HAL Tejas | Updates, News & Discussions

[MastanKhan]

Keyeser and Titanium,

As a nationalistic pakistani, I am greatly concerned at the new threat I am seeing, coming from across the border in the form of LCA. This deadly aircraft would forever change the way IAF operates and the way PAF reacts. I ,mean to say that PAF will have to come with a different combat strategy and game plan to encounter this war bird---PAF pilots will have to be retrained and reprogrammed to face the menace of the LCA. Pakistani millitary radar operators will be re-schooled in the art of tracking this incoming monster----the awacs operators---the moment they saw the LCA coming, they will open the escape hatch, jump out of the awac and leave the pilot and co pilot at the mercy of come what may. Some of these operators may have been so scared that they may have forgotten to harness their parachutes on their backs. The fear of this flying menace would get the better of their judgement on that fatal entounter. Push came to shove, even I would like to put my head between my knees and try to kiss my ar-se goodbye. So long.

 

[Malang]

Keyser that was a 4months old news!!
anyways

Tejas: ADA looks to Boeing to provide help

BANGALORE: The Aeronautical Development Agency (ADA), the defence laboratory behind the Tejas Light Combat Aircraft (LCA), could soon be turning to global aerospace major Boeing to help them with the aircraft’s flight testing programme.

Officials from Boeing met with designers from the ADA on Saturday for what could be the final round of discussions on aspects and scope of the consultancy, and on contractual negotiations.

It is hoped that the consultancy from Boeing will help expedite the number of sorties that are to be flown in each phase of flight testing as the ADA attempts to obtain initial operational clearance (IOC) for the Tejas. ADA’s latest revised schedule speaks of a 2010 deadline for IOC. Boeing, which has the requisite experience on flight test programmes like their F-18 Hornet, will provide the ADA with inputs on points in the flying envelope that flight tests will have to be conducted. This will avoid unnecessary flights, saving on both costs, and even more importantly, time, enabling the ADA to compress the LCA’s flight test programme. ADA had selected Boeing after finding that the American firm’s technical proposals were the most suitable in the global tender that was sent out two years ago. Lockheed Martin and the European consortium of EADS could be called for talks if those with Boeing fail.
The Hindu : National : Tejas: ADA looks to Boeing to provide help

 

[Keysersoze]

Keyser that was a 4months old news!!
anyways

Tejas: ADA looks to Boeing to provide help

BANGALORE: The Aeronautical Development Agency (ADA), the defence laboratory behind the Tejas Light Combat Aircraft (LCA), could soon be turning to global aerospace major Boeing to help them with the aircraft’s flight testing programme.

Officials from Boeing met with designers from the ADA on Saturday for what could be the final round of discussions on aspects and scope of the consultancy, and on contractual negotiations.

It is hoped that the consultancy from Boeing will help expedite the number of sorties that are to be flown in each phase of flight testing as the ADA attempts to obtain initial operational clearance (IOC) for the Tejas. ADA’s latest revised schedule speaks of a 2010 deadline for IOC. Boeing, which has the requisite experience on flight test programmes like their F-18 Hornet, will provide the ADA with inputs on points in the flying envelope that flight tests will have to be conducted. This will avoid unnecessary flights, saving on both costs, and even more importantly, time, enabling the ADA to compress the LCA’s flight test programme. ADA had selected Boeing after finding that the American firm’s technical proposals were the most suitable in the global tender that was sent out two years ago. Lockheed Martin and the European consortium of EADS could be called for talks if those with Boeing fail.
The Hindu : National : Tejas: ADA looks to Boeing to provide help

Malang I was merely posting a relevant article. It is interesting that only 4 months ago that this was even a issue. I mean this program has been around for a while and has been boasted about about quite a bit in certain quarters.

 

[Keysersoze]

Giving a detailed reply on the status of the Light Combat Aircraft being jointly developed by the DRDO and HAL, Shri Antony said major breakthroughs in the project have been achieved in recent times and he is confident that "it will be in the sky within a few years."

He said the Indian Air Force, which was not willing to accept even one of this aircraft earlier, has now decided to receive two squadrons, indicating their confidence in the aircraft. The Defence Minister admitted that there are still problems with the high-powered Kaveri engine and negotiations are on for a suitable partnership.

Ok I cannot find the whole original article so you will have to bear with me for a bit., but he highlighted blue section is interesting. The fact that at this late stage statements like the above ares till being made (albeit 4 months old, which is not too out of date considering the length of the program) And that the IAF is "willing to accept" ~28 planes does not fill me with confidence. And Also it is the first round of discussions with Boeing it does not mean it has reached fruition.

