My definition of secularism is simple, India first, Narendra Modi tells ove

[Manas]

Gujutat riots of 2002 are bloody court cases , let the court decide . If modi is guilty let the court pronounce it first.
Till now Modi is even facing any criminal charges.

I mean we have people who said AFzal guru didn't get fair trial even after courts held him guilty, But Modi is responsible for riots even without a trial . WTF .

2002 riots isn't only riot we saw many riots before and after 2002. Why nobody is asking why Gandhi family and congress leader remained in power after the sikh riots of 2004. PV narasingha Rao was the home minster at that time and RG was PM.

The problem with country is nauseating level of hypocrisy and lack of originality of ideas. But the information age this is going difficult to maintain the facade .

 

[KRAIT]

Thanks for the gesture. I'll need some time though. Cheers.

Actually thanks to you. Instead of being aggressive like me, you replied in cordial fashion and made this debate a lively one.

We need constructive debates where we can discuss issues based on rationality, not on emotionality.

 

[KRAIT]

@Manas Thing is we all want Politics to be done on Development, but these hypocrites if ignored, will target emotional Janta with their propaganda. So we have to beat these hypocrites by building a strong case and expose the propaganda.

After Godhara, 50 riots in UP, WB, Assam, why no one is talking about it ? Don't the victims deserve justice ? In a decade, not a single riot in Gujarat, a state where riots happened almost every year for centuries.

 

[DeathGod]

I sometimes wonder how Congress has remained in power of as much as 50 years. In my opinion, their rule was given for the first 20-25 years... given that there was no other alternative. However, after the 1990's its really hard to imagine how they have remained in power.

In any case today's India is more capitalist, development oriented and educated than ever before. I guess the next decade will be very important for the politics of India. As we have seen congress has beaten back India's growth rate and have socialist kind of policies. For development to continue we need policies that help us compete with the world and not policies like MNREGA or direct cash transfer etc.

Though I think it will be difficult for BJP to add 40+ seats while congress looses the same number of seats , in my heart of heart, I really really wish that BJP comes to Power. If NaMo becomes the PM, nothing like that but if he doesnt then atleast he should be given Home or Finance... He will do a great job there...

 

[Manas]

@Manas Thing is we all want Politics to be done on Development, but these hypocrites if ignored, will target emotional Janta with their propaganda. So we have to beat these hypocrites by building a strong case and expose the propaganda.

After Godhara, 50 riots in UP, WB, Assam, why no one is talking about it ? Don't the victims deserve justice ? In a decade, not a single riot in Gujarat, a state where riots happened almost every year for centuries.

I guess it got to do with the fact the delhi chatterati the elite the media honchos opinion makers , congress kah namuk khaya hey . And nobody want to antagonise the congress party ,say the Gandhi family.

Now You can feel the level of jittery radiated from these fellow when they talk about the Modi's rise in stature . The concubines of congress know vindictive Modi gonna rape them if he manages to come to power at the center.

 

[Mritunjaya]

I am afraid you have misunderstood what I had to say.

As you mentioned, the approval of the majority is crucial for a democracy. However, what is not in consonance with the idea of democracy is drawing the line distinguishing the majority from the minority along - religious lines.

What is this heavily loaded 'line that distinguishes majority from the minority along religious lines' ? Please me more explicit in your comment instead of hiding behind vague comments (also know as shadow boxing). What is this 'LINE' that Modi has drawn which remains invisible to most of us but is clearly visible to you ?

The only line here is 'India First' .......

Modi is not only proposing such a divide but appears to have championed the cause of those who border being termed, as I stated earlier, "hindu supremacists".

Please give evidence of Modi proposing such a divide. In absence of such proof its is to be viewed as a malicious attempt at character assassination of Narendra Modi.

In fact there is evidence that Modi has taken steps to actively eliminated such a divide.

