IRIAF | News and Discussions

[Cthulhu]

We don't have technology to produce superalloys.
No superalloys = No turbofan engines.

 

[PeeD]

MAPNAs Siemens turbine copies all use superalloys, even single crystal.

 

[Hack-Hook]

MAPNAs Siemens turbine copies all use superalloys, even single crystal.

guess pressure and heat in Mapna turbines are a lot less than a modern engine like what you see in F-35
producing Super alloy is a field that we need invest heavily in it.

 

[PeeD]

guess pressure and heat in Mapna turbines are a lot less than a modern engine like what you see in F-35
producing Super alloy is a field that we need invest heavily in it.

No, same thing in every respect.

 

[Hack-Hook]

No, same thing in every respect.

its not my field but my guess is as F-35 engine is a lot smaller , then the pressure must be somehow higher

 

[WinterNights]

Iran is most definitely ALOT more advanced in the superalloy field than people think. Iran's MAPNA alone should give people a hint. When the OWJ was unveiled, Sorena Sattari said in an interview that this is something that should have been done decades years ago.

Anyway, remember that Iran compares it's gas turbine quality to the Germans. How many other nations have a company like MAPNA? The latent capability to produce even turbofan is there. Don't even question it.

 

[Ich]

5-6 years ago i read a story that Iran tests nano-coatings on the blades of fighterjet engines. The aim is to rise the heatrange of the blades. Also new coolings within the blades were tested. But i dont know how far this project is.

 

[WinterNights]

Also remember they said 2 years ago that in 2 years they will have an engine with 4x the thrust of OWJ. So that engine is probably ready now! Iran has really no real technological barrier to start producing much more advanced planes than we think. What is needed is the political/military go ahead and funding. The real question for us to consider here is that is Iran in that much need of such planes in order to start using funding for it? I think yes, remember, if Iran starts working on such projects, they will not be ready for atleast a decade. Therefore, we need to start plating the seeds now so we can use them in the future. In the meantime, the main priority must remain in missiles (we need to also focus on hypersonic systems) airdefence and UAV's. The technologies we use in UAV can also be used in our manned systems too. We also need to get as much TOT in manned planes from likes of Russians.

I think those "seeds" I am referring to, have already been planted. We are seeing some of them come to fruition already. I am sure there is so much going on behind the scenes that we don't see.

5-6 years ago i read a story that Iran tests nano-coatings on the blades of fighterjet engines. The aim is to rise the heatrange of the blades. Also new coolings within the blades were tested. But i dont know how far this project is.

Good point. Also, people need to remember that Iran is much more advanced in sciences like nanotech compared to these nations like turkey, Pakistan etc. Yet we see them having their own project in 5th gen. Obviously these countries can't build such things themselves and are relying on foreigners e.g China and Britain. Iran could start developing these systems with much less input from outsiders.

 

[PeeD]

its not my field but my guess is as F-35 engine is a lot smaller , then the pressure must be somehow higher

Pressure ratios can be different in different engines, but the reason superalloys are used is temperature, not pressure (its isobar thermodynamically). Secondary concern is the mechanical force caused by the rotation.
A superalloy for a 150MW gasturbine will be suitable for turbofan or turbojet.

 

[Sineva]

Oh I am sorry Vevak, I personally forgot you visited each Iranian military installation and verified Iran has no oven.

Good thing we have you on this board and your wealth of classified knowledge.

You can’t build a heavy fighter and stick a damn J-79 in it or an Rd-33 or a J-85.

So for Iran to build a heavy fighter they would need an engine with >80nt dry >100 nt afterburner which leaves just TWO possible engines that Iran has access too F-14 engine and possibly SU-24 engine the AL-21.

Iran needs something in the AL-31 class to be able to build a heavy fighter side (SU-35, F-14, F-22).

I assume Iran spent its earlier years trying to reverse engineer a less complex engine like J-85 before moving to J-79 and higher.

