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India lags behind Pakistan in missiles

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in the end i would say that this is a thread that would go on forever...china north korea and paksitan are not democracies...their military program are not for public to verify...like in india where the govt's spending is closely monitored...all the tests have their data shown to the media for all to see...we could have chosen to put our failures under the carpet...all the links that have been posted are indian links...we are fairly transparent about our program.
i appreciate the pakistani program andthe way in which they have beaten the odds to have a fairly succesful issile program of their own which can very well challenge any country's missile program let alone india's...i as an indian respect the capabiltiy of the enemy and would think 10 times before under-estimating the country we are up against...rather than foolishly believing that we have achieved supremacy.
 
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Who says Russian sold you the ballistic missiles? Link please? Thats new.

Aside from that, there is no heck of a way that without cooperation you have built your ballistic missiles. There is heck absolutely no way that your scientists didn't go abroad to study in rocket science.

India's Missiles - With a Little Help from Our Friends
By Gary Milhollin

Bulletin of the Atomic Scientists (November 1989, pp. 31-35 )
India's Missiles - With a Little Help from Our Friends

Last May 22, India became the first country to test a strategic missile derived from a civilian space program. The missile's first-stage rocket motor, heat shield, and guidance system all came from India's space effort -- generously launched and sustained by foreign help.

Prime Minister Rajiv Gandhi claimed that the missile, called "Agni" (fire), is "an R&D vehicle, not a weapons system." Then he qualified the assertion. "Agni is not a nuclear weapons system," he said. "What Agni does is to afford us the option of developing the ability to deliver non-nuclear weapons with high precision at long ranges."

In the May test, the missile reportedly flew 625 miles. But it is designed to carry a one-ton payload 1,500 miles, far enough to hit cities in southern China. Carrying a half-ton atomic bomb, the Agni would be able to fly about 2,200 miles, far enough to hit Beijing.

Whether Agni eventually carries nuclear or conventional weapons, the missile should destroy any illusions about sharing technology in the interest of peaceful uses of outer space. The story of the Agni's development shows how difficult it is to separate civilian and military uses of technology, and just how futile may be the recent, belated attempts to control the proliferation of military missile technology. A control regime established by seven Western nations in 1987 seeks to prevent precisely this sort of development. [See the June 1988 Bulletin.] Yet the regime has no provisions for enforcement, and the Indian program continued full speed ahead, with some foreign - particularly West German - cooperation, after the regime was adopted.

Lessons in America

Agni's foreign ancestry dates from the 1960s. In November 1963, the United States began India's space program by launching a U.S. sounding rocket from Indian soil. (Sounding rockets fly straight up into the atmosphere to conduct scientific experiments. They are too small to launch satellites.) The United States was followed by others. Between 1963 and 1975, more than 350 U.S., French, Soviet, and British sounding rockets were launched from India's Thumba Range,[1] which the United States helped design. Thumba's first group of Indian engineers had learned rocket launching and range operation in the United States.

Among them was the Agni's chief designer, A. J. P. Abdul Kalam. In 1963-64, he spent four months in training in the United States. He visited NASA's Langley Research Center in Virginia, where the U.S. Scout rocket was conceived, and the Wallops Island Flight Center on the Virginia coast, where the Scout was being flown. The Scout was a low-cost, reliable satellite launcher that NASA had developed for orbiting small payloads.

Soon afterward, in 1965, the Indian government asked NASA how much it would cost and how long it would take to develop an Indian version of the Scout, and whether the United States would help. NASA replied that the Scout was "available . . . for purchase . . . in connection with scientific research," but warned that "transfer of this technology . . . would be a matter for determination by the Department of State under Munitions Control."[2] NASA nevertheless sent India technical reports on the Scout's design, which was unclassified. India's request should have raised some eyebrows: it came from Homi Bhabha, head of the Indian Atomic Energy Commission.

But Kalam had the information he needed. He returned to India and built the SLV-3 (Space Launch Vehicle), India's first satellite launcher. Its design is virtually identical to the Scout's. Both rockets are 23 meters long, use four similar solid-fuel stages and "open loop" guidance, and lift a 40-kilogram payload into low earth orbit. The SLV's 30-foot first stage would later become the first stage of the Agni.

NASA officials say U.S. aid to India in rocketry was limited to the program in the 1960s. In 1988, however, the United States agreed to supply an advanced ring laser gyroscope to help guide a new Indian fighter plane.[3] It is not clear what will prevent India from using it to guide missiles. The highly accurate device is essentially solid state, making it easy to adapt to the demands of missile acceleration.

