HAL Tejas | Updates, News & Discussions

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[sudhir007]

IAF set to induct 6 LCA squadrons | idrw.org

First two Tejas aircraft will be stationed in TN
Giving a big thrust to the indigenous fighter jet programme, Indian Air Force (IAF) has decided to induct six squadrons of Tejas light combat aircraft over the next 10 years, which will allow the IAF to pack more punch in its aerial strikes.

“IAF plans to induct six LCA squadrons by the end of the 13th Plan,” minister of state for defence M M Pallam Raju said in the Rajya Sabha on Wednesday.

The development phase for LCA (light combat force) began in 1983 and the first technology demonstrator flew in 2001. Four years later, IAF placed the first order of 20 Tejas at a cost of Rs 2,700 crore. Subsequently, it placed order for another squadron.

The first two squadrons – 40 aircraft – of LCA, are first generation Mark-I version. The additional four squadrons would be Tejas Mark-II aircraft with a higher powered engine.

Raju indicated that money would not come in the way of LCA development. The Centre sanctioned Rs 11,845.2 crore to Aeronautical development Agency (ADA) till date while the total expenditure incurred so far is Rs 5,051.46 crore, he said.

Only last week, the penultimate developmental aircraft Tejas limited series production – 7 (LSP-7) successfully undertook its maiden flight from HAL airport. The LSP-7 aircraft, along with LSP- 8 will be offered to the IAF for user evaluation trials.

The LSP-7 flight is also the first time that a LCA maiden flight was not accompanied by the customary chase aircraft, which is an indicator to the level of confidence defence scientists and IAF have in the machine, defence research and development organisation stated. IAF plans to station the first two LCA squadron at Sulur near Coimbatore and Kayathir near Tuticorin.

 

[sudhir007]

Development of Tejas LCA | idrw.org

The Initial Operational Clearance-1 (IOC-1) for the Tejas Light Combat Aircraft has been achieve on 10th January, 2011. Presently, LCA development activities leading to final operational clearance are in progress. Action for induction of Tejas into IAF has been initiated. IAF has placed orders for 40 aircraft on HAL.

Tejas Mark-I is planned at present for 40 aircraft only. Tejas Mark-II aircraft is under development with an alternate higher powered engine with considerable improvements. Final cost assessment will be available only after the development phase of Mark II is completed. Scope for cost reduction of Tejas Mk-I has been examined and the same is assessed as not feasible in view of limited quantities.

Aeronautical Development Agency (ADA) is the nodal organization for the development of Tejas.

Rs.11845.20 Crores have been sanctioned by the government of India to ADA for the development of Tejas till date and the total expenditure incurred so far is Rs.5051.46 Crores.

IAF plans to induct six LCA squadrons by the end of the 13th Plan.

This information was given by Minister of State for Defence Shri MM PallamRajuin a written reply to Shri Tarun Vijay in Rajya Sabha today.

 

[Black Widow]

I don't have a problem with it, I am even for more co-developments or JVs and I am known as a LCA hater, because I said it would have been better to co-develop it's radar and engine from the start.
But the fact is, LCA as a project and by design is an Indian development, we only made big mistakes in the planning of the development and were blinded by our pride. Otherwise it is a good 4th gen fighter, with enough future potential to be our low end for the next 2 or 3 decades.

No you are known as biggest LCA troll.... Just kidding.

I agree with you, Indian govt must have shown some foresight in LCA program. As you already mentioned, the indigenous engine was suicidal idea. When in world, country test there prototypes with proven engine, Indian thinkers tried to do it with new engine.

Any way its late, but not end of the world. I am hopeful that LCA will prove its worth (as a point defense fighter).

 

[Black Widow]

Can you provide me a link to verify the bolded part?
AFAIK, Dassault was approached for help with FBW, but the deal did not go through!
That french helped in LCA design is one of the biggest myths; I feel!

I don't have data now, when come I will present it to you.
@karan : There is no problem, technical assistance is part of any development.


@ganimi kawa : do you know CEMILAC (certification agency for airworthiness) has rejected to give certificate for LCA NP1? So the HAL is going to take some assistance from Dassault to rectify the landing gear issue. (I read it in some blog), hope senior members know it.

 

[rockstarIN]

No you are known as biggest LCA troll.... Just kidding.

I agree with you, Indian govt must have shown some foresight in LCA program. As you already mentioned, the indigenous engine was suicidal idea. When in world, country test there prototypes with proven engine, Indian thinkers tried to do it with new engine.

