Is it right to attack South Waziristan now?

[batmannow]

You are right , slogan of Pakistan is based on same islamic teaching

Unity Faith Decipline

Sorry to say we have few Brig. and Generals supported by a think tanker who are lacking in basics of islam.

SORY TO ASK!
plz put a thread on "ISLAMIAT", THN you will know , how many Brig. and Generals supported by a think tanker , knows about ISLAM, and how much.
PLZ, dont try to act like a "WALI-UL-ALLAHA, which you are not certnly

 

[The Patriot]

after observing situation in Pakistan i have come to conclusion that fighting terrorists is a big test for the nation. on military side, i can see determination but on political, religious and strategic terms there is no consensus. to win a war against the terrorists all there should be work on all these sides. i am afraid if it is left only to the army it will not achieve the desired results.

 

[All-Green]

It is not I who got misdirected at you on a personal level - but you who directed the target to yourself - terming yourself self righteous and a Patriot.
Now let me ask you are those people living in the Taliban badlands as you call them - any less patriots than you and the others in the rest of Pakistan?

And who is a rightful owner of the FATA?
Wasn't FATA governed under their own set of governance that was certainly different from the rest of the country since times immemorial?
Look this issue is much larger to be dealt here so simplistically in just few words. One of the clues you should be looking for is, why did the Taliban pick up this animosity against you? who fired the first shot? Who is to blame for starting it all?

For solutions and what is the right course of action now after this decade of another round of violence - again I tell you look into yourselves and look at it in clearer light instead of the bias that you usually do and the answers you seek you will find within yourselves.
Much better than me giving you the answers that you shall of course reject outright.

Here lies the weakness in such an argument...

FATA is part of Pakistan regardless of whatever arrangement is there...that is the undeniable truth...If any part is infested with anti Pakistan enemies then Pakistan has to act in defense...

Pakistan is a state...not FATA, Punjab, Sindh, Baluchistan or NWFP...the state has to fight its enemies whether they are external or internal...in this it is the prerogative of the State to take necessary action as per assessment...

On one hand the people of FATA have been given freedom from usual Pakistan system but on the other hand the same lack of conventional State presence has lead to a disaster in post Afghan Jihad scenario when so many fighters from all over the world stayed back and had no role in society...this led to a new power in the region which was not answerable to the tribal leaders...in this manner the state and tribes both had little control over many areas where the Mujahideen had settled...most of the Mujahideen even now are fighting against NATO and US forces and have no issues with Pakistan...

TTP is another dimension altogether, they are not freedom fighters by any definition, they have cleverly manipulated the chaotic situation and the on ground sympathy with actual Mujahideen to grab hold...they initially claimed themselves as Mujahideen but were quick to Kill Pakistanis and have had no real role in their claimed fight against US ...their actions in Swat exposed them further and led to at least one major counter attack from the State which is responsible for the safety of its people...
No doubt the weak governance has played its part in creating the power vacuum since TTP has cleverly eliminated many opponent Tribal Jirga members and elders...leaving the locals confused and hesitant to act....
Some Mehsud sub clans are openly supporting TTP so of course such clans shall also have to be faced as enemies not because they disagree with anything...because they are sanctioning the killing of innocents in all parts of Pakistan...
However those who are not supporting TTP overtly are not the targets...this has been reiterated by all the State apparatus...Swat is a clear example of how State made best efforts to minimize collateral damage...

The model of political agents working with the tribal elders has not yielded any positive results, the development here has been dismal due to lack of coherence and individualistic culture...so the token freedom has also hampered any growth and development here...

I want this model to be changed...yes indeed...however with current state of affairs even this step or any other peaceful step first requires the defeat of TTP which is challenging the state openly and publicly killing all opponents...
Just for the record, the majority of locals are supportive of Taliban fighting in Afghanistan whom they perceive as freedom fighters against foreign occupation, they are certainly not in love with the terrorist TTP...and if any Pakistani supports TTP then he should be dealt with as an enemy of Pakistan.

Supporting Pakistan Army against the terrorists is not reflective of any self righteous attitude...It stems only from the trust which a patriot should have in their own Army when it is acting against the anti state terrorists...
If we do not clean this mess up and still rely on others, then indeed we shall lose FATA forever and forfeit our right to call it part of Pakistan...

We acted in Swat and despite the same hue and cry, the overwhelming majority of Swatis are satisfied with what Army did...it was difficult in Swat and much more so in Waziristan but not impossible and we have little else in the way of any real alternative...Swat at least has proven those wrong who thought Swat would be destroyed and Swatis would rebel against Pakistan..their spirit has only become stronger after Army support...

The state has a right to punish the miscreants which try to undermine its authority...it is the right of the state by virtue of any religion, creed, code or constitution.
Whatever well thought decision the state apparatus takes in this regards, has to be supported...clearly the Army has always given statements that evidence proves South Waziristan as a major source of attacks and planning across the country...
Our choices therefore are very limited...

 

[Patriot]

All-Green bro, you are too nice and decent .If i were you i would not even debate with people like Fundamentalist as he is a hardcore TTP Supporter and extremely anti shia.

 

[Aamirkhan(ssg)]

Yes ofcourse its true the army attack on South waziristan due to Attack was in GHQ the terrorist attack on ghq so thats why the operation will begin afetr a few days and may be as soon.

 

[waraich66]

All-Green bro, you are too nice and decent .If i were you i would not even debate with people like Fundamentalist as he is a hardcore TTP Supporter and extremely anti shia.

How many times you are warned by mods not to spread hatred and sectarianism?


Better try to develop flexibility and tolrance , which are basic teaching of islam.


