Dassault Rafale, tender | News & Discussions

[GORKHALI]

Eurofighter Typhoon rocketinginto the late afternoon sun

 

[LongLiveBritian]

I hope you guys buy our EF, our economy needs a boost and that can only come from trade and etc especially with the war in Afghanistan and Iraq which has completely f'ed our economy(mind my language).

 

[Dash]

I hope you guys buy our EF, our economy needs a boost and that can only come from trade and etc especially with the war in Afghanistan and Iraq which has completely f'ed our economy(mind my language).

You are a big economy, $10 billion are nothing but just a cake. But we are seeing greater co-operation in other areas which is benificial for both of us. I am sure we cant recover such a big economy but we can benifit from each other....

and if we dont buy EF, then dont worry, we can always work on giving you something in return.

 

[GORKHALI]

AFTER BURNER 2010
MILITARY AVIATION AND SPACE TECHNOLOGY NEWS: IMAGES- AFTER BURNER 2010
1:

rafale M climbout
2:

Raf typhoon burnout
3:

eurofighter
4:

RAF TORNADO LAST BUMP BEFORE DUMP
5:

Rainbow typhoon

 

[GORKHALI]

CAN SOME HELP ME OUT TO PUT ALL THIS IMAGE HERE from the above link ??

 

[sudhir007]

MMRCA : BVR Silver Bullets for IAF

Lot of discussions have taken place on aircrafts in the race for providing 126 fighter jets to Indian air force for MMRCA tender , but very little has been discussed about the weapons which will come with this , particularly Beyond visual range (BVR) Air to Air missiles (AAM) which is essential weapon in any fighter aircraft now .
Indian air force chief has recently disclosed that whichever aircraft will be selected of the MMRCA tender, Aircrafts will be deployed near Chinese border which will replace old Mig-21s currently guarding north eastern borders of our country, and this is a considerable shift in IAF strategy and planning.

earlier in late 80’s saw arrival of brand new Mirage-2000h and Mig-29A which were mostly deployed in western sector towards Pakistani border , but recent decision to base IAF frontline Sukhoi Su-30MKI and also upgrade many North eastern airbase and runways to keep heaver fighters is the indication that best will be kept to face Chinese air force in case of border conflicts and Pakistani border will be guarded by Upgraded Mirage-2000h and Mig-29SMT along with indigenously developed LCA-Tejas which will be based in western sector from 2012 onwards .

Coming back to BVRAAM’s which will come with the aircrafts if selected by IAF

MBDA Meteor: Termed has one of the best BVRAAM is a Next generation BVRAAM developed by MBDA. Meteor is a light weight BVRAAM which incorporates stealthy profile and lesser drag with advance sensors, Meteor has data link capability and can be guided by another aircraft like AWACS or by another fighter aircraft. Gripen and Eurofighter are the aircrafts which will be have them has a standard BVRAAM package but they are Plans by IAF to acquire them in any case to improve Sukhoi-30 MKI BVR fighting capability and integrations will be done with assistance from MBDA , when MKI’s Mid-life up gradation program which will start in another two years from now .

Raytheon AIM-120 AMRAAM : American mostly likely table Family of AIM-120 AMRAAM which will be offered with F-18 SH and F-16IN , latest in the family are AIM-120D and AIM-120C7 , Saab Gripen also can carry this missile which gives Swedish an edge in MMRCA tender since both Meteor and AIM-120 can be offered has the standard BVRAAM for their jet .AIM-120 Family of AMRAAM will serve USAF and other countries till 2020 still a replacement which is under development become active and hits production .

Raytheon AIM-9X Sidewinder: One more offering will come from Americans will be Sidewinder, it does not fall in category of BVRAAM but still is a potential AAM in close range dogfight, both of the American Missiles are standard missiles in almost all of fighter jets operated by USAF and USN which includes F-15, F-16, F-22, F-35 and even F-18SH, both AAM’s are battle proven and has very high rate of success in dog fights.

MBDA MICA: another BVRAAM coming from MBDA is MICA which is a standard BVRAAM for Rafale jets and can also be integrated with Eurofighter, IAF is already procuring them for their Mirage-2000H which will be upgraded soon with new avionics package and radar and will also get MICA BVRAAM. MICA has been rumored to be already operational with 10 IAF Mirage 2000’s which were purchased from the excess French Air force stock.

PYTHON-5 and DERBY: Israelis are keen to offer there PYTHON-5 which actually is not a BVRAAM but is still an advance AAM missile and currently operational with Israeli F-15 and F-16s, while DERBY is a standard BVRAAM with Indian Navy’s Sea Harrier fleet, while IAF has not yet integrated any of this missiles with their fleet of fighter jets, but recently Indian navy have told they could like to have DERBY in Naval –Tejas too

 

[luckyyy]

MMRCA : BVR Silver Bullets for IAF

why to buy these expensive BVRAAM , each costing more them $3ml , when Astra would be ready by the time first MMRCA arrive...