 

[Titanium]

Giving a detailed reply on the status of the Light Combat Aircraft being jointly developed by the DRDO and HAL, Shri Antony said major breakthroughs in the project have been achieved in recent times and he is confident that "it will be in the sky within a few years."

He said the Indian Air Force, which was not willing to accept even one of this aircraft earlier, has now decided to receive two squadrons, indicating their confidence in the aircraft. The Defence Minister admitted that there are still problems with the high-powered Kaveri engine and negotiations are on for a suitable partnership.

Ok I cannot find the whole original article so you will have to bear with me for a bit., but he highlighted blue section is interesting. The fact that at this late stage statements like the above ares till being made (albeit 4 months old, which is not too out of date considering the length of the program) And that the IAF is "willing to accept" ~28 planes does not fill me with confidence. And Also it is the first round of discussions with Boeing it does not mean it has reached fruition.

What is this world coming to,, Key, you are taking over my role here??? How can you do this to me.

This is not like you...........anyway

 

[Goodperson]

Giving a detailed reply on the status of the Light Combat Aircraft being jointly developed by the DRDO and HAL, Shri Antony said major breakthroughs in the project have been achieved in recent times and he is confident that "it will be in the sky within a few years."

He said the Indian Air Force, which was not willing to accept even one of this aircraft earlier, has now decided to receive two squadrons, indicating their confidence in the aircraft. The Defence Minister admitted that there are still problems with the high-powered Kaveri engine and negotiations are on for a suitable partnership.

Ok I cannot find the whole original article so you will have to bear with me for a bit., but he highlighted blue section is interesting. The fact that at this late stage statements like the above ares till being made (albeit 4 months old, which is not too out of date considering the length of the program) And that the IAF is "willing to accept" ~28 planes does not fill me with confidence. And Also it is the first round of discussions with Boeing it does not mean it has reached fruition.

IAF changed its specifications add to that some mismanagement at DRDO, Initial orders even if few are encouraging. Everyone knows it will be ten times than that. But need to wait couple of years more I guess.

 

[Titanium]

More data sought on military aircraft

Bangalore, DHNS:



Former Aeronautical Development Agency (ADA), Director Air Marshal (Retd) P Rajkumar on Saturday said that the Centre for Military Airworthiness and Certification (CEMILAC) should insist from the developmental agencies to provide more data on the performance and other parameters of the military aircraft, during the developmental stages.

Delivering the keynote address on ‘Flight Test Challenges’ at a seminar on Aerospace Technologies, he said that the CEMILAC, which is a government agency that certifies all military aircraft and systems should insist on data collection. “ During the indigenous Light Combat Aircraft (LCA) programme there were several problems in instrumentation, measuring the aero dynamic loads on the airframe and in the conversion of data from analog to digital format,” said Air Marshal (Retd) P Rajkumar, who was heading the LCA project when the aircraft took its first flight.

He said that even after eight years the LCA’s first flight test, the air intake efficiency was not measured and that the CEMILAC should insist on it.

Failure
He also said that another area where he failed was in reducing the weight of the LCA, as the Indian Air Force (IAF) wanted the airframes to be light. However, there was not much success in this regard.







The former ADA Director also stressed the need for good human resource policies in the various defence agencies, which is involved in the designing, development and certification inorder to ensure that the crucial defence projects are not delayed.

When did this Light aircraft became heavy one.

 

[Titanium]

More from DODO Land...........
KOCHI: The Indian Air Force has a serious problem with the lightness of the Light Combat Aircraft (LCA), the country’s flagship indigenous aviation programme.

A list of issues has recently been raised by the IAF about the project, already flying through a bad patch of technological factors and time and cost overruns.

Engine-related issues continue to plague the project and the Air Force is not happy with the thrust values generated by the new GE404 engine powering the aircraft.

In fact, one factor that threw the project out of gear was the delay in developing the Kaveri engines.With no option in sight, HAL decided to go ahead with the developmental trials with the GE 404 till an indigenous engine was ready.

The IAF experts now say that the thrust generated by the GE404 is not adequate for all the manoeuvres expected of the LCA,which will be replacing the ageing MiG 21 fleet.

“It’s no longer light. The aircraft was supposed to weigh only 8,000 kg after all the changes effected on it. But today it has put on another 2,000 kg and weighs 10,000 kg. And it is but natural that the engine is unable to support it to the maximum,” IAF sources told this website’s newspaper.

This leaves HAL in a dilemma. The builder now has to either subject the aircraft to some design planning with a view to reducing the drag or reduce the weight of the aircraft.

“There is hardly any flab on its body. We will take a look at the design to reduce drag,” sources said. But that is easier said than done.

HAL will have to go in for a design consultancy(Foreign consultancy for indigenous?) to fine-tune an already tested aircraft, which will further delay the full-fledged commissioning of the project.

