Cultural conflicts

[BelligerentPacifist]

... I'm apprehensive of an arranged South Asian marriage with a random girl because of my cultural conflicts,...

Dude you're being straight silly. You do not live in a village. For you arranged marriage will not mean that you marry a random girl. Arranged marriage is simply the result of a set of dates between the two of you and your families, initiated by any of the members or through outside suggestion. You meet the girl and the parents, sweat through the interview, and if it works congrats otherwise you both move off to other prospects. That's not a 'random girl'. it's a girl you now know, and the 'values' of whose family you're now familiar with. If you get a tentative nod from her parents, you might even be go out with her to see if you two get along, but that depends on the families.

 

[SQ8]

/facepalm

You don't ruin your chances of getting a Pakistani girl by dating.

For all you know the girl you are going to marry may have been dating some guy :/

Remember, the first girl you like, need not be the one you first love.

Yup.. you gotta love their ideaology..
" a guy is lucky if he is the first 'love' for a girl.. and a girl is lucky if she is the last whatever of a guy".

I had to hold back massive peals of laughter and keep a straight face when I heard that

Pakistani girls these days are independent.. they have their career's... some outdo their husbands even.
But if you are lucky.. they do bring those important values with them as well.
However.. such girls are usually.. (around 90% of the time) found via the usual Parent search engine.
So stop your worrying, look for another degree, change your car, you cellphone.. get buff if you are into that thing.
be first in line for every premiere or videogame.. go to concerts etc.. flirt around if you wish.
but when the time comes.. stick to the desi chick and relax.. it isnt a perfect system, but it works well.

 

[muse]

Bilal

From your posts, it seems to me that you want to be with a person (girl) who is also a friend -- and this requires a lot of maturity from you and from the individual you want to be with --- If you think you will ever get to be with such a person through some "arrangement" you are pretty much setting yourself up for failure.

Just plain forget about arranged anything - you will end up in emotional distress, because clearly it's not where your head nor your heart is --

But from your post thus far I'm not really sure what your beef is with US girls -- you say they don't have the same values - What values are those??

 

[A for Anarchy]

First of all, I'm cool with a Pakistani girl who's dated before. I just want a Pakistani girl I see myself in the future to feel the same way about me. But I'm not sure if my parents would exactly agree with me there, & my parents are important to me as well. That's another issue though, & the easier one to resolve. I don't see the problem with the Pakistani girl, but more the society in terms of arranged marriage, the expectations, the peer pressure from society, the constant comparisons, doing things out of necessity than happiness etc. Stuff like that. While a girl might be independent & everything I want to see in her, the whole concept of the arranged marriage, the pressure from society/khandaan, these are things I don't like.

A. Do what you must - get them to find a girl with the list of your conditions on it, if you are so subservient to your parents. Remember - You are not sharing a bed with your parents.

B. If you do grow a pair of balls *not condescending, more endearingly said* , find a girl you can like and compromise some stuff like Gaurav says. Marriage is about tolerating the woman your entire life. The lust will eventually go away and you should be able to enjoy each other's company.

C. Arranged marriages are all that not bad either - from what I see - you are pretty hopeless at dating, so it seems the best option for you.

D. You find a girl who is not Pakistani you like - then you can have your issues with all these issues and then you can start worrying. Till then C.

 

[Roybot]

Find a british pakistani girl with some good family background in pakistan.
I'd say dats the middle ground b/w pakistan and american chicks. Highest probability of finding all the traits that u just enlisted.

bad advise

 

[BelligerentPacifist]

I have an Undergrad & a Masters, as well as 2 years of work experience (a job I didn't really like). I'm ambitious, I want to go places, I want to do things that make me happy, that give me pleasure & happiness; & I want my future partner to reciprocate those things.

Most women in your social stratum in Pakistan have an undergrad and often a postgrad.

Many love their jobs. They're ambitious and want their career to go places, and yet a successful marriage at the same time.

They like doing things that make them happy (don't we all btw?). But if you mean they do things that make you happy then that's not entirely possible for somebody else to be all the time like that.

Are YOU willing to reciprocate?

All my married female friends and all my male friends' wives have some great fun together. What's you idea of marriage - life imprisonment? bonded labour?

Get over the fears and take your time to look for the right woman. Don't rush into marriage before getting to know her, that's what I say to ya.

