Most in China Call Their Nation A Democracy, Most in U.S. Say America Isn't

[gambit]

United States is a republic with democratic value.

That is true, but what this poll revealed is that there are enough Americans perceived -- wrongly or rightly -- that there are things politically and culturally that are sapping away at those democratic values.

 

[Hamartia Antidote]

Lol, political correctness? it's all empty talk and no actions, China is an action oriented country where social woe are being taken deadly seriously and fixed, US is a empty promises based country, where nothing can be really fixed, gun violence, drugs problems, homelessness, racial issues, police brutality.. for decades they just stay the same if not getting worse.

You are making generalizations. Each of the 50 states has their own laws.

For instance my state has the lowest gun violence in the country...and the incidents we do have are mostly located in poor inner city areas. Any attempts at lowering it in those areas are met by inner-city residents who want to defund their police. So speaking of the government actually listening to the people when it comes to laws..it can work in a negative manner too:

Boston Activists Want More Accountability, And Call On The City To 'Defund The Police'

Two local activists discuss how defunding is just one aspect of police reform people are calling for locally.

www.wbur.org

Boston Activists Want More Accountability, And Call On The City To 'Defund The Police'​

https://www.wbur.org/news/2022/05/12/boston-city-council-wu-police-cut

Boston City Councilors consider mayor's plan to cut police budget​

 

[BHAN85]

That's common in dictatorships.

In a dictatorship people are afraid of talk publicly bad about the regime.

In democracies people feels free to talk publicly bad about the regime.

 

[beijingwalker]

You are making generalizations. Each of the 50 states has their own laws.

For instance my state has the lowest gun violence in the country...and the incidents we do have are mostly located in poor inner city areas. Any attempts at lowering it in those areas are met by inner-city residents who want to defund their police. So speaking of the government actually listening to the people when it comes to laws..it can work in a negative manner too:

Boston Activists Want More Accountability, And Call On The City To 'Defund The Police'

Two local activists discuss how defunding is just one aspect of police reform people are calling for locally.

www.wbur.org

Boston Activists Want More Accountability, And Call On The City To 'Defund The Police'​

https://www.wbur.org/news/2022/05/12/boston-city-council-wu-police-cut

Boston City Councilors consider mayor's plan to cut police budget​

You are making excuses again, Chinese government is high effectively and quicky address public woes and US government is no empty talk, check American vloggers about their life experience in China, they all mentioned this fact.

 

[Hamartia Antidote]

You are making excuses again, Chinese government is high effectively and quicky address public woes and US government is no empty talk, check American vloggers about their life experience in China, they all mentioned this fact.

How is the mayor doing the will of the people "making excuses". I thought this thread was about which is more of a Democracy China or the US. We certainly win the argument hands down if the Government is actually listening to the people and enacting laws that are actually NEGATIVE to the established common good.

How can you argue China is more of a Democracy if they wouldn't even do that?

Your argument is lost...and this proves it.

 

[beijingwalker]

How is the mayor doing the will of the people "making excuses". I thought this thread was about which is more of a Democracy China or the US. We certainly win the argument hands down if the Government is actually listening to the people and enacting laws that are actually NEGATIVE.

US maybe listen, but that ' s it, the Chinese government listens and gets woes fixed, it set China apart from US.

 

[Hamartia Antidote]

US maybe listen, but that ' s it, the Chinese government listens and gets woes fixed, it set China apart from US.

LOL! Now you are making weak excuses!

The people asked for a police budget cut and they got it. How can you blindly say this is "only listening" and not "doing"???

Boston City Council override to cut police funding fails as budget goes into effect

The first run-through of the city budget process is now over as the council approved overrides taking money away from the fire department — but ultimately not the police department.

www.bostonherald.com

Boston City Council override to cut police funding fails as budget goes into effect​

You have still not shown even one specific example of the Chinese Government doing something due to the people's request...and I have shown two specific examples.


All I see from you is excuses and tangents from you for not finding anything.

Show me President Xi making some law after hearing a request from a little girl. Show me a Government official in a city enacting something requested by the people which goes against the logic of surrounding cities.