French lessons: liquid fuel

France also launched sounding rockets from India, and in the late 1960s allowed India to begin building "Centaure" sounding rockets under license from Sud Aviation. But France's main contribution has been in the field of liquid propulsion. Under a license from France's Societe Europeene de Propulsion (SEP), India is building its own version of the Viking high-thrust liquid rocket motor, used on the European Space Agency's Ariane satellite launcher.[4] Indian engineers helped develop the Viking in the mid-1970s, then began a program of their own. India has now built an experimental model of the Viking engine, called the Vikas.

The training in liquid propulsion seems to have paid off. Just over a year before testing the Agni, Kalam tested a smaller predecessor, the "Prithvi" (earth), which uses a liquid-propelled motor to carry a one-ton payload 150 miles. It resembles the widely sold Soviet Scud-B.
Indian sources say that the Agni's second stage is a shortened version of the Prithvi.[5]

A German intensive tutorial

The aid of the United States and France, however, was quickly dwarfed by West German help in the 1970s and 1980s. Germany gave India help in three indispensable missile technologies: guidance, rocket testing, and the use of composite materials. All were supposed to be for the space program, but all were equally useful for military missiles.

The German government's aerospace agency DLR (Deutsche Forschungsanstalt fur Luftfahrt und Raumfahrt e.V.) began tutoring India in rocket guidance in 1976.[6] The first step was to put a German interferometer on an Indian sounding rocket. An interferometer works by using antennas placed at different locations on the rocket to measure the phase of a radio signal received from the ground. The phase difference among the antennas reveals their relative positions on the rocket and thus the rocket's attitude, which can be monitored and corrected from the ground. The first launch of an Indian rocket with a German interferometer was in 1978. By 1981 the project had been expanded to include an on-board DLR microprocessor. In April 1982, India tested its own version of the same interferometer.

The next step was to make a navigation system that did not depend on signals from the ground, one that could guide a payload through space by determining its position and speed at any moment. The "autonomous payload control system," which India proposed in July 1981, would provide "full autonomous navigation capability to spaceborne sensors," determining "position, velocity, attitude, and precision time in a real-time mode." India would supply the rockets and satellites; Germany would provide the brains of the guidance system. The key component would be an on-board computer, using a microprocessor based on the Motorola family M 68000, and the software to run it.

It must be noted that an inertial navigation system that can guide satellites can also guide warheads. The United States used NASA's experience in guiding the Titan II transtage, a "bus" designed for multiple satellite launchings, to develop a bus that would accurately deliver small nuclear warheads.[7]

The German-Indian plan was carried out. By January 1982, the two countries had agreed on a series of joint projects for the program. But at the same time, India announced that it was designing a new navigation system for its own space rockets: it would replace the "open loop" system used on its first launcher, the SLV-3, with a "closed loop" system for its Advanced Space Launch Vehicle and its Polar Space Launch Vehicle. An open loop system can only correct the rocket's attitude, not deviations from the planned flight path. A closed loop system can correct both, because it senses and determines the rocket's position in space. It amounts to an autonomous navigation system.

So while India's program with Germany, called APC-Rex for Autonomous Payload Control Rocket Experiment, was developing autonomous navigation for a satellite, India would develop autonomous navigation for its own rockets. India would need a brain for its space rockets' new closed loop system, which it would provide by developing the "Mark-II" onboard processor - "based on [the] Motorola 6800 microprocessor with 16-bit word length" - the same as that used in the German program. (Although Indian reports repeatedly refer to the Motorola "6800," according to Motorola the 16-bit chip is the M 68000.) The timing of subsequent events showed continued parallel developments in the two programs.

The German aid in guidance is apparently continuing, despite the Agni launch. In May 1989, a DLR official said that "the APC-Rex program has not yet been concluded, but it will come to an end in 1989."[8] West Germany was one of the seven countries that adopted the Missile Technology Control Regime in 1987, an agreement not to export items useful in making long-range missiles. That agreement barred the export of technology capable of real-time processing of navigation data, unless specific assurances could be given that the technology would not be used for, or transferred to, missile programs. If, as the evidence suggests, technology from APC-Rex has been used in India's rocket and missile programs, Germany may have violated the agreement.