 

[53fd]

Bilal

From your posts, it seems to me that you want to be with a person (girl) who is also a friend -- and this requires a lot of maturity from you and from the individual you want to be with --- If you think you will ever get to be with such a person through some "arrangement" you are pretty much setting yourself up for failure.

Just plain forget about arranged anything - you will end up in emotional distress, because clearly it's not where your head nor your heart is --

But from your post thus far I'm not really sure what your beef is with US girls -- you say they don't have the same values - What values are those??

You've hit the crux of the problem. Everything you've said in this post is correct, & applicable to my situation. Thank you.

There are a few 'loyalty' issues with American girls here, they look for the spark in a relationship, & once that's gone, it's "Game Over" for the relationship. Then there is the issue of past relationships, which might be fine with me, but not maybe with my parents. Not in terms of promiscuous behavior, but in terms of 'loyalty' again. The opinions of my parents is very important to me as well, and those are the values I have, & those are the values I hope to see in my future wife as well, someone who can respect my parents like a Pakistani girl does. In those areas, the US girl doesn't fare well enough. I'm not even talking about kids here (that's too far ahead), but things that directly affect me & my future companion. These are the specific areas that give rise to all the internal contradictions inside of me.

 

[A for Anarchy]

You've hit the crux of the problem. Everything you've said in this post is correct, & applicable to my situation. Thank you.

There are a few 'loyalty' issues with American girls here, they look for the spark in a relationship, & once that's gone, it's "Game Over" for the relationship. Then there is the issue of past relationships, which might be fine with me, but not maybe with my parents. Not in terms of promiscuous behavior, but in terms of 'loyalty' again. The opinions of my parents is very important to me as well, and those are the values I have, & those are the values I hope to see in my future wife as well, someone who can respect my parents like a Pakistani girl does. In those areas, the US girl doesn't fare well enough. I'm not even talking about kids here (that's too far ahead), but things that directly affect me & my future companion. These are the specific areas that give rise to all the internal contradictions inside of me.

You are generalizing.



And yet, at 24 you should not be thinking about marriage. Believe that in your life, things will go the way you want it if you have no regrets about whatever you are doing at present.

Plan your career, have fun.
Go to movies. Listen to music . Dance.

Women will happen.

Whether you like it or not.

Edit: I almost repeat posted Santro's message :/

 

[53fd]

Most women in your social stratum in Pakistan have an undergrad and often a postgrad.

Many love their jobs. They're ambitious and want their career to go places, and yet a successful marriage at the same time.

They like doing things that make them happy (don't we all btw?). But if you mean they do things that make you happy then that's not entirely possible for somebody else to be all the time like that.

Are YOU willing to reciprocate?

All my married female friends and all my male friends' wives have some great fun together. What's you idea of marriage - life imprisonment? bonded labour?

Get over the fears and take your time to look for the right woman. Don't rush into marriage before getting to know her, that's what I say to ya.

There are a lot of young, successful Pakistani girls out there of course. It's not the problem with the particular individual, but with the whole concept of arranged marriage. Compatibility issues. How can you develop a bond of love & friendship with your partner you've spent a brief time knowing, that too in front of "everyone's eyes", not as much on a personal level, the way it is in dating here.

I talked about self-sustenance before, because I don't want to be doing things for her all the time (but of course at times I have to, & should) to make her happy, & I don't expect the same from her either. A relationship on friendship/companionship & trust, free from pressures from society, free from the constant bickering in families & comparisons on the basis of social status etc. Anyways, maybe I need a few years to think about this, as I'm clearly not ready for marriage at this stage. These are some of the issues I've seen my Pakistani friends my age & older deal with when they're engaged or married.

 

[Ajaxpaul]

You've hit the crux of the problem. Everything you've said in this post is correct, & applicable to my situation. Thank you.