If you can't even name anything specific you argument is completely hollow and just all talk and smoke and mirrors...exactly what you are accusing the US of doing.

 

[beijingwalker]

How is the mayor doing the will of the people "making excuses". I thought this thread was about which is more of a Democracy China or the US. We certainly win the argument hands down if the Government is actually listening to the people and enacting laws that are actually NEGATIVE.

US maybe listen, but that ' s it, the Chinese government listens and gets woes fixed, it set China apart from US.

LOL! Now you are making weak excuses!

The people asked for a police budget cut and they got it. How can you blindly say this is "only listening" and not "doing"???

Boston City Council override to cut police funding fails as budget goes into effect

The first run-through of the city budget process is now over as the council approved overrides taking money away from the fire department — but ultimately not the police department.

www.bostonherald.com

Boston City Council override to cut police funding fails as budget goes into effect​

You have still not shown one specific example of the Government doing something due to the people's request...and I have show two specific examples.


All I see from you is excuses and tangents from you for not finding anything.

China's most dicussed issue used to be air pollution, now it is great improved and largely solves, US gun violence is equally widely discussed, has it been improved in any sense?

 

[Hamartia Antidote]

US maybe listen, but that ' s it, the Chinese government listens and gets woes fixed, it set China apart from US.

China's most dicussed issue used to be air pollution, now it is great improved and largely solves, US gun violence is equally widely discussed, has it been improved in any sense?

Yes, my state government listened to the people and enacted strict gun laws which sent gun violence to the lowest in the country. It would be even lower if city Mayors weren't listening to the "will of the people" and cutting police budgets because too many of their resident are criminals.

Massachusetts

Research Massachusetts's gun laws including background checks, concealed carry, gun sales, and more. Learn what Massachusetts's gun laws do well and what they're missing.

giffords.org

Massachusetts has some of the strongest gun laws in the country


This now makes 3 examples I have listed.

Now its your turn to list a specific example...which you dance around and around and around and refuse to do because you can't find any.

All you are doing is listing generalizations.

I may as well say back 200 years ago the people begged the US government to "not let us all end up poor like China" and the government listened and that has led to all of our advances. What kind of lame example would that be.

 

[beijingwalker]

Yes, my state government listened to the people and enacted strict gun laws which sent gun violence to the lowest in the country. It would be even lower if city Mayors weren't listening to the "will of the people" and cutting police budgets because too many of their resident are criminals.

Now its your turn to list a specific example...which you dance around and refuse to do because you can't find any.

I m talking about US, not your state or your village, is it any better than before?

 

[Hamartia Antidote]

I m talking about US, not your state or your village, is it any better than before?

How is my state not a part of a Democracy?? You can't even vote for your President so how can you claim your country government is more of a Democracy? You have no say whatsover.

What is the difference between your government and the Monarchy of Saudi Arabia? The King listens to the people too and builds vast public enterprises at their behest. You want to call his "avid listening" a definition of Democracy somehow??? There's more to it than that.

 

[beijingwalker]

How is my state not a part of a Democracy?? You can't even vote for your President so how can you claim your country government is more of a Democracy? You have no say whatsover.

The OP article is about China and US, not your state and my city or your village or your neighborhood, you and keep arguing and narrowing it down and claim your bothroom has more democracy than my bathroom, but that's rather stupid.

 

[Beast]

They don't, most of the Chinese does not even speak English. How would they know what the English word "Democracy" mean??

In US and UK, you cant even wave communist flag or walk in street talking about support of CCP and President Xi policy. More or less shows there is no freedom and democracy. These western delusion clown like to say otherwise.

How is my state not a part of a Democracy?? You can't even vote for your President so how can you claim your country government is more of a Democracy? You have no say whatsover.

What is the difference between your government and the Monarchy of Saudi Arabia? The King listens to the people too and builds vast public enterprises at their behest. You want to call his "avid listening" a definition of Democracy somehow??? There's more to it than that.

Lol... As if US can really vote a real president. It's either vote for Trump or Biden. It's just like choosing between Stalin or Hilter.