There is only A FEW countries in the world that can build their own heavy jet engines. China is still years behind Russia and US and they have a lot more experience and resources in this field than Iran will ever have.

Another possible option could be the Soloviev D30 turbofan.In its afterburning version it powers the Mig31 which altho it is not a fighter is certainly no slouch in the engine performance department.The non afterburning variants powers the Tu54 and the Il76,both of which iran operates or at least did and should in theory be available for reverse/reengineering.The afterburning variants of these engines are basically in the same class as the P&W TF30,tho slightly larger and heavier but with quite a bit more power in afterburner,tho how much reengineering would be required to convert the civilian airliner/transport versions to afterburning is anyones guess

 

[TheImmortal]

Another possible option could be the Soloviev D30 turbofan.In its afterburning version it powers the Mig31 which altho it is not a fighter is certainly no slouch in the engine performance department.The non afterburning variants powers the Tu54 and the Il76,both of which iran operates or at least did and should in theory be available for reverse/reengineering.The afterburning variants of these engines are basically in the same class as the P&W TF30,tho slightly larger and heavier but with quite a bit more power in afterburner,tho how much reengineering would be required to convert the civilian airliner/transport versions to afterburning is anyones guess

There is no proof Iran has the TF30. In fact, subsequent models show Iran flying a RQ-170 clone using rotary engines! It flew fine!

Thus signs point to the notion that the RQ-170 flying over Iran had a fairly mundane engine. Time will tell

Also remember they said 2 years ago that in 2 years they will have an engine with 4x the thrust of OWJ. So that engine is probably ready now! Iran has really no real technological barrier to start producing much more advanced planes than we think. What is needed is the political/military go ahead and funding. The real question for us to consider here is that is Iran in that much need of such planes in order to start using funding for it? I think yes, remember, if Iran starts working on such projects, they will not be ready for atleast a decade. Therefore, we need to start plating the seeds now so we can use them in the future. In the meantime, the main priority must remain in missiles (we need to also focus on hypersonic systems) airdefence and UAV's. The technologies we use in UAV can also be used in our manned systems too. We also need to get as much TOT in manned planes from likes of Russians.

I think those "seeds" I am referring to, have already been planted. We are seeing some of them come to fruition already. I am sure there is so much going on behind the scenes that we don't see.



Good point. Also, people need to remember that Iran is much more advanced in sciences like nanotech compared to these nations like turkey, Pakistan etc. Yet we see them having their own project in 5th gen. Obviously these countries can't build such things themselves and are relying on foreigners e.g China and Britain. Iran could start developing these systems with much less input from outsiders.

The problem with iran is not building a low RCS design (that is just simple design engineering) or building a suitable engine (though a huge task).

It is EVERYTHING ELSE that goes into what makes a 5th gen fighter a 5th gen fighter.

*EW systems
*Counter EW systems
*targeting pod technology
*next gen BVR missiles
*radar absorbing coating “skin”
*advanced avionics and navigation systems
*engine exhaust cooling systems to mask heat of engine
*thrust vectoring
*supercruise technology

If you saw Russian airforce in Syria you would see how their targeting pod technology is inferior to US and even Israel. Many published air strikes appeared to be missing there target locations.

So what targeting pod technology has Iran been using or going to use on a 5th gen fighter?

 

[skyshadow]

https://www.almasdarnews.com/articl...-new-warplane-and-domestic-made-s-300-report/

 

[T-72B]

https://www.almasdarnews.com/articl...-new-warplane-and-domestic-made-s-300-report/

There's already a thread for that

 

[skyshadow]

https://www.timesofisrael.com/iran-...apabilities-of-ballistic-and-cruise-missiles/

New fighters are on the way.

 

[SubWater]

@VEVAK
Delta wing project

and other designs

The problem is engine we don't have powerful engines to move for bigger platforms also F5 is good platform and we can put it as base and start point for making bigger platform.
I think they don't have plan to make new F5s they just build one to prove technology and move for another step to build bigger jet.