Indonesia Defence Forum

[Nike]

Meanwhile in Aceh

Prajurit TNI Kodam Iskanda Muda menata ratusan pucuk senjata api saat kunjungan Kasad Jenderal TNI Andika Perkasa di Banda Aceh, Kamis (29/8/2019). Sebanyak 118 pucuk senjata api laras panjang dan laras pendek berbagai jenis, termasuk senjata rakitan tersebut merupakan senjata sisa konflik Aceh yang diserahkan warga kepada TNI. (ANTARA FOTO/Ampelsa)

 

[striver44]

Well... if integration is the concern, do we currently have that 'National Link' today...? or if it's still in development, any idea of the basic specs or architecture it's planning to use...? I mean, is there really any particular reason we can't develop a datalink that could include the Russian, or other non-western hardware (like the CH-4 drone) in it...? If Telco companies can integrate devices made by Huawei, Cisco, Alcatel, Ericsson, NEC, etc into their system, why can't the same be done with military gears..? If all else fails, then just install some western avionics in it (like MKI or MKM)

I just feel that putting all of our (defence) eggs in a single (western) basket is just waay to risky... a wise consumer would never rely on a single vendor/provider... Especially for a nation like us that will never have formal military alliances with anyone..

As I've said before. Modern armies fought "keroyokan" under a integrated network centric warfare. F16 uses link 16 which is NATO compattible. We cant communicate securely using two different weapons system from two different blocks.
A su35 is sure menacing but wolves hunt in packs,

 

[Whizzack]

There's no such thing as us not being allied with anyone.

We have and always will be under the US sphere of influence.

And you can read back a few pages about the Link-16 and F-35 bit. The BMS we use is an indirect copy of the US BLU4 tracker (pretty shitty system but it works), and uses INS and GPS instead of GLANOSS or BeiDou for geo locating.

We ca

we can't, there's no such thing as an "independent nation" anymore. In today's realm of geopolitics, everybody answers to somebody. Even neutral nations like Sweden, Finland, and Switzerland are still under the NATO sphere of influence.


The KFX is meant to replace the F-16's.

What we need is something to replace the Flankers, as of now they're pretty much just over-hyped bomb trucks that can't even carry PGM's because our network infrastructure is NATO based and are a constant maintenance hog. The only reason I'm vouching for SHornets is because they are stupidly capable for their price, along with the fact that the next 4 big arms purchases are more than likely going to go to Boeing (Wedgetail, KC-46, P-8, more Apaches) which means you can get them for stupid cheap because Boeing's business policy is doing bulk buys.

Duhh... Well.. in that case I can only rest my case... I joined this discussion with the mindset that Indonesia is a free and independent state with (at least some) free will, but it seems the majority consensus here is that we are simply just another US underling... with no space to share with any other power.. which is kind of ridiculous, as the only reason we turn to Russia at the time was because we were cut off and demonized by our 'allies' in the first place... Hopefully if there are ever a time in the future where our national integrity is threatened again, these 'allies' will support us, instead of tearing us...

Well let's move on then ... About the next 4 big arms purchases, I'm curious why would you think it will all go to Boeing...? Wedgetail/Poseidon/Apaches I can understand.. they are crazy expensive but has the capability to match... however KC-46 is the loser in the USAF tanker competition, got selected later only due to furious lobbying by Boeing.. it was based on the B767 which is practically an unknown plane here (and thus no maintenance facilities unlike A330), and even today is actually still in testing phase by USAF... Why won't we get the A330 MRTT like Australia and Sing...?

 

[Nike]

Duhh... Well.. in that case I can only rest my case... I joined this discussion with the mindset that Indonesia is a free and independent state with (at least some) free will, but it seems the majority consensus here is that we are simply just another US underling... with no space to share with any other power.. which is kind of ridiculous, as the only reason we turn to Russia at the time was because we were cut off and demonized by our 'allies' in the first place... Hopefully if there are ever a time in the future where our national integrity is threatened again, these 'allies' will support us, instead of tearing us...

Well let's move on then ... About the next 4 big arms purchases, I'm curious why would you think it will all go to Boeing...? Wedgetail/Poseidon/Apaches I can understand.. they are crazy expensive but has the capability to match... however KC-46 is the loser in the USAF tanker competition, got selected later only due to furious lobbying by Boeing.. it was based on the B767 which is practically an unknown plane here (and thus no maintenance facilities unlike A330), and even today is actually still in testing phase by USAF... Why won't we get the A330 MRTT like Australia and Sing...?