No wonder Hollywood is so successful becos American are good at deludings about their so called democracy with a good show. Choose anyone of the 2 , is dead end. Ordinary American can't really change the policy set by NeoCon.

 

[jhungary]

In US and UK, you cant even wave communist flag or walk in street talking about support of CCP and President Xi policy. More or less shows there is no freedom and democracy. These western delusion clown like to say otherwise.

You do know US Communist Party is a thing, right? Yes, they did not get any seat on the government (because nobody voted for them) does not mean they are banned in the US. And they have regular rally/parade and protest in New York in Mayday

It’s time to run candidates: A call for discussion and action

People are looking for more fundamental solutions to the problems of everyday living, which have been made all the more urgent with the coming together of the COVID pandemic, institutional racism and inequality, the economic crisis, and the environmental crisis.

www.cpusa.org

On of their rally in New York I think in 2018, the flag is clearly stated NY District Communist Party US


Also, there are no communist flag, you need to wave individual countries flag. As in Soviet, China, Vietnam and etc.

That is true, but what this poll revealed is that there are enough Americans perceived -- wrongly or rightly -- that there are things politically and culturally that are sapping away at those democratic values.

Well, I don't want to get deep into politics, people I know (Either IRL or on PDF) seems to forget I have a political background (I studied International Politics in CU Boulder) I have a lot opinion with the current and previous government...

All I will say is what Lincoln said A country govern by the people, for the people at the Battle of Gettysburg address is long dead. Now its more about money and power.

 

[jhungary]

I agree. Plus, the real democracy is actually not the best government in the world. Because the real democracy means the "the ruling of majority". In the real democracy, all nation policy will be voted by the people directly. It looks good from the outside, but not really the best form of governing a country. Because with the vote, the majority will always win, while the minority will always lose. You can't achieve a true social justice that way. Specially when your country is very diverse in everything. From ideology, religion, races, etc. I believe that your country will be split into several smaller countries, because the minority will feel that they don't get the social justice that they deserve.

I believe that to have good government doesn't mean that you have appease everything that what your people want, but what your people need. sometime, the government need to make an unpopular policy for the sake of the country. a good government also have to think about the need of the minority (ethnics, economy, religion, etc).

But it can't be happen if your country embrace the real democracy. With real democracy, all your country policy will be something that we call as "Populist policy". A policy that will waste money for the sake of the pleasure of the people. It also will only goes into the direction of the majority. If let say the majority is catholic, while the minority is muslim, I can be sure that the minority will be pressured into non existence.

The real democracy can also be translate into the politic of the masses. In a country where the politic become the greatest interest of her people, everyone will gathering masses. Religious masses, political party masses, some kind of specific ethic masses, etc. Because with having the masses, they can have more vote and power in deciding their country policy. And when everyone have a lot of masses, then the country won't be united anymore. Specially because the people behind those masses have their own agenda / political interest.

So why a country that ruled by the people directly won't be an utopia? the answer is simple. Because people are diverse. Not everyone are angel. There are a lot of asshole, bandit, mafia, etc in our land. And those people have their own agenda / interest that give the benefit for their own group. the problem is, it is those kind of people who usually can gather the biggest masses. And with the bigger masses, means that they usually can get what they want from the vote.

So what is a good government? It simple. A good government is a clean government who do everything they could for the sake of all people. Not only the "WANT" of the majority, but for what the people NEED most. The problem is, a good government is actually can only be considered as utopia in real world. Because there is no 100% good government in human history. Everyone have their own flaw.

Well, the value for real democracy is the check and balance system. Government is ALWAYS going to be the authority, which mean there aren't really places for People in the decision making process, however, the process have to be open and public, so that it can be balanced by the people. Policy were not made for the people, but the people have the power to choose its government.

As for whether or not Democracy is important or as you put it, what people "Want". That's is going to be more oblique, because that's really depends on population base, say for US to go to dictatorship is almost certainly impossible as the check and balance system is too entrenched to the population base. It's almost certainly will turn into civil revoke if we look at how unpopular policy ends up in the last 200 years of US history. On the other hand, can China become democratic? Again that depends on the population, if the population wanted they can, but if they don't care, then it just wouldn't