 

[sudhir007]

why to buy these expensive BVRAAM , each costing more them $3ml , when Astra would be ready by the time first MMRCA arrive...

dear it will be package deal not for only f/a if you look at the apache longbow helicopter in the below thread you will find that we getting around 1600-1700 different missile for only 22 helicopter, also i here that in the mirage-2000 up-gradation deal we are buying around $700million mica missile. and did you really sure that astra will be significant. we need more capable missile to defend our-self. the missile which we are getting with this deal is proven and testing and will be inducted in their country. Astra will be take time and we are not sure how it will be work. and only One missile does not fulfill our requirement.

 

[jha]

METEOR is sure to come..Python-5 is better suited to us than AIM-9x sidewinder..
So, a combo of METEOR,DERBY,Python-5 and ASTRA (in future) will be the AAM arsenal we will be looking at..While ELRAAM will be russian origin..

 

[PRACTICAL PATRIOT]

why to buy these expensive BVRAAM , each costing more them $3ml , when Astra would be ready by the time first MMRCA arrive...

gun is only as good as its bullet. that is however costly and good gun you have its effectiveness would depend on its bullets in this case if our bvram is not as good as our plane then they wont be highly lethal.
astra is a new platform and INDIA's first atempt at bvram so it will definately take time for us to mature this technology and make it proven.

so it is better to use more proven technology with our frontline fighters along with indeginous ones to give time for our indeginious technology to mature.

 

[KEETARP]

why to buy these expensive BVRAAM , each costing more them $3ml , when Astra would be ready by the time first MMRCA arrive...

It may look as an - out & out waste of money buying these newer generation missile , but if you look closely what - air-force will be facing in air-combat tomorrow . It is the only way we can be at par with enemy .

Only few months back , forum was buzzing with news (JF17 to get A-Darter , SD10 & DIRCM ) .
If that has not materialized , it will in future.

Now will our generation old ; seeker tech of R73,ASTRA,R77 can manage to outsmart DIRCM of J10,F16,Jf17 .
Can R73 provide QWIP-IIFPA imaging resolution equal to AIM-9x sidewinder .
Does R77,ASTRA has advanced seeker to be able to cut through clutter ,chaffs .
Just 2 days back Sd10 was discussed to be having home-on-jam mode . (4 modes in total) . See how level playing field will change suddenly and we will be at disadvantage

Game changer will be AIM120-c7 , Meteor , ASRRAM-AIM132 IRIST , AIM9X but if we fail to cache in .................................. i think that settles it .

 

[angeldemon_007]

I think its better to pay 3 million extra, rather than losing the whole fighter in the enemy attack. By the way, we don't have to pay extra for the missile, they are coming with the fighters.
Alo, the point to be noted is Gripen is again ahead of others, although it might not win because of less political leverage.

 

[sancho]

METEOR is sure to come..Python-5 is better suited to us than AIM-9x sidewinder..
So, a combo of METEOR,DERBY,Python-5 and ASTRA (in future) will be the AAM arsenal we will be looking at..While ELRAAM will be russian origin..

Not to forget that we will have MICA IR and EM also, personaly I hoped for Python V for LCA, or the upgraded fighter, but so far it looks like we don't go for them. Derby is not really needed when we have R77, Astra, MICA EM and can go to METEOR, or AIM 120. MICA IR is really an interesting missile imo, because it is the only IR missile that can be used at BVR ranges.
A possible missile combo for Indian Rafales could be MICA IR + ASTRA + METEOR, which would be a deadly combo in BVR.
I also think we should combine the Maitri SAM co-development, with an SR AAM development, MICA VL is also based on MICA IR, just like Spyder SAM is based on Python V missiles. We just would go the other way around.

 

[jha]

Not to forget that we will have MICA IR and EM also, personaly I hoped for Python V for LCA, or the upgraded fighter, but so far it looks like we don't go for them. Derby is not really needed when we have R77, Astra, MICA EM and can go to METEOR, or AIM 120. MICA IR is really an interesting missile imo, because it is the only IR missile that can be used at BVR ranges.
A possible missile combo for Indian Rafales could be MICA IR + ASTRA + METEOR, which would be a deadly combo in BVR.
I also think we should combine the Maitri SAM co-development, with an SR AAM development, MICA VL is also based on MICA IR, just like Spyder SAM is based on Python V missiles. We just would go the other way around.

Thats an interesting idea..We can and should do that. But I doubt we will go for it..

Regarding Derby:: I was advocating this beause of commonality ..We already are using this in Harriers..BTW i had detailed discussion on this with an israelli guy on this and even he does not know what is its range..

 

[sancho]

Thats an interesting idea..We can and should do that. But I doubt we will go for it..

Regarding Derby:: I was advocating this beause of commonality ..We already are using this in Harriers..BTW i had detailed discussion on this with an israelli guy on this and even he does not know what is its range..

Why do you think so, are there other plans? I mean we can't rely on old R73, or buy western SR missiles forever right? Sooner, or later we have to develop an own one too and this would have been a good chance.
I know, but Derby is available just for a dozen Harriers only, so in very small numbers and with the induction of Mig 29K and NLCA, they will be phased out anyway. That makes Derby not even a long term alternative for IN, that's why I have doubts about Derby.


Btw, pics of the new F16 CFTs, now testing on UAEs B60s:

Livefist - Indian Defence & Aerospace: PHOTOS: The F-16 Conformal Refuelling Probe For MMRCA