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India and Pakistan need to reunite like Germany and Vietnam: Markandey Katju

fyi, can somebody tell this moron katju that north and south vietnam did NOT "reunite". north vietnam, in spite of being weaker than south vietnam and constantly demonized and economically isolated from the rest of the world while south vietnam was armed to the teeth by u.s. and artificially made to economically boom, INVADED and CONQUERED south vietnam! there's a difference!!!
 
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And he is saying Pakistan is integrating/connecting with China in every sense of the word. Erm WTF....no its not....not even close. A chinese person sticks out in Pakistan and vice versa...and on average they have very different culture/outlook/priorities etc, its the plain truth. Those have to be lot more similar for any actual integrating/connecting to happen at any appreciable intrinsic level.

Long term maybe I argue we share more cultural traits with Iran, than Turkey and China maybe as more people to people in coming decades yes, Iran has more cultural influence on the hinterlands like Balochistan, KPK and the areas around there I think better ties should be made with Iran no more sectarian crap

Pakistan’s future lies in Afghanistan, not India.

We share many similarities, and after the fall of Kabul government, it will be a honeymoon between the two of us.

India will just drag its feet like an unwanted guest.

I agree but be careful of Afghani scums we need to dominate Afghanistan not be friendly those willy eyed Afghans are known to double play but I agree once the cards in our hands we will finally be connected to Timurs homeland of Central Asia and Tashkent once Afghanistan are in our hands, then the full intergration of Eurasian states,Turkey, China and Iran with Pak is much possible

fyi, can somebody tell this moron katju that north and south vietnam did NOT "reunite". north vietnam, in spite of being weaker than south vietnam and constantly demonized and economically isolated from the rest of the world while south vietnam was armed to the teeth by u.s. and artificially made to economically boom, INVADED and CONQUERED south vietnam! there's a difference!!!

Vietnam and German seperation was caused by political diff between Communism, and Western style Liberal Democracy while Pakistan and India was more of religious and ethnic spilt
 
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And he is saying Pakistan is integrating/connecting with China in every sense of the word. Erm WTF....no its not....not even close. A chinese person sticks out in Pakistan and vice versa...and on average they have very different culture/outlook/priorities etc, its the plain truth. Those have to be lot more similar for any actual integrating/connecting to happen at any appreciable intrinsic level.

I think it's a knee-jerk reaction to the mantra of the Indians such as the one in OP, who keep going on about how we are all monolithic blobs of "brown" folk, who need to gather together under the banner of India. I think both are nonsense.

Of course as neighbours we share many similarities, but there are differences as well. When you identify with a nation state, you align yourself with its interests. Any country that has similar interests to yours automatically becomes a natural ally.

However, I am not fan of those who say our future lies in A,B or C. I want to see a strong, prosperous and completely independent Pakistan, not reliant on any third party, and able to stand on its own feet.
 
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Yup every country must have this as the goal.

Went off on a tangent a bit earlier, but to get to your point about culture. I share no major cultural similarities with the Chinese, but some alliances are much deeper and meaningful. I wince every time someone says we are similar to this or that. People need to be more proud and assured of their identity and just say we are Pakistanis.
 
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Yup every country must have this as the goal.

Eventually every nation should be standing on its feet but shared goals isnt bad when you have certain foes in your hood

Went off on a tangent a bit earlier, but to get to your point about culture. I share no major cultural similarities with the Chinese, but some alliances are much deeper and meaningful. I wince every time someone says we are similar to this or that. People need to be more proud and assured of their identity and just say we are Pakistanis.

I argue the same I am big fan of the Sino-Pakistan and Turk-Pakistan Alliances but I cringe when Pakistanis be like we share the same thing with them the Chinese are Communists the Turks are Secular Nationalists but that does not mean I hate them they are better allies than cough cough our "Muslim" Brothers Afghanistan or Saudi Arabia
 
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Nations, Countries and Civilizations rise and fall all the time. I just find it amusing when people, especially some Indians and Afghans, bleat on about how Pakistan is a "fake" country.

Every country in the world is in a sense "fake". They're simply lines drawn on artificial borders, backed by a "state" that can enforce it. And more importantly, as long as there are people who believe themselves to be a part of this state, whether physically or in spirit, that state will exist.

The Indians who dream about this Akhand Bharat are oddly silent on Bangladesh's supposed reunification with India. If you truly believe everyone in the subcontinent to be "Indian", why didn't the Bangladeshis join up with you again in 71?



Even then, this argument doesn't make any sense. Sharing DNA, or skin colour with someone else doesn't mean you dissolve your own state and nation. Are all White people one giant blob of people without any differences amongst themselves? Call an Englishman the same as a Russian, and you will receive your answer.