India has not described the Agni guidance system. But when the missile was assembled in 1988, Indian rocket scientists had studied and developed only one brain for rocket guidance: the German system based on the Motorola microprocessor and its software. Over a decade, Germany's guidance tutorial helped India build and test a navigation package based on that system. Did that system go into the Agni, or did India invent from scratch some other system, not mentioned in any Indian space program report? If the latter, did the Indian rocket scientists block from their minds everything they had learned from the Germans? The evidence is strong that the Agni owes its brain to German engineering.

Interchangeable parts

The Indian space program first mentions the Agni in its 1982-83 annual report as a booster rocket for the Polar Space Launch Vehicle: six identical Agni boosters will lift the missile's first stage. The boosters, in turn, are adaptations of the first stage of the SLV-3.[9] Indeed, the SLV-3 is the only large booster motor that India has: it carries nine tons of solid propellant, as does the Agni first stage; no other Indian booster carries anything close to that amount. India has used the same booster to lift the Advanced Space Launch Vehicle.[10] After the Agni launch a number of sources, Indian as well as foreign, reported that the Agni first stage was identical to the SLV-3 first stage. Thus, the main rocket for India's missile program has come from India's space program.

This same rocket, in turn, owes much to German help. Wind tunnels are essential to the design of any rocket. In 1974-75, DLR tested a model of the first stage of the SLV-3 in its wind tunnel at Cologne-Portz. DLR also helped India build rocket test facilities, furnishing a complete facility design and training Indian engineers in high-altitude testing. India has said it will use this technology to test the liquid-fueled upper stage of the Polar Space Launch Vehicle, and it may already have done so. India may also have used it to test the Agni's liquid-fueled second stage, which must have been tested somewhere.

In June 1988, two Egyptian military officers were indicted for trying to smuggle carbon fiber composites out of the United States. Export of the composites was strictly controlled: the strong, lightweight, heat-resistant materials were being used for the nozzles and the nosecone of the MX, Trident, and Minuteman nuclear missiles.

But DAR began giving Indian scientists on-the-job training in composites at Stuttgart and Braunschweig in the mid-1970s. Subjects ranged from "glass fibre reinforced plastics via impregnated materials" to "carbon fibre reinforced composites." The Indians learned "composition, manufacturing processes, quality control, and error detection."

The German training allowed India to make rocket nozzles and nosecones of its own, which could be for either missiles or space launchers. To help the Indians use the composites, DAR supplied the documentation for a precision filament-winding machine, which India built and commissioned in 1985-86.

After the Agni test, Prime Minister Gandhi affirmed that one of the goals was to test "atmospheric reentry." Lower-ranking officials were more specific. They said that the goal was to test a "domestically developed heat shield."[11]

Target: China

No country, including India, has ever spent money on long-range rockets simply to explore space. The "satellites" launched by the SLV-3 were little more than flight monitors, used to transmit data on rocket performance, which was India's true interest. To launch real satellites, India could and did hire other providers of that service. The Soviets launched India's first two satellites; France's Ariane rocket and the U.S. space shuttle have launched others.

Nor has any country developed long-range missiles simply to deliver conventional bombs. The large cost of missile development is only justified by the ability to inflict strategic blows, which conventional warheads cannot do.

The Agni, therefore, can only be interpreted as a step toward a long-range nuclear strike force. As India progresses in guidance, the Agni's range should extend gradually to most targets in China.

India apparently has the material and skill to mass produce the Agni and arm it with nuclear warheads. The result will be a new nuclear equation in Asia. Across a common border, nuclear-armed rivals will confront each other, each with missiles, one or both vulnerable to a first strike from the other.

When India exploded an atomic bomb in 1974, the world was shocked. India had taken a Canadian reactor and U.S. heavy water both imported under guarantees of peaceful use and used them openly to make plutonium for a nuclear blast. That blast destroyed illusions about the "peaceful atom" and prompted changes in nuclear export policy. It is not surprising that India has again taken advantage of civilian imports and technology to further what appears to be a nuclear weapons program. What is surprising is that, given India's record, it was so easy.



How a Satellite Guidance System Gets into a Missile

(Excerpts from program reports)

1982-83

APC-Rex (German-Indian missile program satellite guidance program): received Motorola 68000 microprocessor

Indian space and missile program: "An engineering model of the Mark-ll based on the Motorola 6800 [sic] has been integrated and exhaustive tests are being carried out."

