Gaza-Israel Conflict | October 2023

[HAIDER]

When media show some pictures ...show the hatred among civilians ..

Israelis Watch Bombs Drop on Gaza From Front-Row Seats​

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Israelis gathered on a hilltop outside the town of Sderot on Monday to watch the bombardment of Gaza.Credit...Andrew Burton/Getty Images

Israelis watched the bombing of Gaza on Saturday night from a couch dragged to a hill overlooking the Palestinian territory.Credit...Menahem Kahana/Agence France-Presse — Getty Images

https://twitter.com/x/status/486954506517639170

 

[FuturePAF]

This is the initial reading, by few retired generals here. One of them appears on few Vlog discussions regularly, and gave his assessment and its the same.

I will go a step further and say, perhaps Iran has their hand in this pie. Not sure why, but I feel they have played a part. Its understandable, given what their Nuclear program has suffered.

Problem is that, most of the settled Arab countries today don't want anymore bloodshed. Many posters rejoicing here, are only pointing to one part of human psyche that is retribution. The other side is self preservation, and it gets activated more in those who are in a more comfortable situation such as the Saudis etc.

There are deeper factors here, where today most of the Arab nations want to have a better cover for themselves from USA. Those who went for it openly, have it and others who felt backstabbed played a bit of game and then went for it.

All this talk of USA a receding power is hogwash, being pandered to for propaganda purposes to fetch what they actually want. Like any other country USA has issues, but is going no where for another decade in the least if one wants to be brutally unbiased. Even if one wants to say that their economic power might reduce, due to debt issues or whatever no other country can challenge their hard power for next decade again if we go for least time.

If we keep aside the factors like:

Has Israel allowed this happen or were they inefficient on practical level
Has Israel got what is deserved on emotional level

What are we left with? A country bloodied, with innocent civilians massacred brutally and inhumanely who were not combatants (irrespective of their conscription service). Already support is flowing in from those who matter, and USA of all has promised all that Israel needs.

This is exactly the mix, where countries can do what they want irrespective of morality and legality

Hamas just shot the Palestinians in their head, by doing what they did here. The Arab world will vocally loud, but will do jackshit when they know what's at stake. I am more than sure, they are no more interested in new Arab springs.

The Arab regimes; autocrats, are their societies’ elites, and do indeed seem more intent on deeper integration into the global order. But, without taking into account the desires of the generally young masses (in the face of economic hardships), sometimes it’s not possible to predict if a ground swell of rebellion (supported by an ever present Iran) may emerge, large enough to destabilize these regimes.

As for the motive, Iran might have thought now was the time to make a move, as the world is bogged down with Ukraine, and they recently saw 80 killed in a drone strike at a military graduation in Damascus.

Without china stepping up and Russia out of the picture for the time being, indeed, US regional influence is less visible but defiantly not receding. I doubt Israel allowed this to happen, but they are quick in how they respond, and will use the best PR to show they are being “careful” in how they respond.

The key takeaway IMHO, is Hamas has tried to humiliated Arab regimes (in the eyes of those nations populations) trying to normalize relations with Israel, in hopes of getting a better deal for themselves as the Palestinians in general, if successful which hamas will try to claim to have a share of power in the final outcome, which the Arab regimes seem desperate to achieve soon. The MBS comment that progress is happen day by day (paraphrasing here) towards normalization was probably the main impetus to this new clash.

 

[Kaniska]

You are asking the wrong questions. You should be asking why the Arabs went along with pedo Biden's plan to accept Israel.

P.S. Notice how not a single Arab from PDF has responded in this topic LOL

Man …they should go behind Arabs not Israel…

 

[Meengla]

Hizbullah should join the initiative started by Hamas and open up the Lebanese front. If this turns out to be continuous over a long term, Israel will lose its sting and then the Muslims can liberate Palestine and Al-Aqsa.

The additional benefit of the situation will be that Arab countries will end their current cooperation with Israel.

Lebanon doesn't have much to lose at this point given their dire economic situation. But who am I to say? I am sitting in comfort far away.

.that they have a plan after all, whether its coordinated with Hizb or not, time will tell, otherwise the facts which you have stated are pretty much clear. Interesting thing to see is how Hamas has planned to negated IDF superiority in firepower, armor and air while capitalizing on IDF sensitivity to casualties, both human and equipment.

Israelis maybe able to take more casualties then Europeans but they still can't take many. Their propaganda is so strong trying to convince the West, in one of the conflicts with Palestinians, a few of them were killed and they gave a proportionate number something like 'given our low population, 10 getting killed is like 10,000 getting Westerners killed'. They carefully forgot to add that they killed 1000 Palestinians in that conflict. While the numbers are approximate they do show the propaganda.

Many of them are arrogant,annoying,selfish and extremely xenophobic. But a lot of them are good,kind,charismatic people who just want peace or the right to have a country.

Ahh, the age old 'many' argument. Until it becomes 'most', the 'many' are ineffectual. And by continuing to elect a hawk like Netanyahu, it looks like not many 'many' anyway!! Your continued Moral Equivalency argument! Take a clear stand and recognize and condemn the root cause of this problem, please!!

