Democracy in China? It's in the eye of the beholder.

[TISSOT]

I am interested in what's the "mistake" you mentioned here? and it is privilege in democracy only?

Democracy is the end result of thousands of such mistakes.
Democracy cannot exist without those mistakes.

In the context of personal Freedom, the mistakes are the time you spend "wasting" by playing a video game or online chat.

In context of Democracy, the mistakes the people make in choosing the wrong kind of leader, choosing the wrong kind of policy, choosing the wrong king of practices, etc.

End of the day, experience is the biggest teacher, not the red book or the green book.

 

[beijingwalker]

You are free to have your beliefs. That is a freedom too.

However there is no evolution without turbulence. That is the law of nature and there is no changing that. Without evolution there is only stagnation and eventual decay and death.

Finally animals are never secure, yet they desire freedom over water, food or shelter.

Humans have animal basic needs , if you don't even have those you are worse off than animals. As for a revolution, China's uplifting situation and people's high approval rate now allows no room for revolution at least for the foreseeable future. But I can see some countries do badly need one.

Democracy is the end result of thousands of such mistakes.
Democracy cannot exist without those mistakes.

In the context of personal Freedom, the mistakes are the time you spend "wasting" by playing a video game or online chat.

In context of Democracy, the mistakes the people make in choosing the wrong kind of leader, choosing the wrong kind of policy, choosing the wrong king of practices, etc.

End of the day, experience is the biggest teacher, not the red book or the green book.

All countries and governments make mistake, it's not exclusive for democracy, do you believe that China never made mistakes?

 

[sweetgrape]

Democracy is the end result of thousands of such mistakes.
Democracy cannot exist without those mistakes.

In the context of personal Freedom, the mistakes are the time you spend "wasting" by playing a video game or online chat.

In context of Democracy, the mistakes the people make in choosing the wrong kind of leader, choosing the wrong kind of policy, choosing the wrong king of practices, etc.

End of the day, experience is the biggest teacher, not the red book or the green book.

Good preach, very abstract, hehe. Can I understand that in your eyes, democracy and freedom are testing ground? you are lab mouse, when you make mistake, especially the leader, someone will lose something for the mistake, right? but doesn't this exist in autocratic country?

In fact, you words make no sense I think, what you talking is not privilege in democratic state.

In my eyes, as a leader, they must have capability to lead his people to be rich and happy, the country to be strong, can protect himself, make the government and society more efficient, if can't he is not qualified leader.

And when you die, if you don't record your experience, how your offspring know you experience? your experience just be wasted in circle.

 

[TISSOT]

Humans have animal basic needs , if you don't even have those you are worse off than animals. As for a revolution, China's uplifting situation and people's high approval rate now allows no room for revolution at least for the foreseeable future. But I can see some countries do badly need one.

Only a society that treats its citizens as animals will talk about "basic needs" and put that before freedom. Even a caged bird given comfort, food and water will escape if you leave the door open.

Being hungry is terrible, but being well fed and in a cage is worse.

Also there is a difference between "evolution" and "revolution". China is used to revolution, maybe you need to try evolution for a change. And that happens when there you allow for freedom and ensure a vibrant chaos and diversity.

There is no evolution to be found in a computer guided by logic and reasoning. Evolution needs the opposite of order, it needs chaos and disorder.

All countries and governments make mistake, it's not exclusive for democracy, do you believe that China never made mistakes?

You don't seem to understand.

Having the FREEDOM to make mistake is VERY DIFFERENT from making a mistake BY ACCIDENT, while attempting to do something else.

The difference is the ability to CHOOSE.

 

[beijingwalker]

Only a society that treats its citizens as animals will talk about "basic needs" and put that before freedom. Even a caged bird given comfort, food and water will escape if you leave the door open.

Being hungry is terrible, but being well fed and in a cage is worse.

Also there is a difference between "evolution" and "revolution". China is used to revolution, maybe you need to try evolution for a change. And that happens when there you allow for freedom and ensure a vibrant chaos and diversity.

There is no evolution to be found in a computer guided by logic and reasoning. Evolution needs the opposite of order, it needs chaos and disorder.

We do open the doors and China had 128 million people traveled abroad in 2015 alone, the most in the world. And it's our free choice believing China's system suits China the best and bring the majority of Chinese people happiness and content, isn't that the democracy you have been preaching? people's free choice and belief.

You can preach that Indian people live a much better life than Chinese cause you have democracy, but believe me, the whole world will sneeze on that statement, cause we all know how miserable a life average Indians live in.

