Indian Fighter Competition Nears Finals...

[Battle Axe]

All true, but the key to win MMRCA is not only the best fighter for IAF, which indeed is the Rafale, but the best package that also includes industrial, or political advantages. Just like in the Brazilian competition, the industrial side with ToT, offsets, JV or co-developments are important points and will have a higher rating than unit cost for example. At the end, the one that offers the best package for the lowest cost should win and that's why the EF (although more expensive, delayed and less capable according to IAF needs) will remain with good chances to win, if they offer more on the industrial and political side.

I totally agree...

 

[MrIndianSikh]

EF is also more expensive while France is bending backwards for you guys, which means a hotter deal. Also, I am yet to come across a parameter where Rafale fails...

No doubt, both AC are very capable...

EF is technically more capable and has a lower RCS IMO EFT is the 2nd most capable fighter aircraft today in service (only behind F-22)

and it may be more expensive but only because it is much better

 

[MrIndianSikh]

I am guessing that Eurofighter is gonna make the final cut?

god willing

 

[MrIndianSikh]

But you have to admit, Rafale looks so sexy So elegant looking!

And it's cheaper than the EFT!

its not about looks its about technological capability which the EFT is better in also EFT has lower RCS compared to Rafale

 

[ashokdeiva]

But you have to admit, Rafale looks so sexy So elegant looking!

And it's cheaper than the EFT!

Sure that Rafale is super sexy, but we are not buying decorational items. We need Tech to prove our air dominance today and in the next 10 years with this lot. So EFT would be a worthy choice.

 

[chat]

The price that France and EADS are quothing for single aircraft in that price 2 F-18s can be bought .For the price of 126 refaels r eurofighters india can buy 300 f-18s

 

[MrIndianSikh]

here is a comparison of the two fighters
Rafale
Crew: 1--2
Length: 15.27 m (50.1 ft)
Wingspan: 10.80 m (35.4 ft)
Height: 5.34 m (17.5 ft)
Wing area: 45.7 m² (492 ft²)
Empty weight: 9,500 kg (C), 9,770 kg (B),[78] 10,196 kg (M) ()
Loaded weight: 14,016 kg (30,900 lb)
Max takeoff weight: 24,500 kg (C/D), 22,200 kg (M) (54,000 lb)
Powerplant: 2 × Snecma M88-2 turbofans
Dry thrust: 50.04 kN (11,250 lbf) each
Thrust with afterburner: 75.62 kN (17,000 lbf) each
Performance
Maximum speed: **High altitude: Mach 1.8+ (1,900+ km/h, 1,026+ knots)
Low altitude: 1,390 km/h, 750 knots
Range: 3,700+ km (2,000+ nmi)
Combat radius: 1,852+ km (1,000+ nmi) on penetration mission
Service ceiling: 16,800 m (55,000 ft)
Rate of climb: 304.8+ m/s (60,000+ ft/min)
Wing loading: 306 kg/m² (62.8 lb/ft²)
Thrust/weight: 1.10 (100% fuel, 2 EM A2A missile, 2 IR A2A missile)
Armament
Guns: 1× 30 mm (1.18 in) GIAT 30/719B cannon with 125 rounds
Hardpoints: 14 For Armée de l'Air version (Rafale B,C), 13 for Aéronavale version (Rafale M) with a capacity of 9,500 kg (21,000 lb) external fuel and ordnance
Missiles:
Air-to-air:
MICA IR/EM or
Magic II and in the future
MBDA Meteor
Air-to-ground:
MBDA Apache or
SCALP EG or
AASM or
GBU-12 Paveway II or
AM 39 Exocet or
ASMP-A nuclear missile
Others:
Thales Damocles targeting pod
RECO NG reconnaissance pod
up to 5 drop tanks
The Rafale can also carry a buddy-buddy refuelling pod
Avionics
Thales RBE2 radar
Thales SPECTRA electronic warfare system.
Thales/SAGEM OSF (Optronique Secteur Frontal) infrared search and track system.