Do you think this is a strategic move by Hamas to derail Saudi-Israeli normalization?; making it difficult for any deal to go through unless Hamas’ position is ensured (recent Saudi demands of the PLO required more effort to politically sideline Hamas and gain back some control in Gaza) and Palestinians get something more then the Israelis are willing to concede at this point.

Possible that Palestinians are trying to put themselves in the ongoing Arab-Israel bonhomie, but I tend to think this recent conflict has roots in the killing of Palestinians in recent weeks in the West Bank. Plus I also think the divide between Fatah and Hamas is not as great as being perceived.

However this changes alot for Israel and Israelis who thought they were invincible, who use to enjoy and party while Palestine was bombarded mercilessly. Now they will know what it is like to be on the other end of the barrel.

It would sure give a pause to some Polish Jew to re-consider a move to that arid land which WILL be an even more violent region in case of the next World War!!

 

[Kaniska]

as a Indian why is your butt on fire surely the lack of toilets should be your first concern

Since when world is looking towards elite Pakistani people to comment and share opinions about Middle east issues?

 

[Jaeger]

This is already a massive win for Palestinian freedom fighters . They launched this attack knowing full well they would lose militarily because they are massively outnumbered and outgunned.. However, they have caused Israeli intelligence and military enormous embarrassment that cannot be undone What is more, this has happened to the most militant Israeli government ever. Clearly, a hard line is no deterrent.

Getting tens if thousands of your own people killed , just to cause embarrassment to an enemy intelligence agency ..is that a victory?

That is just barbarism if epic proportions.

 

[hussain0216]

You are asking the wrong questions. You should be asking why the Arabs went along with pedo Biden's plan to accept Israel.

P.S. Notice how not a single Arab from PDF has responded in this topic LOL

Any operation by the Palestinians will be costly for them in lives and infrastructure, BUT this doesn't mean you stop fighting for freedom

This is not the Muslim way, we keep going at all costs


The aim of Israel and the west is to get normalisation with Arab and Muslim states, and just keep the Palestinian issue burning

IF this can stop the normalisation process and instigate the Arab and Muslim population against normalisation then all the better



Keep the fight going

 

[Hulk]

https://x.com/danvir_chauhan/status/1710675190840271053?s=46

 

[Eslam]

Pagan? I guess your version of Islam does not talk about the "People of the Book".

So geek your eehlepagan

 

[HAIDER]

Now its punishment for US taxpayer to finance every bomb Israel drops ..

 

[hussain0216]

Getting tens if thousands of your own people killed , just to cause embarrassment to an enemy intelligence agency ..is that a victory?

That is just barbarism if epic proportions.

Now you realise why Hindus were humiliated for a thousand years

Palestinians are Muslims and they must never stop resisting against a oppressor, yes they will lose people disproportionately but that doesn't mean you stop fighting. Freedom is everything

 

[indushek]

The Arab regimes; autocrats, are their societies’ elites, and do indeed seem more intent on deeper integration into the global order. But, without taking into account the desires of the generally young masses (in the face of economic hardships), sometimes it’s not possible to predict if a ground swell of rebellion (supported by an ever present Iran) may emerge, large enough to destabilize these regimes.

As for the motive, Iran might have thought now was the time to make a move, as the world is bogged down with Ukraine, and they recently saw 80 killed in a drone strike at a military graduation in Damascus.

Without china stepping up and Russia out of the picture for the time being, indeed, US regional influence is less visible but defiantly not receding. I doubt Israel allowed this to happen, but they are quick in how they respond, and will use the best PR to show they are being “careful” in how they respond.

The key takeaway IMHO, is Hamas has tried to humiliated Arab regimes (in the eyes of those nations populations) trying to normalize relations with Israel, in hopes of getting a better deal for themselves as the Palestinians in general, which they will try to claim to have a share of power in the final outcome, which the Arab regimes seem desperate to achieve soon. The MBS comment that progress is happen day by day (paraphrasing here) towards normalization was probably the main impetus to this new clash.

Agree with all that you mentioned

Only, those who planned this have miscalculated I feel. There will be no deal, leave aside better deal.

One point that I would like to make is that, narratives come and go. I feel that Muslim world in general, has suffered a identity issue in general and internally as well in the last two to three decades.

Given the non democratic nature of most Arab nations, you and I will never know how much the Arab youth are into becoming holy warriors. Yes they might have distrust or even hatred for non Arab or non Muslim world, but I don't think majority of them will shout 'death to others'.

Further we shouldn't forget that, such societies with leadership who aren't elected will be really nervous of the youth, and will keep close tabs on them. Maybe am generalizing here but, overall I feel the moves by Arab nations to get integrated into Western world order, might not face that much of issue locally for them.

This is future we are talking about, so I can always be wrong.

 

[Kaniska]

Getting tens if thousands of your own people killed , just to cause embarrassment to an enemy intelligence agency ..is that a victory?

That is just barbarism if epic proportions.

Exactly…the entire middle east is already ruined and war zone…

 

[Areesh]

Okay update, we already killed hundreds of the monkeys, that attacked us on a holiday and in the morning of Sabbath.

Now, Gaza will suffer.

All those polish and Romanian clowns are still with Hamas boys

Don't talk tough occupier

 

[hussain0216]

Now its punishment for US taxpayer to finance every bomb Israel drops ..

Yeah,, then cry about Ukraine and freedom