 

[sweetgrape]

Only a society that treats its citizens as animals will talk about "basic needs" and put that before freedom. Even a caged bird given comfort, food and water will escape if you leave the door open.

Being hungry is terrible, but being well fed and in a cage is worse.

Also there is a difference between "evolution" and "revolution". China is used to revolution, maybe you need to try evolution for a change. And that happens when there you allow for freedom and ensure a vibrant chaos and diversity.

There is no evolution to be found in a computer guided by logic and reasoning. Evolution needs the opposite of order, it needs chaos and disorder.

You make a assumption that we are just have basic needs, but not freedom in a cage, hehe, in fact, all these are imaged by yourself, and just learn from the media, you have not came to China, I believe that.

There are more chaos and disorder in animal world, but we are more smart than them, if you want more chao and disorder for evolution, why you need leader? don't you think what you said are constradictory?

 

[TISSOT]

Good preach, very abstract, hehe. Can I understand that in your eyes, democracy and freedom are testing ground? you are lab mouse, when you make mistake, especially the leader, someone will lose something for the mistake, right? but doesn't this exist in autocratic country?

In fact, you words make no sense I think, what you talking is not privilege in democratic state.

In my eyes, as a leader, they must have capability to lead his people to be rich and happy, the country to be strong, can protect himself, make the government and society more efficient, if can't he is not qualificated leader.

And when you die, if you don't record your experience, how your offspring know you experience? your experience just be wasted in circle.

The universe is far too large and the human brain far too small for us to understand it without any abstraction.

The lab rate does not have a choice to make a mistake, he lives in a controlled sterile environment where even his mistake is made for him. Does that remind you of something ?

You are free to dream up a leader of your choice, but it would be foolish to think that you have the ability to dream up a perfect world.

Pefection can only be achieved in an artificial sterile and stable environment. Pefection is the stage before death.

When you die, you are recorded in the eyes of the people around you. In the memory of your loved ones and in the memory of those who you worked with and interacted with.

Its not wasted as it will guide their path the same way the memory of your parents guided your path.

 

[beijingwalker]

China also attracts the second most overseas travelers coming to China, only second to US. It seems that Indian democracy isn't that attractive around the world as you claimed.

 

[TISSOT]

We do open the doors and China had 128 million people traveled abroad in 2015 alone, the most in the world. And it's our free choice believing China's system suits China the best and bring the majority of Chinese people happiness and content, isn't that the democracy you have been preaching? people's free choice and belief.

You can preach that Indian people live a much better life than Chinese cause you have democracy, but believe me, the whole world will sneeze on that statement, cause we all know how miserable a life average Indians live in.

You are the one desperate to "Compare". Not me.

You are the one who wants to prove himself right, not me.

You are projecting your insecurities on me.

As far as I am concerned, you are free to believe whatever you want. It does not make the slightly difference to me. Same goes for the rest of the world.

 

[beijingwalker]

You are the one desperate to "Compare". Not me.

You are the one who wants to prove himself right, not me.

You are projecting your insecurities on me.

As far as I am concerned, you are free to believe whatever you want. It does not make the slightly difference to me. Same goes for the rest of the world.

That's what the OP is talking about, what the Chinese people's take on democracy. so what's the argument here?

 

[TISSOT]

You make a assumption that we are just have basic needs, but not freedom in a cage, hehe, in fact, all these are imaged by yourself, and just learn from the media, you have not came to China, I believe that.

There are more chaos and disorder in animal world, but we are more smart than them, if you want more chao and disorder for evolution, why you need leader? don't you think what you said are constradictory?

If you think you are free then so be it. Its your life and frankly your freedom or lack of it , does not make the slightly difference to me.

Leaders are required because of the disorder and chaos, not to eliminate it, but to guide us through it.

 

[Reichsmarschall]

North Korea,China,Saudi Arab,Islamic state all have same thought of rule...my way or highway

what the F$^kis this



Go to Pakistan if you can't live without beef: BJP minister
DAWN.COM — UPDATED May 22, 2015 04:57pm
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Indian Minister for Parliamentary Affairs Mukhtar Abbas Naqvi advocates ban on cow slaughter. — AFP/File
NEW DELHI: Advocating a ban on cow slaughter, Indian Minister for Parliamentary Affairs Mukhtar Abbas Naqvi said Thursday that all those who wanted to eat beef could go to Pakistan, IANS news agency reported.