1983-84

APC-Rex (German-Indian missile program satellite guidance program): "Development of an on-board computer for autonomous payload control is in progress."

Indian space and missile program: "Design review was conducted on inertial navigation systems with the participation of international experts."

1984-85

APC-Rex (German-Indian missile program satellite guidance program): "Design of the on-board [guidance] packages was completed."

Indian space and missile program: "Design of on-board processors for SLV based on 16-bit microprocessors has been completed."

1986-87

APC-Rex (German-Indian missile program satellite guidance program): "Development and validation of hardware and software packages for APC-Rex are in their final stages."

Indian space and missile program: "Breadboard models of on-board computers based on microprocessors have been realized."



India: Missile Helpers
India: Missile Helpers((January-February 1995)God knows about later
India did not build its missiles alone. The world's leading rocket producers gave essential help in research, development and manufacture.

France
Licensed production of sounding rockets in India
Supplied the liquid-fuel Viking rocket engine, now the "Vikas" engine of the Polar Satellite Launch Vehicle (PSLV) second stage
Tested Indian-produced Vikas engine in France

Germany
Delivered measurement and calibration equipment to ISRO (Indian Space Research Organization) laboratories
Trained Indians in high-altitude tests of rocket motors and in glass and carbon fiber composites for rocket engine housings, nozzles and nose cones
Designed high-altitude rocket test facilities
Conducted wind tunnel tests for Satellite Launch Vehicle - SLV-3 rocket
Developed radio frequency interferometer for rocket guidance
Developed computers for rocket payload guidance based on U.S. microprocessor
Supplied documentation for a filament-winding machine to make rocket engine nozzles and housings
Helped build Vikas rocket engine test facilities
Designed hypersonic wind tunnel and heat transfer facilities
Supplied rocket motor segment rings for PSLV

Russia
Supplied surface-to-air missiles which became the models for the Prithvi missile and the second stage of the Agni medium-range missileSold seven cryogenic rocket engines

United Kingdom
Supplied components for Imarat Research Center, home to the Agni missile
Supplied magnetrons for radar guidance and detonation systems to Defense Research and Development Laboratory


United States
Launched U.S.-built rockets from Thumba test range
Trained Dr. Abdul Kalam, designer of the Agni
Introduced India to the Scout rocket, the model for the Satellite Launch Vehicle - SLV-3 rocket and the Agni first stage
Sent technical reports on the Scout rocket to Homi Bhabha, the head of the Indian Atomic Energy Commission
Sold equipment that can simulate vibrations on a warhead
 
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Made in America?
How U.S. Exports Helped Fuel the South Asian Arms Race
By Gary Milhollin

The Washington Post
June 7, 1998, p. C1

India and Pakistan, fresh from testing nuclear devices, are poised to build missiles that could deliver the bomb deep into each other's territory. The United States deplores these developments, but along with other countries, stands guilty of supplying much of the necessary technology.

In fact, India's next generation of nuclear missiles will probably be designed with the help of American-made equipment.

U.S. officials say that in 1996, Digital Equipment Corp. shipped a supercomputer to the Indian Institute of Science in Bangalore, a key missile research site. Supercomputers are the most powerful tools known for designing nuclear weapons and the missiles to deliver them. They can model the thrust of a rocket, calculate the heat and pressure on a warhead entering the Earth's atmosphere and simulate virtually every other force affecting a missile from launch to impact. Because of the billions of computations needed to solve these problems, a supercomputer's speed is invaluable for efficiently finding design solutions.

The DEC computer will come in handy at the Indian Institute of Science. The institute is on the British government's official list of organizations that procure goods and technology for India's missile programs. It develops India's most advanced rocket propellants, guidance systems and nose cones. Its wind tunnels and other equipment analyze rocket fuel combustion and flight performance. It has even been linked in published reports to India's new nuclear-capable missile called the "Sagarika," intended to be launched from submarines.

International Business Machines Corp. supplied the institute with an even more powerful supercomputer. According to IBM spokesman Fred McNeese, IBM installed the supercomputer at the institute's Supercomputing Education and Research Center, which specializes in computer-aided design. The machine operated at 1.4 billion operations per second when installed in 1994, and IBM upgraded it in March 1997 to perform 3.2 billion operations per second and again in June 1997 to 5.8 billion, making it one of the most powerful computers in India.

The pro-export Commerce Department granted a license for the DEC sale, despite the notoriety of the institute as a missile site. Commerce also licensed the original installation by IBM, but IBM performed the upgrades without a license, in apparent violation of the law.