Muslims best off in gujarat: just look at the statistics

Gujarat has the highest number of Muslim policemen among all States in India. According to data sourced from the Home Ministry by Times of India through the Right to Information Act, 10.6 per cent of Gujarat’s police force is composed of Muslim officers. The percentage of Muslims in Gujarat, according to the 2001 census, is 9.1 per cent.

Also describe what you mean by "Hindu supremacists" so that we can better understand your allegation to see that it goes beyond name calling.

And no. Nowhere have I sought to propose that Muslims and Christians hold their religious identity on higher pedestal than the national identity. But one would assume that they would not back a skewed power-sharing formula that offers little assurance about being heard, especially coming from a persona non grata.

Hope this makes my position clear.

If Muslims and christians want to be heard in BJP govt. they can strengthen hands of BJP muslim leadership i.e. of course assuming they do not have faith in the Hindu Leaders of BJP based on your/their personal animosity to Hindu leaders.

Here is some of their names
1. Tanveer Ahmed (National President)
2. Ms Munawari Begum (National General Secretary)
3. Mr Syed Abdul Kareem (National General Secretary)
4. Shafaat Husain (Uttar Pradesh President)
5. Dr Iftikhar Ahmed Javed (Uttar Pradesh General Secretary)
6. Nazar Abbas Naqvi (Allahabad Dist. President)
...etc...

The cheap shot about persona non grata is in poor taste. The last time India needed the white mans approval was in 1947. Maybe you still need their approval , but do not make the mistake of assuming the rest of India is also into 'white worship'.

I never had any doubts about 'your position' ....that was always been clear to me. As I said earlier, logic cannot overcome synthetic fear/anger. My objective is to debate/expose 'secular Indians' and claims of 'self righteousness'.

 

[Android]

desh ka neta kaisa ho...
narendra modi jaisa ho!!!

 

[rubyjackass]

This is a blatant LIE and you know it. You tube is filled with Modi interviews. Forget interviews ....he was made to answers all questions by SIT. This has never been imposed on any other Chief Minister of India (in spite of the 900 riots that have taken place) ! The same SIT has now cleared him of all the accusation.

The only problem I see is your unwillingness to face facts and continue to demonize Modi based on your own prejudices and fears.

Yes, Youtube is filled with interviews where he does not venture around the topic. We are talking about his public comments. SIT is not a political stage.

When he refuses to even tell us the facts, how can anyone be unwilling to face them? Well, is it not his fault to clear our prejudices and fears(which, by the way, exist with good reason)? What is this arrogance saying that he can become PM even if he does not get my vote?

Congress is THE MOST COMMUNAL party with a large base in India. That is no exaggeration. Congress has been playing communal politics right from 1947 when their communal politics split the nation. Its just a cold reality.
The reality is you would rather vote for a Anti-BJP party ......which is of course along expected lines.

Factual inaccuracy and then an obvious statement. Your thinking about post-independent Congress is shaped by what you see today. But it is not correct.

 

[jayron]

I would like Modi better if he doesn't involve in cheap media gimmicks to promote himself all the time. A little modesty will go a long way in humanizing him.

 

[rubyjackass]

I am replying only to the relevant quotes.

Of course, I agree with your point of view. As far as elections go, right wing equates to religion and caste votebank in India. But with governance, the policies are almost similar to other right wing parties, the world over. During BJP's reign, they even managed to alienate their staunch supporters in VHP and BD with their moderate, centrist policies. During Kargil war, they even refused to cross the LOC. So much for their "ultra-nationalism"! Albeit, that had its advantages.

ABV was a huge dam standing between the crazy elements of BJP and the government. Not crossing the LOC was not a moderate policy. It was the only practical policy given the nuclear overhang and international pressure. But credit should be given to the government for not listening to the extremist elements in BJP and allies who asked for total war, though it was an easy decision.

