Fall of Kabul: How US, Pakistan failed to predict Taliban victory

[hussain0216]

You have to remember

The U.S-NATO gave the Afghans hundreds of billions going into trillion plus, in terms of aid, support, weapons and training

They gave the Afghans 20 years


All the Afghans had to do was make friends with their neighbors
Get everyone on side and use the resources to build up their state



What they did was try to use India to antagonize Pakistan
Reach out to pashtun nationalists to openly try to antagonize Pakistan and create issues
Give covert support to anti Pakistan terrorists, in terms of training and spacey, this was backed by the indians

The U.S and NATO were unconcerned about Pakistani issues and demands and took a 'we don't care's attitude



Indians took advantage and invested billions to counter and target Pakistan


Pakistan risked a hostile afghan republic that was accepted by the world, with a functional army, that was anti Pakistani amd working with and plotting with India

They risked U.S and NATO in the region who didn't care about our strategic interests and who would constantly be looking into our borders and Chinese/Pakistani projecta



Pakistan did what it had to and fcuked them all
Whether it is accepted or not
THIS WILL GO DOWN IN HISTORY AS A ISI MASTERCLASS IN SUBTERFUGE, PLANNING AND SCREWING OVER MULTIPLE ENEMIES AT ONCE



the fallout was ALWAYS going to happen
So a TTP suicide blast whilst terrible, is a expected consequences of the defeat of the Afghan Republic


It will take time and you can see the pressure on Taliban working, because they need a good relationship with Pakistan, to get resources, and deals made
They have no choice and we will squeeze the TTP and BLA
If we have the enforced disappeared thousands of people, IT WILL BE DONE



the Taliban whilst dangerous are a isolated state
Whilst they themselves are Afghan nationalists, they can't link up with the leftist pashtun nationalists and we have essentially divided the afghans




Everyone knows the resource possibilities in Afghanistan and Pakistan
They are underdeveloped but all there for the talking and developing



Regardless of cost or fallout,, WE HAD TO DO THIS
and if the plans work India would be completely blocked, and deals will be made for development going forward


The only point of query is whether the established will tread the line between China and the west
Lately Pakistan is a prime supplier of weapons to Ukraine
A lot of other discussions are ongoing with the U.S and the Ukraine war has opened a lot of possibilities and I feel Pakistan is again looking at options of deals and alliances in the west which the GCC is also supportive of

 

[FuturePAF]

You did not understand my question. Even if the previous era generation, these facts hold true. Either your previous generation was under misunderstanding about the patriotism of our Bollywood stars or the Pakistan population in general did not have so much hatred as it exists today.

The later and not so much hate but clairvoyance at what India is actually like and bound to become. The trend became self evident with Moro and his lot. The older generation, the boomers, lived it up on the borrowed money and accepted, by and large, told to stay out of real politics in one way or another. The younger generation doesn’t have either luxury.

 

[Muji.Iqbal]

All this talk is nonsense.

Point is Afghan Taliban is back in power now.

Allah has given Afghan Taliban a second chance to prove themselves to the world and United Nations.

 

[FuturePAF]

Current power centres in India aren‘t bothered about it. A decision was taken to stop any goodie goodie interactions and take any measure necessary to curtail connections with Paksiatn.

It was good for your nation since it has spurred your own entertainment industry. Seems that everyone is happy.

As far as strategic decision making goes, Paksiatn has a long way to go. Every foreign policy decision appears to be a knee jerk reaction, rather than well thought out one. Main problem is involvement of the Establishment in all policy making. Their vision can never be as wide or game changing as a deft and pragmatic politician. I don’t see any change in that regard.

Your nation needs a charismatic political leader with enough clout to charter a path of his/her own. IK is out for few years. Is there anyone else? I don’t see any.

Sideline Indian minorities and curb your soft power if you choose, but don’t think there won’t be any ramifications.

India’s economic rise is not guaranteed | Financial Times

Without reform New Delhi will be unable to capitalise on the country’s potential

www.ft.com

I’m also glad it gave the impetus for us to rebuild our own cultural products. Glad we are ditching knockoff Hollywood aka Bollywood. At one time Bollywood was family friendly and inspirational, not so anymore. Good riddance.

 

[Bengal71]

I thought Pakistan always predicted Taliban's victory.

 

[epebble]

Hard to believe Pakistan didn't know

I mean the smile on Faiz Hameed's face said everything, there was no shock or distaste...

There is nothing to prove current state of affairs is disliked by Pakistan military. A low-grade action on the border keeps them at the top of the food chain. They have to worry that if all borders are calm, people may start wondering why do you need bulk of the resources?

 

[TheSolution]

There is nothing to prove current state of affairs is disliked by Pakistan military. A low-grade action on the border keeps them at the top of the food chain. They have to worry that if all borders are calm, people may start wondering why do you need bulk of the resources?

To answer the question at the end, the boogeyman used is India for all large defence equipment acquisition.

Plus, Pakistani society is very militarised regardless, people are in support of being heavily equipped.

 

[hussain0216]

I thought Pakistan always predicted Taliban's victory.

It pretty much ensured it

 

[KingMamba]

Pakistan would not have answered that question honestly, military are duffers but they surely knew Talibs would win.

 

[Muji.Iqbal]

It pretty much ensured it

Pakistan knew Afghan Taliban was going to win.

Now Afghan Taliban has won the 20 year war and is back in power.

 

[jhungary]

Whatever bad thing happens in America is Trump's fault?

Are you studying Modi blaming the Congress party?

I don't know if anything bad happened to America it's Trump's fault but signing that treaty with Taliban is a big mistake, he signs that, knowing the Ghani government is not going to be able to sustain their attack alone and sidelining the Ghani government as well, and then singlehandedly raise the withdraw limit. Esper want 4500 to remain in Afghanistan by 2021, Trump left 1500, and took out the entirety of the Air Power and by the time Taliban took over, less than 1000 was in country, you can't hold the entire country with 1000 US Troop.

So yes, that's Trump fault, you can ask any Afghan vet and they will say the same thing. You don't need to be in the military to know that's it is the end when he signs that treaty, 20 years of effort he ended it to try to save his presidency which he couldn't anyway

 

[Goritoes]

In Bajwa's defense, he might have thought that Afghan Army will at least put up a fight, but that haram khor charsi Army just back stab American's the day they left lol

 

[Clutch]

Matlab General Bajwa aur Major Gaurav Arya ka military acumen aik jaisa tha

Both thought Taliban won't be able to capture Kabul easily

Americans had Intel on and needed to prepare for the Russian invasion of Ukraine. That's why pulled out so fast from Afghanistan. Period.

 

[VkdIndian]

Sideline Indian minorities and curb your soft power if you choose

No one sidelining the minorities. The interaction with Paksiatn and our own minorities are two different things.

The pace of creating opportunities has never been this fast. It would benefit each and every citizen.

 

[Predd]

No one "won" the Afghan war, each and every side were losers. NATO and the Afghan Republic withdrew because there was no further benefit of continuing the war.