This week, the U.S. Customs Service opened an investigation into the IBM upgrades. It is already investigating IBM for selling a supercomputer to Russia's leading nuclear weapons lab under similar circumstances.

The U.S. government requires an American company to obtain an export license if it wants to sell to a bomb-prone nation like India a computer that performs more than 2 billion operations per second. IBM claimed an exception, that allows such computers to be shipped as long as the buyer is not connected to nuclear weapons, chemical weapons, missile or military work. The seller must ensure that the exception applies, which IBM failed to do. McNeese of IBM says only that the company "has no indication that the machine has been used for anything other than university research."

And there is the case of Viewlogic Systems Inc. of Marlborough, Mass. According to the Journal of Commerce, Viewlogic shipped computer software for designing printed circuit boards to an Indian missile manufacturer on the very day that President Clinton announced sanctions against India for its five nuclear weapon tests.

The Commerce Department approved the sale, despite the fact that the buyer was Bharat Dynamics Ltd. (BDL), a leading entry on the British government's list of Indian missile makers. BDL manufactures and assembles India's single-stage Prithvi missile, which can deliver a nuclear payload about 150 miles, and the two-stage Agni, which can deliver one about 1,500 miles. Both threaten Pakistan's major cities.

With better electronic circuits, BDL's nuclear missiles will be more accurate and reliable. The same is true of the antitank and other guided missiles that BDL makes, and advertises in a public catalogue.

How the Commerce Department could approve a sale to India's main missile assembly site remains a mystery. Both Viewlogic and the Commerce Department decline to comment on the sale. This misguided policy of helping India develop missiles is not new. In 1963, the United States began India's missile program by launching a U.S. rocket from India's new Thumba Range, which the United States helped design. Despite his recent claim to being "indigenous," A.P.J. Abdul Kalam, the "father" of the Indian bomb, spent four months in training in the United States. After visiting NASA's Wallops Flight Facility on the Virginia coast, where he saw the U.S. Scout space rocket in action, he returned to India to build a copy.

The U.S. government obligingly supplied data on the Scout's design after a request from the Indian Atomic Energy Commission. The Scout's first-stage rocket is identical to the first stage of India's longest-range missile, the Agni.

Virtually every element of India's nuclear and missile programs has been imported directly or copied from imported designs. The Agni's second-stage rocket motor is derived from a Russian-supplied surface-to-air missile and the Agni's guidance system was developed with help from Germany's space agency.

The story in Pakistan is similar. In 1962, NASA launched Pakistan's first rocket, a U.S.-made Nike-Cajun, in a project led by Tariq Mustafa, the senior scientific officer of the Pakistan Atomic Energy Commission. NASA also trained Pakistani rocket scientists at Wallops Island. The Pakistanis were there at the same time as the Indians. Other NASA-sponsored launches followed until 1970. China stepped in later to supply Pakistan's need for bigger missiles, but Uncle Sam launched Pakistan's missile program just as he did India's.

Sanctions will stop at least some of the exports from the United States. Because of the recent nuclear tests, U.S. law now bars the sale to India or Pakistan of any "goods and technology" controlled by the Commerce Department. Although the White House was quick to apply financial sanctions, it is still deciding how to interpret this export prohibition. It could cost big exporting companies real money. The companies are already lining up to limit the sanctions as much as they can.

On May 14, the Industry Coalition on Technology Transfer, the exporters' main lobbying group, wrote to the White House urging that the sanctions be confined to nuclear-related items. They hope the White House will decide that missile-related and chemical weapon-related items will still be free for export. They also requested that they be allowed to sell spare parts and service for U.S. products already in place -- such as the DEC and IBM computers. The exporters seem content to watch India and Pakistan build nuclear missiles with American technology.

The administration is now considering three options. The first is to forbid any item controlled for export to be sold to anyone in India or Pakistan -- no one could buy a military-related item or any item that could help make nuclear weapons, chemical/biological weapons or missiles. Only 1 percent of U.S. sales to India are now controlled for export, so this option would be effective and painless.

The second option is to deny the nuclear and missile items to everybody, but allow private companies in India and Pakistan to buy only conventional military and chemical/biological items. The third option would allow the two governments to buy such items as well. These latter two options would undermine the integrity of the legislation passed by Congress.