Not exactly. During ABV's govt, there was a lot of deregulation going on. A lot of govt equities were dissolved and govt holdings in PSU's were sold off. Privatization took precedence over bailing out sick PSUs. Now is that aint lesser govt, then what is?

Did ABV's government not follow privatization? Yes, of course they did follow liberalization. But that has never been their selling point. One reason for that is, well, it won't sell in India.

I repeat again lesser government has never been a selling point of BJP or any right wing party of India. You are just wishing we have a better right wing party. Sorry that is simply not the case now. May be it is too sophisticated an idea for our people.

US's right wing is fiscally conservative. India's right wing has no fiscal ideas different from the Congress'. They are as socialist or as capitalist as Congress. Both governments have pushed reforms at the same pace and they were merely pragmatic in doing so. They reformed only to maintain growth rate and not out of their ideological drive(in fact in Congress's case, it is against their old thinking).

Hence Indian right has no affinity(or rather no special affinity) to fiscal conservatism. Hopefully they will come out of their religious ghettoism with things like the current 'development platform'. Otherwise they will keep throwing the Hindutva c*ap at people for centuries to come.

 

[Mritunjaya]

Yes, Youtube is filled with interviews where he does not venture around the topic. We are talking about his public comments. SIT is not a political stage.

When he refuses to even tell us the facts, how can anyone be unwilling to face them? Well, is it not his fault to clear our prejudices and fears(which, by the way, exist with good reason)? What is this arrogance saying that he can become PM even if he does not get my vote?

Factual inaccuracy and then an obvious statement. Your thinking about post-independent Congress is shaped by what you see today. But it is not correct.

YouTube has interviews with Modi in just about every topic including Gujarat Riots. There are also newspaper interviews of Modi published about Godhra Riots .........is this selective blindness ?

He has made enough public comments about Godhra burning and subsequent riots ....there is no need for him to repeat himself about his only limited failure rather than talk about his multiple successes that has given benefits to millions of lives.

SIT is also a political game and stage, the way Godhra Burning and Riot and Modi demonization based on that is a political game.

And you are wrong, It is not Modi's job to clear peoples prejudices and irrational fear and hate mongering. That is the job of the people who has installed that fear in you for their own political gains. It is Modi's JOB to provide good governance to the people who have voted for him. I think he has done a fabulous job in that.

 

[Guynextdoor2]

Secularism to me means India first, Modi tells NRIs in US in his address- Politics News- Politics-IBNLive

Wharton WILL NOT be botheed about what WSJ poll or any other poll or you or anyone else thinks. In his living life time, even if he becomes PM, they or HBS WILL NOT let his name linked with theirs.

Secularism to me means India first, Modi tells NRIs in US in his address- Politics News- Politics-IBNLive

Wharton WILL NOT be botheed about what WSJ poll or any other poll or you or anyone else thinks. In his living life time, even if he becomes PM, they or HBS WILL NOT let his name linked with theirs.

 

[Paan Singh]

Wharton WILL NOT be botheed about what WSJ poll or any other poll or you or anyone else thinks. In his living life time, even if he becomes PM, they or HBS WILL NOT let his name linked with theirs.



Wharton WILL NOT be botheed about what WSJ poll or any other poll or you or anyone else thinks. In his living life time, even if he becomes PM, they or HBS WILL NOT let his name linked with theirs.

so he is bothered for FartON ? or sm else group?
who are they to give certificate to him?

You know how Modi is getting famous? guess?

Due to his bashing by opponents.More you will bash him,more he will get famous.

I used to be modi hater 1-2 years back but now i know that i or we all are hunted by propaganda of congress against him.
Other reason is,we dnt have any other option other than him.

 

[Guynextdoor2]

He is not.....he is advanced version of ABVP

Not in this life time- maybe with a 'reincarnation'

 

[JanjaWeed]

simple & uncomplicated definition. the word 'secularism' has been grossly misused by our political parties & the majority of the public are in a state of confusion when to comes to understanding the real meaning.