Palm oil

There is no contest here, Boeing will grab all. Euro had shot themselves in the foot

 

[Whizzack]

As I've said before. Modern armies fought "keroyokan" under a integrated network centric warfare. F16 uses link 16 which is NATO compattible. We cant communicate securely using two different weapons system from two different blocks.
A su35 is sure menacing but wolves hunt in packs,

Well we can always let them hunt in packs with their own kind then... no need to force the wolves and the lions to hunt together at the same time... Especially since both are so far apart and have their own hunting grounds anyway... Or we can simply differentiate their roles, F-16 squads can do CAPs, while Flankers squads do the heavy strikes...

Palm oil

There is no contest here, Boeing will grab all. Euro had shot themselves in the foot

Then we are not only in the mercy of one nation, but also in the mercy of just one company... my.. my..

Btw I thought the airbus ban was only for civilian airliner and not military ones...? Otherwise PTDI will suffer as well as their products are mostly airbus...

 

[Nike]

Well we can always let them hunt in packs with their own kind then... no need to force the wolves and the lions to hunt together at the same time... Especially since both are so far apart and have their own hunting grounds anyway... Or we can simply differentiate their roles, F-16 squads can do CAPs, while Flankers squads do the heavy strikes...



Then we are not only in the mercy of one nation, but also in the mercy of just one company... my.. my..

Btw I thought the airbus ban was only for civilian airliner and not military ones...? Otherwise PTDI will suffer as well as their products are mostly airbus...

Mercy or not, retalion is needed. Palm oil is quite vital for us, especially as more than millions worker depend on Palm oil industry. The fall of tobacco industry during late 1990 until early 2000 is quite severe, we dont want a repeat.

You know, thats why bell and Sikorsky will try to grab the chance

 

[trishna_amṛta]

Ada yg pake FN SCAR

View attachment 576519 View attachment 576520

*sigh* Over rated & over priced rifle not to mention SCAR-H is an optic killer. HK-416 & 417 is better option compare to SCAR

 

[asterisktaker]

*sigh* Over rated & over priced rifle not to mention SCAR-H is an optic killer. HK-416 & 417 is better option compare to SCAR

I agree, even U.S operators prefer the HKs, but apparently HK and its CSR bs can get pretty annoying to deal with.

 

[trishna_amṛta]

HK and its CSR bs can get pretty annoying to deal with.

aach finally there is someone here mentioning it . I think the german (in general) had lost their common sense these days. HK for example, they are producing (and selling) guns and somehow they don't wan't their product to be used to hurt people or animals they do not approve . Gone are the days of the Prussian german .

But at least certain german company such as Mercedes still offering the S600 Pullman Guard to anyone who has the money to buy it, doesn't matter if the potential custom is a gangster or similar

 

[Mahakam]

Duhh... Well.. in that case I can only rest my case... I joined this discussion with the mindset that Indonesia is a free and independent state with (at least some) free will, but it seems the majority consensus here is that we are simply just another US underling... with no space to share with any other power.. which is kind of ridiculous, as the only reason we turn to Russia at the time was because we were cut off and demonized by our 'allies' in the first place... Hopefully if there are ever a time in the future where our national integrity is threatened again, these 'allies' will support us, instead of tearing us...

...Alexa play Rammstein - Amerika

 

[mandala]

Infantry and Leopard 2RI MBTs. Credit to Brigif Raider 13/Galuh.

 

[GraveDigger388]

...Alexa play Rammstein - Amerika

Been a while since I hear that song haha

 

[Cromwell]

Duhh... Well.. in that case I can only rest my case... I joined this discussion with the mindset that Indonesia is a free and independent state with (at least some) free will, but it seems the majority consensus here is that we are simply just another US underling... with no space to share with any other power.. which is kind of ridiculous, as the only reason we turn to Russia at the time was because we were cut off and demonized by our 'allies' in the first place... Hopefully if there are ever a time in the future where our national integrity is threatened again, these 'allies' will support us, instead of tearing us...