What will the president decide? The pro-trade and pro-India forces are leaning on him, and he is bending. He has already hinted that he would be satisfied if India merely promised to sign the Comprehensive Test Ban Treaty and to cap its production of nuclear weapon material.

But neither pledge would mean much. The treaty tries to limit the qualitative improvement of nuclear weapons by countries that already have arsenals. It has little to do with proliferation -- the decision of a country to build an arsenal in the first place. Even if India and Pakistan signed the treaty tomorrow, they would still be free to build an unlimited number of bombs and the missiles to deliver them. Both countries now have nuclear test data and India even has American supercomputers to process it.

Capping nuclear material production won't work either. By the time a limit could be negotiated, India could have enough for well over 100 warheads. Pakistan could have enough for at least a couple dozen. The total yield could still devastate the subcontinent.

The only solution is the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty, which obliges countries other than the five big nuclear powers to give up the bomb. Although neither India nor Pakistan would join the treaty now, while tempers and rhetoric are boiling, there is a decent chance in the long run. The goal must be to get South Asia to behave like South Africa. Pretoria secretly built six workable warheads, but decided life would be better without them. Trade, investment and high-tech imports were judged more valuable than a nuclear arsenal. Argentina and Brazil made the same decision, as did Belarus, Kazakhstan and Ukraine, which inherited nuclear warheads from their Soviet days.

All of these countries gave up the bomb and all except Brazil joined the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty as non-nuclear weapons states in the 1990s.

That's the direction the world is going and the direction the world must press India and Pakistan to take. Pakistan has said repeatedly that it will join if India does, so the situation can still be reversed, even after Pakistan's tests.

Sanctions are the best hope of getting there. President Clinton should adopt a broad ban on high technology and convince U.S. allies to join. At a minimum, it would sever the technological lifeline that has always sustained the South Asian nuclear and missile effort. That alone would be a worthy achievement. It would prevent the Commerce Department from licensing more mass destruction.

And because a cutoff would ban much civilian high technology as well, India in particular would be deprived of what it needs to modernize its industry and armed forces. After a few years, India would face the technology gap that doomed the Warsaw Pact.

India's tests were a reckless maneuver by a shaky government to shore up domestic political support. The tests left Pakistan little choice but to answer in kind. When the aftershocks die down, and more rational heads prevail, the path away from the bomb will open once again.

Made in America? How U.S. Exports Helped Fuel the South Asian Arms Race
 
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Ambiguous Credibility of Indian Missile System; Consequences

By *Amanullah Khan
One way to project military power for greater destruction is the use of
missiles in modern warfare. Technically advanced missiles can cause
immense damage to enemy assets. The credibility of a missile force is
heavily dependent on the accuracy of the system and the ability of the system to penetrate enemy defenses.
India has spent valuable resources on building a strong missile capability. It has a series of missiles which are set to achieve different objectives. Whether the missile capability building is Pakistan centric or China centric, is not an important question because the real test of time will come when and how these systems are used during war situations and whether or not there are effective doctrinal nuances to stop an accidental launch.. The Indian chain of command or their oscillating military doctrine
(limited to total war) leaves much to be desired. Faced with these odds Pakistani counter measures are certainly aimed to deter India at its best.
However before we take the debate further two aspects needs to be understood first is the ownership of the command and control and second is the credibility of the Indian missiles. Looking at the Indian missile capability following facts are visible:
India has both cruise and ballistic missiles. The latest long range ballistic missile of
India is Agni-III which is capable of reaching the range of 3500 km. Nag is the shortest range (4 to 6 km) an anti-tank missile. In between them are the series of Prithvi and Agni. Brahmos is the latest supersonic cruise missile, and some other like Akash and Trishul are anti-aircraft missiles.
It is well understood that Indian missiles are able to reach each corner of Pakistan but it is also an admitted fact that India’s missile program has major technological shortcomings. Many of missile trials have been officially declared as failed tests and there are so many unsuccessful tests which have been declared as successful for certain political reason, and this is a grim reality. When we say failed then it means the credibility is not believable and trustworthy. The quality of missile system is as important
as the quantity and most importantly their respective command and control. The reason is that missile is launched for a set target, if that target is not hit accurately, then the use of missile is worthless if not suicidal as it increases the capacity of the theatre of war begging answer to the question in the current crises that is India prepared to have an all out war with Pakistan and can the missiles ever be used as precision guided munitions; the short answer is perhaps a negative as any use of missile could easily
lead to a counter response by Pakistan or even an accidental nuclear launch .. as there is tenable measure through which we can decipher a conventional or a nuclear strike launch in its inception Phase; hence increasing the risk of an accidental nuclear war in region already fraught with the uncertainty of war. .
There is no doubt that South Asia is now a days at the verge of a nuclear war between and India. Taking advantage of the Mumbai terrorist attack, Indian perhaps in collusion with extra regional powers are believes that a preemptive strike on Pakistan will be palatable to Islamabad ; the fact is it will lead war with Pakistan. Whether Indian leadership believes in such a fallacy vis-à-vis Pakistan or can absorb the
pressure from abroad or not, has to be decided by the Indian government. But the unacceptable consequences of war with a nuclear armed Pakistan should not be lost sight of by the Indian leadership if they want to rise as regional power let alone a
global power. Increasing the war rhetoric or challenging Pakistani defence capabilities favour of war would lead both rivals for large scale mutual destruction. It is expected and
is a rational choice too that war could not be imposed on Pakistan without an acceptable of incalculable loss to India itself ; which no sober leadership in India would accept or looks forward to .. But in case of Pak-India possible war, which India calls it, ‘limited war’ it will not be limited for Pakistan as Islamabad maintains that the assured Defence of ‘each inch of the terrority is the prime responsibility and directive of the Pakistan
defence forces’ India’s missile attack will be strongly retaliated by Pakistan particularly as no Indian
Ballistic Missile Defence (BMD) system is capable of thwarting a counter Pakistani strike. Therefore, there is no way to intercept a Pakistani missile response. Pakistan missiles can penetrate deep into Indian territory; changing the specter of war from conventional to even nuclear.