“Another solution, and probably the best, will be to use a new engine with better thrust levels. The new engine can be selected with the weight-thrust ratio in mind. This will take care of all manoeuvres expected of the aircraft even if its weight were to go up slightly again,” sources said.

The IAF and HAL have formed a committee to look into the issues, including the selection of a new engine. A high-level meeting is scheduled this month end to finalise the action plan.

“But HAL will build 20 LCA-Tejas aircraft for the IAF as planned. This squadron will be inducted and the base is getting ready at Sulur in Tamil Nadu,” sources said.

 

[Flintlock]

India’s light combat aircraft Tejas will fly over the deserts of Rajasthan later this month for hot weather trials



Bangalore: India’s light combat aircraft Tejas will fly over the deserts of Rajasthan later this month for hot weather trials.
The trials, in which the airplane and its systems will be tested in the summer heat, begin a crucial phase for the fighter before the Indian Air Force (IAF) inducts it into its fleet. “Because we are doing it for the first time, we are very very careful,” says P. S. Subramanyam, head of the Tejas programme at Aeronautical Development Agency (ADA) the aircraft development arm of the Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO).
The designers of Tejas have till 2010—four years behind schedule—to achieve initial operational clearance, a milestone it has to cross before meeting IAF standards. These two years will be the toughest because the aircraft will be stretched to the limits of its performance, and any mistake could endanger the project.
ADA has appointed Boeing Co., which makes the F-18 fighter, as a consultant to help in flight trials till the certification.
When compared with the US or Russia, India’s fighter development programme is still taking baby steps despite its air force being a large buyer of military aircraft.
IAF is buying 126 fighters in a global tender valued at more than Rs42,000 crore to replace the ageing Russian-built MiG fighters in its fleet.


The Tejas project is India’s second fighter development programme. In the 1960s, the country tried to build a fighter aircraft—the HF-24 Marut—that failed to take off after failing to meet the air force’s expectations.
Tejas was conceived in the 1980s. It is a single-engine supersonic, fly-by-wire fighter that has delta wings and no tail. Fly-by-wire technology enables a pilot to control the plane electronically through computers.
Although the project officially kicked off in 1989, ADA says the inital fund of Rs2,188 crore to develop technology demonstrators arrived only in 1993. After its first flight in January 2001, the govermnent sanctioned an additional Rs3301.78 crore to build five prototype aircraft, including trainers, and equip them with weapons. These were scheduled to enter service by 2006.
The Tejas fleet of six aircraft, including two technology demonstrators, powered by US-made General Electric 404 engines, have flown 865 sorties so far.
In 2006, IAF ordered 20 Tejas aircraft to be manufactured by Hindustan Aeronautics Ltd, or HAL, in addition to 8 limited series production planes.
The Tejas project did not meet its deadline, prompting IAF to appoint Air Vice Marshal B.C. Nanjappa to hasten its development and draw a plan for delivery.
IAF’s suggestions included design expectations that are yet to be proved in simulation or wind tunnel tests. Nanjappa declined to comment on the matter.
“That is why (we ) should be careful, because it could lead to unrecoverable situations if it (the aircraft) is not controlled properly,” says T. Tamilmani, chief executive of Centre for Military Airworthiness and Certification, an independent regulating agency under the DRDO.
There have been several instances of mishap in aircraft development globally. In India, a prototype airborne early warning and control system developed by the Centre for Airborne Systems, a Bangalore lab of DRDO, crashed in 1999.
Tamilmani says he does not see a challenge in certifiying the Tejas for safety standards. “The challenge is in complying with the air staff requirements set by the IAF.”
Air Marshal (retd) P. Rajkumar, a former head of the fighter project, says he can understand why DRDO has been careful in pushing the limits of the aircraft. “I would rather have an aircraft that meets all safety requirements a few years late, than an unreliable one tomorrow.” Rajkumar has written a book—The Tejas Story—on the light combat aircraft programme.
Analysts say going slow due to a learning curve is only to be expected, but the delays in getting the radar, weaponisation and finally, a homegrown Kaveri engine for the fighter, are worrying signs.
“It is not just being cautious. They also have to reach the technical specifications within the time frame,” says A.K. Saxena, a former managing director of HAL, the manufacturer of Tejas. “That is not happening”.

Tejas set for hot weather trials over Rajasthan deserts - livemint

 

[Flintlock]

BANGALORE: A nine-member delegation from Eurojet Turbo, leading European military aero-engine consortium, on Wednesday concluded a three-day “workshop” for the Aeronautical Development Agency (ADA), on the feasibility of their engine being used to power the underpowered Tejas Light Combat Aircraft (LCA).