There are a few 'loyalty' issues with American girls here, they look for the spark in a relationship, & once that's gone, it's "Game Over" for the relationship. Then there is the issue of past relationships, which might be fine with me, but not maybe with my parents. Not in terms of promiscuous behavior, but in terms of 'loyalty' again. The opinions of my parents is very important to me as well, and those are the values I have, & those are the values I hope to see in my future wife as well, someone who can respect my parents like a Pakistani girl does. In those areas, the US girl doesn't fare well enough. I'm not even talking about kids here (that's too far ahead), but things that directly affect me & my future companion. These are the specific areas that give rise to all the internal contradictions inside of me.

yeah game over buddy

 

[Mumbai Man]

You need to stop watching too much of Bollywood Movies!! Most of your threads and posts are filmy and melodramatic

 

[BelligerentPacifist]

Bilal

From your posts, it seems to me that you want to be with a person (girl) who is also a friend -- and this requires a lot of maturity from you and from the individual you want to be with --- If you think you will ever get to be with such a person through some "arrangement" you are pretty much setting yourself up for failure.

Just plain forget about arranged anything - you will end up in emotional distress, because clearly it's not where your head nor your heart is --

...

muse, friends' wives make such good friends to me that I find it impossible to believe that they don't make even better friends to their husbands. I've heard people who got into it through arranged marriage too say their wives are their friends first and anything else second. Like you said, it takes some maturity from both sides. I'll add it also take the realization and the acceptance that your partner is or has the potential to be your special friend, but need to work on the both of you if you don't share that bont since before marriage.

I take you're a married man. Maybe your experience is different from my, albeit second-hand, experience.

 

[Zizou]

I think at the back of your mind, you are pretty sure that you will have to end up with arranged marriage and your parents must have already shortlisted few which you obviously are aware of ... Now, none of those candidates really appeal to you and you are worried that they will just be normal housewives and not fun loving companion you may be hoping for .... You are not into dating not because you don't want to go on dates but because you and your family have very good image in society and you don't want to damage it ........ I know it is difficult to be alone at 24 ... Jawani bhi tey josh marr rahee hondi aye naaa .... hehehe .....

Best solution for you will be to get engaged where your parents want to and if she is in Pakistan, interact with her by all possible means like phone, email, sms etc .... Just be normal friends for a year at least .... share everything ... life will be fun and you will find out if it will work ... Than when the time comes, marriage will be something you will really look forward to ....

 

[53fd]

A. Do what you must - get them to find a girl with the list of your conditions on it, if you are so subservient to your parents. Remember - You are not sharing a bed with your parents.

B. If you do grow a pair of balls *not condescending, more endearingly said* , find a girl you can like and compromise some stuff like Gaurav says. Marriage is about tolerating the woman your entire life. The lust will eventually go away and you should be able to enjoy each other's company.

C. Arranged marriages are all that not bad either - from what I see - you are pretty hopeless at dating, so it seems the best option for you.

D. You find a girl who is not Pakistani you like - then you can have your issues with all these issues and then you can start worrying. Till then C.

I've 'been out' with white American girls before without 'going the distance' (religious/cultural reasons), & all the Pakistani American girls I've met here are not someone I envision myself with in the future.

 

[muse]

Billu:

These are normal things that all relationships deal with -- the "spark" in any relationship, doesn't matter whether with Pakistanis or US or Indian or martian, that "spark" is something that one has to continuously keep alive - I mean it doesn't just keep burning on it's own - that's just the way it is and don't beat yourself up over it, - trust me, ups and downs in a relationship have nothing to do with the nationality of a person.

Now if I'm not mistaken, I don't think you have any problem with US girls, rather it's your parents, and in particular your mother, who has the problem -

I got that whole, "I respect and value my parents" - Duh - nobody hates and despises their parents -- but in the end, what makes you Happy? We all learn to overcome, for the most part, disappointments and we all grow -- your parents won't grow but they will overcome what they think was a disappointment, so long as you are happy -- See, your mother is really looking out for you - she doesn't want you totbe hurt, she want you to be happy --- but she also may be wrong about a whole bunch of things.

Peoples past -- Listen friend, you wanted somebody who was also a friend - trust me, you may not know that between men and women, that's a precious commodity, it takes a lot of maturity and compassion - remember peoples past, is just that, past -- but of course in Pakistani culture of Honor and shame, the past is always a issue, not the future or the present, but the past, kinda explains why we are stuck in the kinds of issues we are stuck in.

But, hey, your life - for whatever it's worth - don't beat yourself up over anything -- and everybody, please trust this, everybody has to fight for happiness, or they end up doing things that make them happy but they have to hide it from themselves and the world - not where you want to be.

Smile, it will work itself out.