* The author is a Research Fellow at South Asian Strategic Institute (SASSI).

http://www.sassu.org.uk/pdfs/ambuguity_of_indian_missile_system.pdf
 
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light years is to measure distance nd not tme or days...it is the amount of distance covered by light in a year i.e (3*100000000*60*60*24*365) metres.

and as far ar india's supercomputing is concerned...

1)world's fourth fastes computer by india..



2)8 indian supercomputer's in the global top 500 list...


3)distribution of supercomputers by country...


feel free to search on the indian supercomputing capabilities...on your own too.

:what: :rofl::rofl: India made Eka Super computer :rofl::rofl:. It is a cluster and each computer of this cluster is made by HP.
model of each node = HP Cluster Platform 3000BL.

each node is runnig on Intel XEON 3GHz processor. How do you claim that it is made by India. And secondly making a cluster is dead easy. I can make it. I even made it my home using 4 computers.

None of your super computers are made by your self. one is made by IBM and all others are made by HP.

and you are saying it is 4th fastest computer. very old news. it is now on rank 13. and the top500 super computer list is updated on November 2008. and you are telling us on Feb 2009 that it is ranked Forth in the world. :rofl::rofl:.
i am giving you the link below.

Don't lie all the time.
 
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here it is
top500. org /list / 2008 / 11 / 100
there are spaces in the links. because i am not allowed to post url until i do 25 posts
 
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Well mate (MWALAM) I have just gone thorugh with that website and I can hear wuff wuff from the neighbourhood. Let see what would they claim now???
 
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I believe their all defence programs are well behind from Pakistan and China. In UK india only exports clothes, which is very cheap and low quality on other hands pakistani shirt starts from £40. Pakistani clothes have very good quality. chinese clothes are cheaper and low quality and they also sell very high quality. I havn't seen any electronics or mechanical thing, which is made in india. but chinese are making every thing. and they have quality as well. My Apple MacBook is designed in California but it is assembled in China.
 
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:what: :rofl::rofl: India made Eka Super computer :rofl::rofl:. It is a cluster and each computer of this cluster is made by HP.
model of each node = HP Cluster Platform 3000BL.

each node is runnig on Intel XEON 3GHz processor. How do you claim that it is made by India. And secondly making a cluster is dead easy. I can make it. I even made it my home using 4 computers.

None of your super computers are made by your self. one is made by IBM and all others are made by HP.

and you are saying it is 4th fastest computer. very old news. it is now on rank 13. and the top500 super computer list is updated on November 2008. and you are telling us on Feb 2009 that it is ranked Forth in the world. :rofl::rofl:.
i am giving you the link below.

Don't lie all the time.