The workshop could be a precursor to the ADA — designers of the LCA — deciding on a new engine for the Tejas.

Eurojet, which is responsible for development, production, support, maintenance and sales of the new generation EJ200 engine, explained to officials from the ADA and the Air Force and Navy’s LCA project teams, how its engine could be adapted for the Tejas.

The workshop comes in the wake of an Air Force communication to the Ministry of Defence that the Tejas, with its present engine — the General Electric manufactured GE F404 IN20 — cannot meet air staff requirements. The Air Force’s reasons that the thrust (with afterburner) generated by the GE F404 IN20 — 85 kilo Newtons (kN) — is adequate for an aircraft of eight tonnes, but with the Tejas being overweight by nearly two tonnes it requires a much more powerful engine. The Air Force wants an engine that is capable of delivering a thrust of 100 kN.

Eurojet, which had made available sophisticated data on the EJ200 to the ADA, has offered to transfer all technology — including the key core technology — on the engine to India. The engine will eventually be manufactured in India. It also claims that the EJ200 meets the Tejas’ technical requirements and very little modifications will be needed to house its engine. Though Eurojet is confident that its engine will be chosen by the ADA, it will have to beat the challenge from GE, which had made a preliminary presentation on the GE414.

Sources in the ADA said that while the EJ200, with a thrust of 90 kN, brings in the latest technology in combat aircraft engines and is lighter and smaller, the heavier GE414 is capable of producing more thrust (97.5 kN). But Eurojet officials said the EJ200, which is the only five-stage compression engine in the world today, has the potential to meet the Air Force’s requirement of 100 kN.

The workshop was also an indication that the ADA, after months of hedging, has accepted the Air Force’s contention that the Tejas in its present configuration is unacceptable.

The Hindu : National : Eurojet Turbo pitches for its engine for Tejas

 

[ejaz007]

Stealth Assasin,
According to the article you have posted HF-24 Marut has been declared a failure. If it was failure than why IAF inducted the plane in considerable numbers and it even saw combat action in 1971 war.
Can some one elaborate what is meant by failure of HF-24 Marut. Performance shortcomings is one thing but failure an alltogether different thing.

 

[Flintlock]

Stealth Assasin,
According to the article you have posted HF-24 Marut has been declared a failure. If it was failure than why IAF inducted the plane in considerable numbers and it even saw combat action in 1971 war.
Can some one elaborate what is meant by failure of HF-24 Marut. Performance shortcomings is one thing but failure an alltogether different thing.

Marut was a failure...it was never inducted in significant numbers....those that were inducted were more a face-saving measure than anything else.

IAF made up its numbers by buying Soviet aircraft.

On the other hand, it was the first attempt by HAL , so it kicked off the Aircraft industry in India.

 

[ejaz007]

This is surprising for me. I guess this fighter would be world's first failure that even saw combat action. I shall try to post the number of Maruts inducted in IAF but the numbers surely were in squadron strength perhaps if my memory serves me right 4 squadrons were inducted.
The major fault with Marut was that it was under powered and hence slow. In my view it was better attempt than even LCA considering that we are talking about 60's era.

 

[Flintlock]

This is surprising for me. I guess this fighter would be world's first failure that even saw combat action. I shall try to post the number of Maruts inducted in IAF but the numbers surely were in squadron strength perhaps if my memory serves me right 4 squadrons were inducted.
The major fault with Marut was that it was under powered and hence slow. In my view it was better attempt than even LCA considering that we are talking about 60's era.

Yeah, it was underpowered so it couldn't reach sufficient airspeed.

The fighters were airworthy, but they couldn't match up with American or Soviet ones.

 

[Sam Dhanraj]

Tejas' hot weather trial successful ​

NAGPUR: The much-awaited hot weather trial phase of prestigious Tejas Light Combat Aircraft (LCA) programme went off successful between Bangalore and Nagpur, defence sources said on Friday.

The progarmme got underway yesterday with a flawless ferry flight of prototype vehicle-3(PV-3) and this was the first operation ferry flight of Tejas with external drop tanks which are intended to enhance the range/radius of action of aircraft, a defence release said.

In the event, the fuel system functioned perfectly, paving the way for more such long range ferry flight and out station trials. The LCA was ferried from Bangalore to Nagpur in about an hour's flying time and reached the destination with more than adequate fuel.

Over the next one week, the aircraft would be subjected to hot soaks on the ground followed by representative flight profiles at low and medium attitudes to check proper functioning of all on board systems under conditions of extreme heat which prevails in Nagpur.

The successful completion of these trials would thus mark a significant step towards attainment of all important initials operational clearance (IOC) and subsequent induction into the squadron service with the Indian Air Force, the release added.

Tejas' hot weather trial successful-India-The Times of India