Indian Muslims left behind in Gujarat's growth story

[RoYaL~GuJJaR]

The situation with Muslims is not the same as other minorities.
Other minorities are not the target of historical resentment for having ruled over the majority Hindus.
Other religions were not at the center of the bitter and violent birth of modern India.
Other religions are not held hostage to the ongoing issue of Kashmir.
Other religions are not under a perpetual cloud of suspicion because of alleged association with India's arch-rival.

As much as Indians here will try to gloss over the issue, the fact remains that other minorities do not face the same discrimination that is levelled against India's Muslims. To suggest otherwise is disingenuous.

You can think and type whatever makes you feel better in support of your self propelled opinion....!

 

[Developereo]

You can think and type whatever makes you feel better in support of your self propelled opinion....!

Your fact-filled, clever rebuttal has left me.... speechless!

 

[RoYaL~GuJJaR]

Your fact-filled, clever rebuttal has left me.... speechless!

Then please remain speechless! Instead of posting self satisfactory delusional crap.!

 

[KS]

The situation with Muslims is not the same as other minorities.

True.

Other minorities are not the target of historical resentment for having ruled over the majority Hindus.

Not the fault of any other minorities.

Other religions were not at the center of the bitter and violent birth of modern India.

Again they have only themselves to blame. Not the other communities.

Other religions are not held hostage to the ongoing issue of Kashmir.

Pure BS as the Deoband in its capacity as the largest school of thought being followed has categorically ruled that kashmir is a part of India.

Other religions are not under a perpetual cloud of suspicion because of alleged divided loyalty with India's arch-rival.

Again Pure BS.There are some such old-remnants in Hyderabad. But 99.9% have only loyalty.

As much as Indians here will try to gloss over the issue, the fact remains that other minorities do not face the same discrimination that is levelled against India's Muslims. To suggest otherwise is disingenuous.

I suggest otherwise. Now provide the facts to support your opinion. Or else everything you suggested is just a hogwash.

 

[EastWest]

The situation with Muslims is not the same as other minorities.
Other minorities are not the target of historical resentment for having ruled over the majority Hindus.
Other religions were not at the center of the bitter and violent birth of modern India.
Other religions are not held hostage to the ongoing issue of Kashmir.
Other religions are not under a perpetual cloud of suspicion because of alleged divided loyalty with India's arch-rival.

As much as Indians here will try to gloss over the issue, the fact remains that other minorities do not face the same discrimination that is levelled against India's Muslims. To suggest otherwise is disingenuous.

Indian muslims will be better served if Pakistan and Pakistanis think about themselves and not about muslims all around the world..

Khud ke desh ko chala nahi pa rahe...pure duniya ke musalmano ka theka leke rakha hai

 

[Developereo]

I suggest otherwise. Now provide the facts to support your opinion. Or else everything you suggested is just a hogwash.

You completely miss the point.
The issue I raised is not about what the Muslims do, but what the majority Hindu and other groups do towards Muslims.

Every single one of the items I listed is factually correct. In the ultimate irony you actually managed to prove my point by your predictable attempt to justify the bigotry by saying "they have only themselves to blame".

History is past; the Muslims cannot change that. It is up to the other religions to move beyond history and look towards the future. India has a long way to go before Muslims escape the baggage of history constantly levelled against them.

 

[KS]

You completely miss the point.
The issue I raised is not about what the Muslims do, but what the majority Hindu and other groups do towards Muslims.

Oh no !! Not again "we are sooo victimised" BS. Give me factual incidents of their discrimination and not "Isnt it obvious" kinda statements.

Every single one of the items I listed is factually correct. In the ultimate irony you actually managed to prove my point by your predictable attempt to justify the bigotry by saying "they have only themselves to blame".

I'm just saying prove it with instances.

History is past; the Muslims cannot change that. It is up to the other religions to move beyond history and look towards the future. India has a long way to go before Muslims escape the baggage of history constantly levelled against them.

Prove that the other religions have not moved past history. Im not interested in your 'hot' opinions, but rather 'cold' facts.

 

[Black Widow]

Nobody wants to lag behind. It's just an unfortunate consequence of history & to some extent, ghettoisation complex within some parts of the community. Partition skewed the composition of muslims somewhat with the almost complete removal of an essential component, the middle class who chose to migrate to Pakistan. This unfortunately left behind a population which was unrepresentative when compared to an overall Hindu population. The reason other minority religious communities do not exhibit the same problem is because nothing similar happened with them. This feeling of being isolated is further reinforced with studies showing the muslim population doing poorly on a number of parameters without making allowance for the underlying socio-economic background. A feeling of victimisation ensures because of the lack of adequate explanation for the figures obtained which only tends to further isolate the community from the mainstream. It is always easier to believe in a conspiracy theory to blame for one's misfortune rather than do the hard work necessary to change the circumstances. I'm also disheartened by the apathy shown by other Indians towards setting this sorry circumstance right. Any talk of reservation for muslims becomes an open session for mad rants almost immediately. Those opposing have no better plans, just their standard explanations which border on the idiotic & bigoted. Something has to be done to improve the lot of muslims in India regardless of any historical reasons for their condition simply because we cannot allow a community this large( actually any community) to be left out of the promise of tomorrow's India. That promise must be open to all of India's children regardless of their backgrounds.

nice Observation...