Well let's move on then ... About the next 4 big arms purchases, I'm curious why would you think it will all go to Boeing...? Wedgetail/Poseidon/Apaches I can understand.. they are crazy expensive but has the capability to match... however KC-46 is the loser in the USAF tanker competition, got selected later only due to furious lobbying by Boeing.. it was based on the B767 which is practically an unknown plane here (and thus no maintenance facilities unlike A330), and even today is actually still in testing phase by USAF... Why won't we get the A330 MRTT like Australia and Sing...?

Indonesia has never have any " allies " in fact our constitution forbids us to have formal written alliance with foreign entities.
The mindset Indonesia as " free and independent " died when Soeharto rose to power, we just either denying or ignoring the reality that we are always being part US sphere of influence eversince New Order

 

[Ruhnama]

Mestinya faktor performa lebih diutamakan (untuk dibahas), daripada alasan2 retoris "negara sahabat", "sesama negara muslim", yang walau dibilang itu "strategis" (supplier RPG bro), nyatanya ya... dipertimbangkan karena harganya saja, toh opsi lain juga Tejas dari India, negara Hindu yang juga rivalnya Pakistan.

Soal itu turki aja jual tanker ke india
Eh org2 pakistan jadi panas dingin
Lucu ya. Gatau tuh bneran kaga si malaysia mau TFX
Wakakaka

kalau lagi rame kaya gini dipapua, harusnya "dibuat" suku suku disana perang ma sesamanya terutama yg dipegunungan dan jangan ditengahi biar beralih perhatian mereka, toh mereka lebih kesukuan daripada bela ras malanesia, opm atau apapun

Cara kurdi vs kurdi digontokin ama turki. Pelan2 kurdi raya gagal tuh.

Paling efektif cara Xinjiang, Cara turki ama mossad dgabung

Btw opini ya ko negara2 asia pada bergejolak ama wilyahe masing2 ya cina india kita juga.

Kalo salah koreksi aj

Yes Taipur Kostrad use scar. In ig militarybuzz there is video tontaipur member and FNC representative test fire the weapon

Btw......

Are we can get this tot for this premium rifle? Because we we have fnc license (predecessor of this premoum gun)
Wkwkkwkwkwk

Scar optic killer because the piston movement as i know, also some operator in US more familiar with AR system . AR has non reciprocating CH,Hk 416/417 use AR system. So many civilian and US personel familiar with 416/417

They didnt like recipirocating CH in scar.
Maybe we more familiar with reciprocating CH config

(I hope there isnt AR fenboy vs recipirocating cahrging handle boy)

 

[trishna_amṛta]

The mindset Indonesia as " free and independent " died when Soeharto rose to power, we just either denying or ignoring the reality that we are always being part US sphere of influence eversince New Order

We have been "leaning" toward specific block since Soekarno era by leaning toward Moscow - Beijing but that mostly due to Eisenhower administration who kept meddling with Indonesia internal affair at the time (DI/TII & PERMESTA)

Gatau tuh bneran kaga si malaysia mau TFX
Wakakaka

Kalau itu mach para beruk semenanjung ngimpi di siang bolong gara2x kebanyakan nasi lemak & teh tarik

Cara kurdi vs kurdi digontokin ama turki. Pelan2 kurdi raya gagal tuh.

Paling efektif cara Xinjiang, Cara turki ama mossad dgabung

Kalau sekarang saya liat RRC pun di HK pakai cara2x persuasif, walaupun mereka masukin orang2x mereka juga utk persiapan "ncomot" para pentolan2x perusuh.

Btw opini ya ko negara2 asia pada bergejolak ama wilyahe masing2 ya cina india kita juga.

Kalo salah koreksi aj

Banayk faktornya boss itu, dan belum tentu juga karna faktor external. Kalaupun ada element2x external itupun sifatnya bukan "state sanction" tapi pribadi masing2x individu aja (para pahlawan kesiangan)

Scar optic killer because the piston movement as i know, also some operator in US more familiar with AR system . AR has non reciprocating CH,Hk 416/417 use AR system. So many civilian and US personel familiar with 416/417

They didnt like recipirocating CH in scar.
Maybe we more familiar with reciprocating CH config

(I hope there isnt AR fenboy vs recipirocating cahrging handle boy)

The problem with SCAR is more of their price tag. SCAR platform just isn't being produce in sufficient quantity to reduce their price (economy of scale) because US military (SOCOM) isn't buying them in sufficient quantity, thus driving the price higher not to mention SCAR-H also well known as optic killer (even the mighty ACOG get killed by it). Personally I'm no where near as fan of anything that use direct-impingement system.