Any way its late, but not end of the world. I am hopeful that LCA will prove its worth (as a point defense fighter).

It was not foolish to go for a new engine as y'day or today or even tomorrow we will have to go for it. Engine tech is very crucial. But there should have been a provision that if any of the related development fails/or take time...there are alternatives to fill the gap.

 

[sms]

It was not foolish to go for a new engine as y'day or today or even tomorrow we will have to go for it. Engine tech is very crucial. But there should have been a provision that if any of the related development fails/or take time...there are alternatives to fill the gap.

No there was problem on project management and project plan itself. They planned to qualify a fighter plane along with unqualified engine. That has added too many variable for the project and it was a recipe for failure.

They should have planned to qualify the Tejas with proven engine followed by Kaveri induction once LCA has rectified most of design flaws so that they had to work only on engine/ airframe integration issue ONLY.

 

[Black Widow]

It was not foolish to go for a new engine as y'day or today or even tomorrow we will have to go for it. Engine tech is very crucial. But there should have been a provision that if any of the related development fails/or take time...there are alternatives to fill the gap.

I don know what you are saying? Not able to understand ur post.

 

[rockstarIN]

Im talking about the Kaveri engine for LCA

 

[Black Widow]

Im talking about the Kaveri engine for LCA

What i got from your previous post that, "It was not a bad move to go for Kaveri engine, coz at some point of time we need Indian engine", Assuming I have read it correctly, I partially Agree and partially disagree with your comment.

The Idea to have Indian engine, radar is undoubtedly holy. But practicality should be kept in mind. Lets go little back..

Why Kaveri needed.

the Marut,HAL completed design studies in 1975, but the project fell through due to inability to procure the selected "proven engine" from a foreign manufacturer and the IAF's requirement for an air superiority fighter with secondary air support and interdiction capability remained unfulfilled.

Why LCA was needed:

n 1983 IAF realized the need of an indigenous combat aircraft for two primary purposes. The principal and most obvious goal was the development of a replacement aircraft for India's ageing MiG-21 fighters. The MiG-21 has been the mainstay of the Indian Air Force since the 1970s. The "Long Term Re-Equipment Plan 1981" noted that the MiG-21s would be approaching the end of their service lives by the mid-1990s, and that by 1995 the IAF would lack 40% of the aircraft needed to fill its projected force structure requirements.


What was done:
The Indian government's "self-reliance" goals for the LCA include indigenous development of the three most sophisticated — and hence most challenging — systems: the fly-by-wire (FBW) flight control system (FCS), multi-mode pulse-doppler radar, and afterburning turbofan engine.

What would have been done :
1. primary focus on FBW, FCS and air frame design.
2. First prototypes would have been run on Foreign engine (AL31, GE, tumansky or Honeywell)
These two step would have guaranteed replacement of ageing MiG21. The Kavery and MMR radar project would have been separate project, which would have been added to LCA after/before induction .

 

[rockstarIN]

Anyways we ran our first engines with foreign GE only. Although had I love having AL31 high thrust engine for LCA even though it is Russian.

 

[sancho]

It was not foolish to go for a new engine as y'day or today or even tomorrow we will have to go for it. Engine tech is very crucial. But there should have been a provision that if any of the related development fails/or take time...there are alternatives to fill the gap.

Of course we needed to develop an own engine at some point, but the mistake was to make LCA dependent on this new engine as well! If we had used a proven foreign engine from the start, like the Chinese are doing it with JF17 or J10 and Russian engines, or like Dassault had done it with US engines on Rafale, LCA would be operational today! We could have developed Kaveri without any pressure and could have added it into LCAs production line, when the engine is ready and mature enough. The same is the case with the radar development, important, but wrongly planned!

 

[brational]

No news on LCA now a days. We are already into 2012, any news on Induction?

 

[rockstarIN]

No there was problem on project management and project plan itself. They planned to qualify a fighter plane along with unqualified engine. That has added too many variable for the project and it was a recipe for failure.

They should have planned to qualify the Tejas with proven engine followed by Kaveri induction once LCA has rectified most of design flaws so that they had to work only on engine/ airframe integration issue ONLY.

At the planning stage of LCA, you are not sure of west will give you engines. Thats the lession from HF-24. Russian engines are possibkle though that time

 

[Capt.Popeye]

At the planning stage of LCA, you are not sure of west will give you engines. Thats the lession from HF-24. Russian engines are possibkle though that time

Russian engines were not a 'first choice' for those projects.................