What about the South American states? They have the same religion, language, culture and even same founding father. Why don't they follow the Indian logic on what constitutes a nation and join up together in one blob?


The vast majority of Pakistanis do not even share the same dna as modern day indians.

And he is saying Pakistan is integrating/connecting with China in every sense of the word. Erm WTF....no its not....not even close. A chinese person sticks out in Pakistan and vice versa...and on average they have very different culture/outlook/priorities etc, its the plain truth. Those have to be lot more similar for any actual integrating/connecting to happen at any appreciable intrinsic level.



That's irrelevant, in terms of what really matters, we ARE fully connecting and integrating with the Chinese; our econonomy; our defence and military; the development of our nation and our strategic goals are fully connected with that of China. THAT'S what matters. All else is meaningless conjecture.

As a Pakistani, I have NEVER EVER felt any connection to an indian, bengali or any other so called "South Asian". They are all as foreign to me as are White and Black people are.

I think it's a knee-jerk reaction to the mantra of the Indians such as the one in OP, who keep going on about how we are all monolithic blobs of "brown" folk, who need to gather together under the banner of India. I think both are nonsense.

Of course as neighbours we share many similarities, but there are differences as well. When you identify with a nation state, you align yourself with its interests. Any country that has similar interests to yours automatically becomes a natural ally.

However, I am not fan of those who say our future lies in A,B or C. I want to see a strong, prosperous and completely independent Pakistan, not reliant on any third party, and able to stand on its own feet.



We also share a border with Iran and Afghanistan. Also, a higher percentage of Pakistanis share a genetic connection to them than those that do with india. Doesn't make us Middle Eastern/Persian just as it doesn't make us indian.
 
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As a Pakistani, I have NEVER EVER felt any connection to an indian, bengali or any other so called "South Asian". They are all as foreign to me as are White and Black people are.

And you seem to think you can talk for all Pakistanis? Tell me how much bollywood gets watched in your country for starters.

The vast majority of Pakistanis do not even share the same dna as modern day indians.

So you are not human beings then? What is the variance % of DNA among the homo sapiens species to begin with? Start with every genetic marker known actually, how much of the total DNA chain are they (markers) % wise?...since you are talking about sharing DNA of "majorities".
 
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And you seem to think you can talk for all Pakistanis? Tell me how much bollywood gets watched in your country for starters.




Been to Pakistan over 30 times. Nothing compared to what it was on the 1990s. There are a lot of fans of american films in Pakistan too. Doesn't make us american or have any connection to them too.

And you seem to think you can talk for all Pakistanis? Tell me how much bollywood gets watched in your country for starters.



So you are not human beings then? What is the variance % of DNA among the homo sapiens species to begin with? Start with every genetic marker known actually, how much of the total DNA chain are they (markers) % wise?...since you are talking about sharing DNA of "majorities".



Small changes in dna, create different races.
 
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Pakistan’s future lies in Afghanistan, not India.

We share many similarities, and after the fall of Kabul government, it will be a honeymoon between the two of us.

India will just drag its feet like an unwanted guest.

For the sake of Pakistan, I hope that it doesn't happen.

If that happens, good luck to your people for their horrible future under a theocratic regime that will quell whatever few liberties distinguish you from them. Of course, there will be the consolation of dying on your feet, every day of your misery-filled lives.
 
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I think it's a knee-jerk reaction to the mantra of the Indians such as the one in OP, who keep going on about how we are all monolithic blobs of "brown" folk, who need to gather together under the banner of India. I think both are nonsense.

Of course as neighbours we share many similarities, but there are differences as well. When you identify with a nation state, you align yourself with its interests. Any country that has similar interests to yours automatically becomes a natural ally.

However, I am not fan of those who say our future lies in A,B or C. I want to see a strong, prosperous and completely independent Pakistan, not reliant on any third party, and able to stand on its own feet.

Quite so. Those who are suggesting that Pakistan needs to see its future with A, B or C are in no way different from the monolithic blobs (can a blob be a rock at the same time? I wish you had chosen a different adjective, @Sher Shah Awan) geo-strategists. It is just that they see things as a monocultural sea of, say, light cream-coloured blobs, or as naan-shaped blobs, or high-cheeked blobs. Nonsense is possibly the nicest word that can be used of these addle-headed theories and the theoreticians who promote them.

As far as the 'similar interests' argument goes, there can be pacts and agreements among wholly dissimilar blobs without getting hysterical about it. No need to standardise underwear sizes to achieve the kind of agreement that France and Germany have sought. That argument contradicts the various 'we look like green Martians more than we look like the Indians, so lets...' schools; cultural identity is important, economic interest is also important.

Eventually every nation should be standing on its feet but shared goals isnt bad when you have certain foes in your hood

I find myself getting into a short and peremptory mood reading tripe like this; my apologies in advance, but it is tripe.