"It is not about loss or profit. It is an issue of faith and belief. It is a sensitive matter for the Hindus," said the minister, adding that even a number of Indian Muslims were against the slaughtering of cows.

“Those who are dying without eating beef can go to Pakistan or Arab countries or any other part of [the] world where it is available," he added.

Earlier in March, the Indian state of Maharashtra had banned the possession and sale of beef. Anyone found in the process of selling or consuming beef can be sentenced to jail for five years and fined Rs10,000.

Before he came to power, Indian Prime Minister Narendra Modi had warned that the country's expanding meat industry would lead to its "ruin".

India's booming middle class with rising disposable incomes is driving the demand for meat in a country which traditionally has had a large vegetarian population.

With chicken a favourite, domestic poultry sales are worth an estimated $9 billion and growing at an annual rate of 20 per cent. India is also one of the world's largest meat exporters.

Cows are considered sacred by Hindus, who form the majority religion in India, but Modi has spoken out against all forms of animal slaughter.

Read more: Modi says animal slaughter will 'ruin' nation

Separately, on the Muslims residing in India, Naqvi said the Modi government was taking steps to fight poverty among the country's minority communities.

"It is a fact that Muslims have remained away from development. Various social security schemes started by our government would help Muslims in a big way," he said.












Man Arrested For Beef Comment On WhatsApp Dies In Police Custody: Report
12/10/2016 8:45 AM IST | Updated 12/10/2016 10:07 AM IST

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  MUKESH GUPTA / REUTERS
  An Indian policeman is silhouetted against the setting sun as he stands guard on the banks of river Tawi ahead of India's Republic Day celebrations in Jammu January 23, 2012. India will celebrate its Republic Day on Thursday. REUTERS/Mukesh Gupta (INDIAN ADMINISTERED KASHMIR - Tags: MILITARY TPX IMAGES OF THE DAY)
  
  Minhaj Ansari, a 22-year-old man from Jharkhand's Jamtara district, arrested for allegedly sharing a beef-related comment on WhatsApp that the police said had potential to spark communal tension, died in custody on Sunday, according to an Indian Exress report.
  
  
  Ansari, a native of Dighari village under Narayanpur police station, allegedly posted the text on October 2, following which he was taken into custody. His family has alleged that he died of custodial torture.
  
  
  When he was shifted to Dhanbad for treatment two days after his arrest, his family got into a scuffle with officer-in-charge Harish Pathak, and lodged an FIR against him, leading to his suspension.
  
  The police maintain that Ansari was suffering from encephalitis, citing medical reports. An inquiry is on. Police cracked down on communally sensitive messages on WhatsApp ahead of Dussehra and Muharram.
  

 

[TISSOT]

That's what the OP is talking about, what the Chinese people's take on democracy. so what's the argument here?

As someone said, I am talking in abstract.

I am talking about a general principle and how it applies to all of us. China included.

 

[sweetgrape]

The universe is far too large and the human brain far too small for us to understand it without any abstraction.

The lab rate does not have a choice to make a mistake, he lives in a controlled sterile environment where even his mistake is made for him. Does that remind you of something ?

You are free to dream up a leader of your choice, but it would be foolish to think that you have the ability to dream up a perfect world.

Pefection can only be achieved in an artificial sterile and stable environment. Pefection is the stage before death.

When you die, you are recorded in the eyes of the people around you. In the memory of your loved ones and in the memory of those who you worked with and interacted with.

Its not wasted as it will guide their path the same way the memory of your parents guided your path.

Did I said about perfect world? what you work for? being worse or being better? the goal you set is to make you surpass your current one or opposite? what's your or human's ultimate goal? why you need leader? the purpose?

If you don't need book, why you need characters and language? sorry, I can't understand, animal have similar life style you described, why human need evolve from animal?

If you think you are free then so be it. Its your life and frankly your freedom or lack of it , does not make the slightly difference to me.

Leaders are required because of the disorder and chaos, not to eliminate it, but to guide us through it.

You means, without leader, the disorder and chaos will disappear? in fact, I think you should read Marxist philosophy, what you said is very superficial, pretend to be abstract, but very contradictory, all are self rightous thing.

 

[beijingwalker]

If you think you are free then so be it. Its your life and frankly your freedom or lack of it , does not make the slightly difference to me.
.

That's the spirit, you can stop here. We are happy about the way we live and you about yours. Chinese don't talk about Indian political system much and Indians seem to be very keen of this topic