Sorry Guy's...Just can't resist....Father of Pentium - Vinod Dham Product of DCE...:wave:

On Serious note dude....If you don't know than don't make such comments..... Super Computer are much more than just clustering.....Seriously I kow what I am talking abt....just try to write s/w that can use capabilities of 4 comp in the cluster.....and hey I am not talking abt distributed computing either tx
 
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Sorry Guy's...Just can't resist....Father of Pentium - Vinod Dham Product of DCE...:wave:

On Serious note dude....If you don't know than don't make such comments..... Super Computer are much more than just clustering.....Seriously I kow what I am talking abt....just try to write s/w that can use capabilities of 4 comp in the cluster.....and hey I am not talking abt distributed computing either tx

Can you explain me what is a super computer and what is a cluster? How can you make a cluster and super computer?
Please explain it to me.

Another Thing Pentium Processor is now a history. If you see the history, He Did Not Developed Pentium Processor in India. He Did in USA.. . You know who invented Liquid Crystals. which brought revolution to the electronic display. A Pakistani. He is my Father and he invented in a Company in UK.
Tell me what you have invented in 40 years. You are not able to make your own computer. Using HP computer. to make a HPC. you can make super by using Play Station 3.
 
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Tell me what you have invented in 40 years. You are not able to make your own computer. Using HP computer. to make a HPC. you can make super by using Play Station 3.

that is why every body in Pakistan uses supercomputers indegenously designed in Pakistan...it is soo simple

also care to tell me how many of the Supercomputers in the Top 500 use proprietary fabricated hardware as opposed to purchasing off-the-shelf commercially availabe hardware and design your own cluster/grid computing solution using it

let me give you a headstart

the fastest computer in the world - IBM's Roadrunner-series uses AMD Opteron processors along with IBM's own cell processors that is found in Sony's PS3 running Red Hat Linux

and since we are at it

Param Padma

PARAM Sheersh

PARAM Anant

PARAM 10000

Param Yuva


not only does it find wide-spread use in India it is also exported


oh BTW which supercomputing solution did you say Pakistan developed, which according to you is sooo simple? ;)

also don't forget to enlighten us which supercomputing solution uses proprietary solution not to be used anywhere else as opposed to the off-the-shelf approach taken by India and also the world's fastest computer - IBM Roadrunner
 
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that is why every body in Pakistan uses supercomputers indegenously designed in Pakistan...it is soo simple

also care to tell me how many of the Supercomputers in the Top 500 use proprietary fabricated hardware as opposed to purchasing off-the-shelf commercially availabe hardware and design your own cluster/grid computing solution using it

let me give you a headstart

the fastest computer in the world - IBM's Roadrunner-series uses AMD Opteron processors along with IBM's own cell processors that is found in Sony's PS3 running Red Hat Linux

and since we are at it

Param Padma

PARAM Sheersh

PARAM Anant

PARAM 10000

Param Yuva


not only does it find wide-spread use in India it is also exported



oh BTW which supercomputing solution did you say Pakistan developed, which according to you is sooo simple? ;)

also don't forget to enlighten us which supercomputing solution uses proprietary solution not to be used anywhere else as opposed to the off-the-shelf approach taken by India and also the world's fastest computer - IBM Roadrunner

It depends on your needs. IBM is American Company right. They made it by using AMD Processors, and their own cell processors. which is an American Company. your C-DAC is not making the computers. They are providing the service to other countries by using HP Servers. It depends on the need. Clustering is easy. I had made cluster at home once. and run testing applications. Do I need a cluster at home. secondly Pakistanis must have clusters. But main thing is. You said "Eka" is an Indian Supercomputer. Which is made in India. Wrong. It is Supercomputer assembled in india by Using HP Parts. IBM Blue Gene is Made in America by an American company called IBM.
 
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:what: :rofl::rofl: India made Eka Super computer :rofl::rofl:. It is a cluster and each computer of this cluster is made by HP.
model of each node = HP Cluster Platform 3000BL.

each node is runnig on Intel XEON 3GHz processor. How do you claim that it is made by India. And secondly making a cluster is dead easy. I can make it. I even made it my home using 4 computers.

None of your super computers are made by your self. one is made by IBM and all others are made by HP.
World's fastest super computer the "RoadRunner" is made of IBM Blade servers which consist of AMD Opteron processors. So, its an AMD Supercomputer?:chilli:

Secondly, you are confusing yourself with the cluster that you made at home with the clustering used in the contxt of supercomputers.
 
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