Consider thinking the unthinkable. Why do you have foes in your hood? Might it, just possibly, maybe, perhaps, let's joke about these sacred wars for a bit, not be the undiluted fault of one side in the enmity?

I argue the same I am big fan of the Sino-Pakistan and Turk-Pakistan Alliances but I cringe when Pakistanis be like we share the same thing with them the Chinese are Communists the Turks are Secular Nationalists but that does not mean I hate them they are better allies than cough cough our "Muslim" Brothers Afghanistan or Saudi Arabia

<sigh!>

Once you have sorted out these very important differences, we can get down to the real issue at hand: how many angels can dance on the head of a pin.

Meanwhile, can we have an MFN agreement just to get along with? Yes, yes, money doesn't matter, we must all die on our feet, and so on. But just as an interim measure? To make things easier to swallow, we can sacrifice Katju - very reluctantly, for the common good of all - on the Feast of Abraham, since he shows such willingness to embrace others who do not wish to be embraced.
 
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I only gave names which most people are familiar. I can give 1000 names or more, but no use wasting my time as you will come with one excuse after other, looking at your reply & posts. Easiest is you give your credible list to back your claims & with credible proof. Can you. I can see you are member here from 2013. How many Tamils have you found here who buy your crap.

so what there are/were traitors in every race, even India had its share during the British and Mughal rule,how many Hindus/Sikhs served in the British army ?

Tamils need a saviour and India will be history

Try abolishing the draconian AFSPA and the constitution which forbids secession, see how Tamils will want to be free from Indian occupation.


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protest-jallikattu.jpg


This was about Tamil asking separate land. You want to try deviating this into some brownie point winning match. what's your post got to do with what you claimed. Nityanada is a Tamil. His personal life or activity is not the debate.

My point , your list , almost 10 % are Americans not Indians e.g Sundar Pichai, how long can they retain their 3rd world Indianness in a 1st world western country ?

6 Interesting Facts About Bobby Jindal's Christian Faith

FT_15.06.24_jindal.jpg

Bobby Jindal leads guests in prayer

2. Jindal, who was raised Hindu, is now Roman Catholic.

Before changing his name to "Bobby," after the popular Brady Bunch character, Jindal was born Piyush Jindal, which is still his legal name. He was raised in a Hindu household. He has said on several occasions that he best identifies as an "evangelical Catholic" and says he "felt as if the Bible had been written especially for me."

https://www.christianpost.com/news/6-interesting-facts-about-bobby-jindals-christian-faith.html

Why did you include the "Indians" Americans including con godman Nityananda ? These hypocrites having lost their roots /culture, enjoying comfortable lives in multicultural democracies , will promote rabid majoritarian Hindutva (Hindi-Hindu) politics in online forums.

Indians are the fastest-growing illegal immigrant population in the US

https://qz.com/india/789754/indians-are-the-fastest-growing-illegal-immigrant-population-in-the-us/

When you post nonsense give proof or make sure your facts are right.

Vasco da Gama, was the first European to reach India by sea. His voyage to India was around 1500 (1497–1499) was the first to link Europe and Asia by an ocean route, the first to connect West with the Indian Sub-continent.

The British rule was around 1757 - 1947 on the sub-continent. Do your homework properly & come back, or I can provide proof for your stupidity. British rule was not even 200 years.

dont teach me your history, the 700 vs 70 analogy also includes Bharat mata under Mughal rule.

Vasco da Gama ? your are confusing Indian history with Tamil history. Tamils had diplomatic, cultural links with China-Far East, SE Asia, Middle East - Romans , Greeks and Arabs before they had any contact with Aryan Hindis. Ignoramus, I bet they dont teach Tamil history in Indian schools !!!!

Ancient Romans Connection with Tamilnadu


https://docs.google.com/document/d/1EnoLAy1bKEITHsrWkSBMsJZEQL9nx32drsNUZ_7r5Bk/edit#

Did Justice Katju mention about Tamilnadu & he's mentioning about uniting not breaking. Total contradiction on your claim & argument on quoting Katju.

Waste of time to debate with you. Come with facts or nobody will bother for your posts. You can use your time for something fruitful instead. You can get some claps from Pakistan, but even they won't be amused with your posts & not bother to your posts. Wake up from your illusion.

Deluded Indian, you need wake up from the Indian illusion. A reminder - Tamilnadu and other states currently under Indian occupation were handed over to Hindi by the British on a golden platter.

I used Katju criteria for re-unification of India and Pakistan, to show how Tamilandu is odds with India. Thats is -Tamilnadu doesnt have a shared history (Mughal rule), culture (language, dress, food, religion) or race (Dravidian vs Aryan) with India. If you cant digest the truth thats your problem.
 
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