Ilyushin 400, offers a cost effective Option for PIA

[airmarshal]

PS not to mention it has 4 engines , unlike the two engine planes if one of the engines goes out , better say your prayers.

That is totally wrong. 777 has most reliable engines ever. There has never been report of engine failure. Plus, 777 is unique in the sense that it can fly long haul on a single engine with full load in case of malfunction.

 

[mr42O]

My only concern is safety .

I wonder why cheap airliner in EU as Ryanair , Norwegian etc don't buy these airplanes ?

 

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

Well , Russian products have been used by its allies

Cuba , Syria , All Eastern European countries and many open minded European states
Russian airlines is also using the plane "Aeroflot" and there are also Freight companies using he plane for mail and shipping cargo , plane flies and lands regularly in France , Greece, Eastern European countries , UAE etc

From cost perspective its really a very easy solution for "Permenent Fix" to PIA nagging for planes

0 Aviation losses vs 8 accidents for Boeing 777 ER class planes


> Ilyushin plane has 400+ seater capacity with all economy configuration , its described on their information page.

I am not going to repeat the calculations I made , its well explained


60 planes make more money , then 7 Boeing even with the fuel usage in factor

• The fuel calculations , and profits for plane was covered in detail including real cost of fuel in international market vs distance traveled

Note: If PIA was buying 7 Ilyushin , you can argue , yes Boeing 777 ER 7 units would save more money as they have better fuel saving however for "SAME" amount of cash
gets you only 7 Boeing vs 60 Ilyushin-96 planes

My argument is ... for 2.8 Billion what PIA put in 7 Planes could have bought them 60 planes from Russia, and no more crying over planes or asking for bail outs

Russian planes make you 598 Million in year , vs 1.4 Million only by 7 Boeing 777

Refer to this document to view 435 passenger capacity of the 400 class Ilyushin
Ilyushin Il-96 commercial aircraft. Pictures, specifications, reviews.

Cabin Data Ilyushin-96(300)-------------Ilyushin-96(400)
Passengers (1-class) 300-------------------------------------435 (Economy Configuration)
Passengers (3-class) 235--------------------------------------315


Configuration Economy for PIA Boeing 777 ER is 440, a marginal 5 more seats irrelevant, same as the marginal fuel economy , which is non factor since we only have 7 boeing 777

$2.8 billion Dollars of Pakistani People , but just 7 planes (52 Million profit yearly) or 60 planes (572-598 Million profit yearly) (Calculations already provided on page 2)

Someone must have really got a big kick back for deal like this

PUTIN USES IT !!! How about that for credibility

Enough said

 

[razgriz19]

PS not to mention it has 4 engines , unlike the two engine planes if one of the engines goes out , better say your prayers.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but every two engine airliner can fly on one engine for a very long time.

And so what if the Russian President flies in it, US president also flies in 747-200, but you don't see those around anymore. Even PIA scrapped their 200s.
Maintenance for Presidential aircraft is much more costly than for a passenger airliner.

And I don't think you know much about aviation ( im no expert either), but maintenance is very VERY costly and difficult for the airplanes that are not common. I know this because this is my field.
We have a bunch of 727s in Canada. one of them was grounded due to damage on its pressure bulkhead, The airline contacted boeing for repair drawing, but Boeing told them everyone who worked on this jet are either retired or dead and they don't really know how to fix so they're working on it. That aircraft has been sitting on tarmac for over 3 months. And just for the record, airlines loose about $100 thousand a DAY on an average medium size airliner, if its not flying.

Now I'm not saying that this Russian aircraft is old, but what i'm saying is if this thing is grounded, and sometimes parts take weeks to arrive, you can guess how much money PIA would loose.

There is so much more to choosing the right plane than just looking at the price tag.

 

[janu.bravo]

it's really weird that you are comparing 777 with Ilyushin 400...you can say that yes you can buy 6 aircraft from the money which we spent on 1 777, but in commercial aviation you don't go for cheap planes you have to choose reliable plane as i don't see any other reliable and safe plane other thn 777...777 got history of 8 accidents out of which only 1 was total crushed which killed two persons; and 8 accidents includes 3 hijacking. plus Russian things are are not that reliable you also knows that even there aeroflot uses 777.

 

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

Well Boeing no doubt is great company like Airbus , that is not debatable.If we had the Money to burn hey get A380 Airbus

The argument was /is , that for 2.8 Billion Dollars , we could have purchased Ilyushin-96 , 400 class plane which is comparable to Boeing 777 ER class Boeing and comes with 25 year life cycle.