If you have any doubts, this forum is best place to clarify and behave like good boy

 

[waraich66]

SORY TO ASK!
plz put a thread on "ISLAMIAT", THN you will know , how many Brig. and Generals supported by a think tanker , knows about ISLAM, and how much.
PLZ, dont try to act like a "WALI-UL-ALLAHA, which you are not certnly

You can not saggregate islamic teaching from any subject of discussion which base of our thoughts and source of our motivation.

If you dont know about any particular word , better first clarify by your means and then use it in forumfor discussion.

Other wise it may cause imbrasement

Ab achy bacho ki trah zid na karo or dosti kar lo beta , tofee malay ghee

 

[SeaGull]

ALL-GREEN > I was actually hoping you would explore the deeper causes of these issues - rather than groping in the surface mazes of these TTP, Indian Taliban, Russian Taliban, American Taliban etc etc etc.
These recent Talibans are the product of today because you have allowed your territory to be a fertile breeding grounds for such phenomenon to take place.

For a better perspective on Swat - I suggest you listen again to Dr Israr Ahmed on his thread provided here and then let me know what you think.
Applying surface treatments to deep resentments are not going to get you very far. Army operation in Swat is just such an example. You have had many more casualties elsewhere for that operation and this not an end in itself.
The use of an Army against its own people never yields desired result of stability and peace that you so yearn for.
FATA is no doubt a part of your country under a different arrangement and I am not denying that fact - unless you wish to malign it totally to wish to secede from Pakistan, which seems to be current game play in which you are blundering into.

I hate these going round and round in circles.

 

[SeaGull]

Ab achy bacho ki trah zid na karo or dosti kar lo beta , tofee malay ghee

HUM TO LADDO KE BEGAHAIR DOSTI NAHI KARENGE - TOFI SE KAAM NAHI CHALE GA FUNDA

 

[ghamai]

we 've to make sure we 're very careful when entering waziristan. in swat unfortunately some ppl lost hope in our army 'nd country 'nd we must not repeat the same in waziristan. the problem with waziris is that they dont consider themselves to be pakistanis, atleast majority of them doesnt. those I met so far act very superios 'nd act as if they 're from some different planet than me. no wonder not many ppl get along with them :s

 

[TaimiKhan]

we 've to make sure we 're very careful when entering waziristan. in swat unfortunately some ppl lost hope in our army 'nd country 'nd we must not repeat the same in waziristan. the problem with waziris is that they dont consider themselves to be pakistanis, atleast majority of them doesnt. those I met so far act very superios 'nd act as if they 're from some different planet than me. no wonder not many ppl get along with them :s

And I have met many Wazir tribe people in govt service as well as locals living there who are fed up of TTP or so called Taliban as are hopeful that one day they will be free of these devils.

Issue is not with the Wazir tribe people, they are pro-pakistani & don't wish to engage PA or harm innocent Muslims, all they want is support their brethren in Afghanistan.

Problem is with the Mehsud tribe militants & the thousands of foreign militants who are active in anti-pakistan activities. Even many of the Mehsud clansman wish to get free of them, they all are not militants, they have been forced to join them or silenced by killing whoever speaks against them.

 

[ghamai]

And I have met many Wazir tribe people in govt service as well as locals living there who are fed up of TTP or so called Taliban as are hopeful that one day they will be free of these devils.

Issue is not with the Wazir tribe people, they are pro-pakistani & don't wish to engage PA or harm innocent Muslims, all they want is support their brethren in Afghanistan.

Problem is with the Mehsud tribe militants & the thousands of foreign militants who are active in anti-pakistan activities. Even many of the Mehsud clansman wish to get free of them, they all are not militants, they have been forced to join them or silenced by killing whoever speaks against them.

I understand them wanting to help afghan pathans 'nd even I wud if I cud, but there's a limit to everything. as selfish as I might sound but our own interest comes first, isnt it? waziris 're only pakistanis I never got along with 'nd honestly speaking nor do I feel like they 're one of us. their pride is just going over their heads 'nd they seriously need to calm down

 

[batmannow]

You can not saggregate islamic teaching from any subject of discussion which base of our thoughts and source of our motivation.

If you dont know about any particular word , better first clarify by your means and then use it in forumfor discussion.

Other wise it may cause imbrasement

Ab achy bacho ki trah zid na karo or dosti kar lo beta , tofee malay ghee

just, keep ur candy, to your "UMMAHA"!
I GUSS, they needed that most, buy them some lloy pops, too, cause i guss they never tasted it before in thier, lives!
so, my dear , professor of "DINIYAT" , COME back to topic, i think , there many posts , where you & me toghather, had push the "thanks" button. just check those, as long as you are stay on the topic i, dont have any probleum , with you?
i still, think you are a patriot, but a angry & dejected one, so dear come join us to clear these , TTP's terrorists, from pakistan, & plz stay away, inviting CHINA, RUSSIA for peace,
btw i support, AFGHAN JIHAD &the peoples who were fighting t
he occupaytion there!

 

[arihant]

Should not Pak first block the bill going to pass and ask help from china and turkey. This looks better option to me too.

 

[nasir91]

Nothing ever good comes out of war, do an offensive in SW, some of them will die, but they will just show up in another place, like South Punjab these days.

You must remember the Talibans and extremists are humans aswell, do you think that they really want to kill hundreds of peoples? I say, make way for negotiations and please for the love of Allah, DO NOT listen to America, nothing ever good comes out of it.

They are humans aswell and they've been forced to fight because of the conditions, anyone remember the Bangladesh incident? Let us learn from history, and no...I'm NOT supporting the terrorists, but you have to see this case from another perspective. Our leaders are corrupt to the bone, a national revolution need to come, but it won't...
No, I am not talking about a mullah revolution, but a national revolution in favor for the average pakistani people...