problem is more due to the infiltration of terrorist groups from Afghanistan into Pakistan, these groups (AQ, TTP) are clearly not under the control of the Pakistani government, and are being provided safe havens in the border regions of Afghanistan.

Historically militacny have come from paksitan to afghanistan.

The Quetta Shura, Hizb-e-Islami, Haqqani network have not attacked Pakistan, because they are clearly under Pakistan's control.

Thanks for saying this. If every so called leader and party is puppet of someone in Afghanistan, then why should people choose puppet of america ove pakistan? the americans will certainly be less bad when it comes to interferece than pakistan.

 

[Cynic Waheed]

^^
Ahmed you dont support them does not mean the rest of ur countrymen dont support them. Come my ends someday, ill get u to meet many who will disagree with u!

 

[Ahmad]

My underetanding is that there is still suppory for Talibs in ur country, can u deny that?

No i dont deny that, did you even read my posts?

There is support for the taliban(the bad ones as you guys prefer to say) in your country too.

 

[SekrutYakhni]

It is war and combat - when you receive a request for air/artillery support because your soldiers are under fire/attack, typically the response is quick.

If the Afghan's did not clarify that they were fighting Pakistani troops, NATO would have had no reason to contact Pakistani officials to clarify the situation - they would have just responded.

If the Afghans did indicate that it was a clash with Pakistani troops, then NATO should have stayed out of it.

We'll have to wait and see what the details are.

"It is war and combat - when you receive a request for air/artillery support because your soldiers are under fire/attack, typically the response is quick."

AM, than the question comes to my mind--Why don't we need that air/artillery support near our border? We have not made any assumptions till now. We have not killed NATO soldiers nor Afghan.

If the terrorists can infiltrate their border than the terrorists on that side can infiltrate our border.
Do we have some type of commandos or robots that can analyze the situation within seconds and react? And that is why we don't need air support near our border making the same mistake which others do?
Or--We do not have a significant presence on our border?

What is the deal here bro?

 

[Ahmad]

^^
Ahmed you dont support them does not mean the rest of ur countrymen dont support them. Come my ends someday, ill get u to meet many who will disagree with u!

why do you want me to repeat the same thing over and over. they have support, just like your taliban have support in paksitan.

 

[Ahmad]

Lets put an end to off topic issues please.