60 Planes , same comfort level , and almost same number of seats may be 3-4 less seats. Minor fuel advantage which is no factor when you have only 7 Boeing.

Now if we were comparing 60 Ilyushin-96 with 60 Boeing I would say yes , fuel economy saves money.

At present as proven by calculations , 60 Ilyushin was enough for country like Pakistan

a) Brand new 60 planes with 25 years life cycle
b) Approved plane by International Aviation Association and European Aviation.
c) Makes you $572-590 Million yearly (Fictional destination with $500 ticket calculations done before with fuel rate in thread)


The Problem:

The Boeing 777 , while fancy makes you mere 52 Million and PIA keeps crying they have no planes so employees take it easy and take long vacations

> PIA due to this bad decision now do leasing wet lease with kick back
> PIA cry they don't have to pay taxes because they have no planes
> Many employees drink tea and biscuit as they don't have planes to work on or off


People have ridiculed Ilyushin-96 platform just because its Russian plane ? Why

a) The plane is used by 6-9 International Airlines
b) The plane is used by Freight companies
c) Russian president flies in the plane
d) The plane came only 3 years before Boeing 777 ER class.
e) The Plane has "International Standard Avionics & Engines"
f) Modern Interior




Caculation of Fuel Cost / Profits on Fictional Route
Total Distance on Fictional Route Karachi - Boston - 11397.37 km

Fuel Rate:
fuel burn: 11.18 l/km (Russian Ilyusin 96)
fuel burn: 10.34l/km (Boeing 777 ER)

Fuel Consumption Rate per gallon in 1 Trip :
Russian plane: 1,27,442 liters ---- >33666.6147 Gallons (US unit)
Boring 777 ER : 1,17,860 liters ---->31135.3181 Gallons (US unit)

Jet fuel price Per gallon $2.92/Gallon in USA (Real Price)
Reference: Jet Fuel - Daily Price - Commodity Prices - Price Charts, Data, and News - IndexMundi (Real cost)


Cost of Fuel for 1 Russian Plane / per trip = $9,803 Dollars
Cost of Fuel for 1 Boeing 777 plane/ trip = $9,217 Dollars (Real Figures)

PROFITS ANALYSIS:
RUSSIAN PLANES
60 Russian Planes operating on this route would make you Money = 12,000,000. (12 Million) (Assume $500 fictional ticket)

Cost of Fuel for 60 plane = $588,180

Total Money Russian Planes could have made for PIA = $12,000,000 - $588,180 = $11,411,820 (11.5 Millions profits 1 Trip 60 planes per trip)


BOEING 777 ER (So called Fuel Efficient Plane Purchase)

7 planes make you profit = 1.4 Million Dollars (Note assume a $500 fictional price ticket)
Cost of Fuel for 7 planes = $64,519 Dollars (1 trip )

Total Profits = 1.4 Million- $63,518= 1.33 Million Profit only


Yearly Projection of Profits 1 Year:

52 Weeks in Year [Assumption each plane makes exactly 1 Trip in week]

60 Russian Planes in PIA fleet would earn you = 11.5 MILLION x 52 = $598,000,000 USD
7 Fuel Efficient Boeing 777 ER fleet would earn you = 1.4 MILLION x 52 = $52,000,000 USD

Some money 2.8 Billion with which PIA bought Boeing 777 ER could have got
60 Russian Planes $598 Million Profits vs 7 Boeing 777 $52 Million Profit
(Note : Fuel usage for year for 60 Russian planes would be $588,180 x 52 = 29 approx Million dollars which will have to be deducted from the total $598 Million but still $569 Million Dollar Profit. Now if PIA bought 60 Boeing 777 planes yes they would save on fuel but clearly just owning 7 planes is a loss deal vs 60 planes )

Picture is thousand word , on dependability of plane and prestige , and for Pakistan with tight budget , 60 planes could be life saver for PIA

Yes that is , Ilyushin-96, 300 class plane on official visit to Saudi Arabia

60 Russian vs 7 Boeing for a cash stripped company like PIA really makes you wonder

Ilyushin-96 (400 Class)
60 Planes, 598 Million Profits & all brand new fleet , Approval Rating High by customers

Boeing 777 (MERE 7 planes , end result shortage of planes for PIA)

 

[Darth Vader]

My only concern is safety .

I wonder why cheap airliner in EU as Ryanair , Norwegian etc don't buy these airplanes ?

Norwegian is a Cheap airline ? Since when