 

[Developereo]

Prove that the other religions have not moved past history.

TIMEasia Magazine: India's Great Divide

for every President or Muslim tech entrepreneur or movie star or policeman, there are 1,000 others with tales of discrimination in the workplace or the education system, harassment by wayward police officers or segregation into ghettos by Hindu landlords. Whatever the causes, there is no disputing the fact that Indian Muslims today are less educated, poorer and live shorter, less secure and less healthy lives than their Hindu counterparts. Census figures paint a bleak picture of their plight. In rural India, 29% of Muslims earn less than $6 a month, compared with 26% of Hindus; in the cities (where a third of all Muslims live) the gap rises to 40% vs. 22%. Some 13% of India's population is Muslim, yet Muslims account for just 3% of government employees, and an even smaller percentage are employed by private Hindu businesses. Meanwhile, in the cities, 30% of Muslims are illiterate, vs. 19% of Hindus. Nor are any of these indices improving.

India's Muslims are also far more likely than Hindus to be victims of violent attacks. In all the communal riots since independence, official police records reveal that three-quarters of the lives lost and properties destroyed were Muslim, a figure that climbed to 85% during last year's riots in Gujarat. The Gujarat authorities even went so far as to price Muslim lives below those of Hindus, offering $2,050 in state compensation for Muslims killed but double that for the riots' 58 Hindu victims. "There is often a tendency in India to treat Muslims as them rather than us," says K.C. Tyagi, former leader of the moderate Hindu Samajwadi Party. "And this tendency does have terrible manifestations. Even today, by and large, Muslims have not been admitted to what we call the Indian mainstream."

The "blame the victim" arrogance displayed by most Indian posters here is indicative of India at large and shows how far India has to go before coming to terms with the bigotry ingrained so deeply within the Indian psyche.

 

[Black Widow]

The situation with Muslims is not the same as other minorities.
Other minorities are not the target of historical resentment for having ruled over the majority Hindus.
Other religions were not at the center of the bitter and violent birth of modern India.
Other religions are not held hostage to the ongoing issue of Kashmir.
Other religions are not under a perpetual cloud of suspicion because of alleged divided loyalty with India's arch-rival.

As much as Indians here will try to gloss over the issue, the fact remains that other minorities do not face the same discrimination that is levelled against India's Muslims. To suggest otherwise is disingenuous.

Misinformed observation....Let me clear few point here...
1. Pakistan must be the last state which should talk bout minorities rights...
2. Muslim rule,: Muslim ruled over Dilli sultanat, many Hindu kingdoms were co-existing even @ time of Akbar.
3. Many muslim ruler were not fanatic, they kept Islam (religion) out of administration.. It was rule of an individual rather than rule of Islam over Hindus.
4. If It would have been rule of Islam, India would have been like Persia (Iran).. All Hindu would have been converted .
5. Indian Muslim have never been targeted on kashmir issue, you are misinformed here. Indian Muslim brothers believe Kashmir as Indian state.
6. Those who wanted Pakistan, are living in Pakistan, Indian muslims are as indian as a sikh or hindu or any one else...

 

[aviator]

An inappropriate title by TS. All 'Indian muslims' do not reside in Gujarat.

 

[KS]

TIMEasia Magazine: India's Great Divide



The "blame the victim" arrogance displayed by most Indian posters here is indicative of India at large and shows how far India has to go before coming to terms with the bigotry ingrained so deeply within the Indian psyche.

You are just giving one BS to cover up the other.

From the same link you provided:

Here we have two Indian Muslims (Javed and Umar)with two very different experiences of their homeland. But the truth is that Javed and Umar share a fundamental burden: in the eyes of many Hindus, no Muslim can ever truly belong in India.

And you know what ppl - Umar is a terrorist. because from the same link our friend provided,

Affable, neatly bearded and smartly dressed, Umar (a pseudonym given to him by TIME) holds the senior rank of ansar, or guide, in India's loosely knit Muslim militant movement. In that capacity, he told Time, he has played a central role in a string of deadly bomb blasts that have rocked Bombay in the past eight months.

Now next is what ? , we should believe Hakimullah of what he says against Pakistan

BTW bring any better source than a 2003 report based on the observations of a terrorist.

 

[Developereo]

How They Crush Mangalore’s Muslims

The Karnataka administration was silent on police atrocities against Muslims in Mangalore; it worked in tandem with the police and the media

 

[KS]

^^^ Some one here seriously believes TEHELKA

Please remind him it is our version of Moin Ansari,Ahmad Qureshi kinda crap.

 

[Developereo]

You are just giving one BS to cover up the other.

It's a well researched article by TIME magazine, quoting official data and interviews with a number of people, including Hindus. It references independent studies that document rampant Hindu discrimination against Muslims.

The article compares the affect of Hindu discrimination on two Muslims: one became a policeman and the other a terrorist. I can understand you want to avoid the main gist of the article and focus on side details. A natural tendency when the main facts are uncomfortable to digest.