Typhoon
Crew: 1 (operational aircraft) or 2 (training aircraft)
Length: 15.96 m (52.4 ft)
Wingspan: 10.95 m (35.9 ft)
Height: 5.28 m (17.3 ft)
Wing area: 51.2 m2[222] (551 sq ft)
Empty weight: 11,150 kg (24,600 lb)
Loaded weight: 16,000 kg (35,000 lb)
Max takeoff weight: 23,500 kg (52,000 lb)
Powerplant: 2 × Eurojet EJ200 afterburning turbofan
Dry thrust: 60 kN (13,000 lbf) each
Thrust with afterburner: 89 kN (20,000 lbf) each
Fuel capacity: 4,500 kg (9,900 lb) internal
Performance
Maximum speed:
At altitude: Mach 2 (2,495 km/h/1,550 mph
At sea level: Mach 1.2[221] (1,470 km/h/910 mph
Supercruise: Mach 1.1--1.5
Range: 2,900 km (1,800 mi)
Combat radius:
Ground attack, lo-lo-lo: 601 km (325 nmi)
Ground attack, hi-lo-hi: 1,389 km (750 nmi)
Air defence with 3-hr combat air patrol: 185 km (100 nmi)
Air defence with 10-min. loiter: 1,389 km (750 nmi)
Ferry range: 3,790 km (2,350 mi)
Service ceiling: 19,810 m[230] (64,990 ft)
Rate of climb: >315 m/s[231][232] (62,000 ft/min
Wing loading: 312 kg/m2[222] (64.0 lb/ft2)
Thrust/weight: 1.15
g-limits: +9/−3 g


German ground crew mount an IRIS-T to a Eurofighter
Armament
Guns: 1 × 27 mm Mauser BK-27 Revolver cannon with 150 rounds
Hardpoints: Total of 13: 8 × under-wing; and 5 × under-fuselage pylon stations; holding up to 7,500 kg (16,500 lb) of payload
Missiles:
Air-to-air missiles:
AIM-9 Sidewinder
AIM-132 ASRAAM
AIM-120 AMRAAM
IRIS-T
MBDA Meteor, in the future
Air-to-surface missiles:
AGM-65 Maverick
AGM-88 HARM
Storm Shadow (AKA Scalp EG)
Brimstone
Taurus KEPD 350
Penguin
AGM Armiger, in the future
Bombs:
Paveway II/III/Enhanced Paveway series of laser-guided bombs (LGBs)
Joint Direct Attack Munition (JDAM)
HOPE/HOSBO
Others:
Flares/infrared decoys dispenser pod
chaff pods
Electronic countermeasures (ECM) pods
LITENING III laser targeting pod
Up to 3 drop tanks for ferry flight or extended range/loitering time.
Avionics
Euroradar CAPTOR Radar
Passive Infra-Red Airborne Tracking Equipment (PIRATE)


why do you guys like Rafale so much? we can get better technology from EFT and 100% TOT otherwise it would have not been selected for final cut

and for those of you who likes looks noone in there mind would go up against this beast

 

[dbc]

I am guessing that Eurofighter is gonna make the final cut?

I'd be very surprised, I don't think HAL the Indian equivalent of CAC have the capability nor will the Euro Fighter consortia share cutting edge fabrication technology with India. Remember the Typhoon is 70% composite by weight, while the Rafale has less composites than India's LCA - Rafale will be easier for HAL-India to absorb.

 

[ashokdeiva]

The price that France and EADS are quothing for single aircraft in that price 2 F-18s can be bought .For the price of 126 refaels r eurofighters india can buy 300 f-18s

Buddy, what you say is correct, but there won't be a TOT with F 18. thats just a flyaway cost that you are talking about.
As far as Rafale and EFT are concerned they are giving us the TOT. Thats the reason for the high cost.
Unit Cost
Rafale - €138.46 million
EFT - £125m
F 18 - US$55 million

 

[chat]

Buddy, what you say is correct, but there won't be a TOT with F 18. thats just a flyaway cost that you are talking about.
As far as Rafale and EFT are concerned they are giving us the TOT. Thats the reason for the high cost.
Unit Cost
Rafale - €138.46 million
EFT - £125m
F 18 - US$55 million

LOL TOT is a great buzzword among indians.All TOT you will get is screw driver tot from any country nothing else.

 

[ashokdeiva]

LOL TOT is a great buzzword among indians.All TOT you will get is screw driver tot from any country nothing else.

In that case, what would you go for in the RACE for this expencive items

 

[MrIndianSikh]

EFT will win if IAF/MOD are going on a technical basis

 

[chat]

IF usa offers F-15SE aircraft then india must buy 2-3 squadrons.Its a great plane india must get it from usa.

 

[chat]

EFT will win if IAF/MOD are going on a technical basis

EFT wont win coz of its American weaponry its offering.

 

[chat]

In that case, what would you go for in the RACE for this expencive items

If i would have bought f-18 along with some 2-3 squadrons of f-15SE.