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China to make public Pak N-deal on June 24

Let me go through some of the facts that allowed me to state that Pakistan got a better deal than India. Here is an article from Rediff that outlines some of the points that I made earlier.



Pakistan gets nuclear deal by proxy: Rediff.com India News

Here is another article that outlines the pros and cons of the deal involved, it is very clear in stating that measures have to be taken as this deal is very expensive and could bound India by the rules set by USA.

Pros and Cons of Indo-US Nuclear deal | General | Articles contributed by users | www.karmayog.org

Similarly this article explains the reason why this deal was concluded. I quote some of the myths debunked in this article.







Seventeen myths about the Indian nuclear deal

First of all, there is no waiver or deal (so to say) that Pakistan is getting. Its China who is powering ahead and supplying the 2 reactors taking the grandfathering route . That is the deal with Pakistan was signed before 2004 (before China jojined NSG) and hence it does not need to follow the NSG's non proliferation rules. Based on this no other country gets a green light to do nuclear trade with Pakistan

IN case of India, its a blanket waiver that gives India the same access to Nuclear technology and trade that a NPT signatory has, without signing the NPT. It also gives a green light to every country in NSG to enter into nuclear trade with India.


Now I dont want to get into the debate on strategic importance of Pakistan vis a vis India. If being more important strategically mean you have to do what Pakistan is doing and go thru the turmoil that it is going thru, then I am fine with Pakistan being most important strategically to USA. Enjoy the importance :)

India is happy to be able to pay for what ever it wants in hard cash instead of giving concessions that border on breach of our sovreignity.

But we are getting way too off topic now..
 
Any update on the public announcement that was expected today from China? Do we expect that to be in New zealand (tomorrow now) or the USA?
 
Any update on the public announcement that was expected today from China? Do we expect that to be in New zealand (tomorrow now) or the USA?

it will probably just be a statement or something, since the deal has already gone through contracts signed an all

Ahem Ahem

China firms join controversial Pakistan nuclear push

By Chris Buckley

BEIJING June 24 (Reuters) - Chinese companies this month quietly signed a contract to cooperate in building two nuclear reactors at Pakistan's Chashma atomic complex, advancing a controversial project that has worried Washington and India.

The China Nuclear Industry Fifth Construction Company and the CNNC China Zhongyuan Engineering Corp, which specialises in foreign nuclear projects, agreed to work together on the third and fourth plants at the Chashma complex, according to a Chinese-language announcement on the website of the Construction Company (CNFC.NET).

The deal, signed in Shanghai on June 8, confirmed that long-running plans about Chinese help in expanding Chashma are moving forward, despite misgivings in the region and beyond about security and proliferation risks in troubled Pakistan.

A Pakistani government official said there was nothing new in the agreement and that it was part of an ongoing cooperation with China in the peaceful use of nuclear energy.

"China has long been cooperating with Pakistan for the use of nuclear technology for peaceful purposes and this cooperation is continuing," the official said.

The pressurized water reactors are "a major cooperative project between China and Pakistan that both governments treat as highly important," said the company announcement dated the same day as the signing, which received almost no domestic media attention at the time.

The project will "bring Chinese nuclear energy to the world and is significant for once again bearing firm fruit for Sino-Pakistani friendship," said the company.

It did not give any details about the timing and cost of the project. The companies have worked on earlier reactors at Chashma.

Mounting signs that China will proceed with the reactor project in Punjab province have stirred international misgivings, especially in neighbouring India and the United States.

The United States said this month it wanted clarification from China on the proposed plants, which have been under planning and deepening negotiation for years.

NUCLEAR SUPPLIERS GROUP

Pakistan and India are wary rivals, and both possess nuclear weapons and stay outside the nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty. Islamabad has looked to Beijing to counter to Indian influence.

Pakistan also faces severe power shortages. China says its nuclear cooperation with Pakistan is purely peaceful and follows international safeguards.

The proposed nuclear deal may be discussed this week by the Nuclear Suppliers Group, a body of 46 governments that seek to control access to their nuclear fuel and reactor technology to prevent the spread of atomic weapons.

China and the United States are among the NSG members, who will meet in New Zealand.

In 2008, China allowed a nuclear energy agreement between Washington and Delhi to win NSG approval, despite misgivings in Beijing, long a rival of India, and criticism from other capitals that the deal eroded nuclear non-proliferation rules.

China has said that the two proposed reactors "form part of an earlier agreement with Pakistan that predated its NSG membership, thereby denying that the sale would violate NSG guidelines," said Lora Saalman, an associate in Beijing with the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace, who studies nuclear diplomacy between China and India.
 
China to Go Ahead With Nuclear Deal with Pakistan, Says China Daily

By B. Raman

Under the heading "China may finance Pakistan reactors", the "China Daily" has reported as follows on June 23, 2010:

China will likely go ahead with financing the construction of two nuclear reactors in Pakistan despite concerns from other countries, say Chinese experts.

China is expected to announce its plans to build the reactors in Punjab province at a Nuclear Suppliers Group (NSG) meeting in New Zealand on Thursday. Meanwhile the United States, with heavy lobbying from India, is reportedly raising doubts over the legitimacy of the deal.

One of the concerns is that Pakistan, as well as India, did not sign the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty and therefore is technically not restricted from transferring the technology to a third party, posing a potential threat to the international community.

"This is not the first time China has helped Pakistan build nuclear reactors, and since it will be watched by the International Atomic Energy Agency, the deal is not going to have any problems," said Zhai Dequan, deputy secretary-general of the China Arms Control and Disarmament Association.

Zhai said the US will not pressure China too much as it previously struck a deal with India. In 2008, the NSG - which represents the 46 countries that control the world's atomic trade - made an exemption allowing Washington to sell civil nuclear technology to New Delhi. Pakistan has stressed many times it wants the same recognition as India on civil nuclear usage.

"Pakistan is also fighting a war on terror for the US as well as for itself, and the country's loss is greater than the US and the other 42 coalition nations combined. The economic aid it has received is too little compared to its loss. Pakistan has an urgent need for more civil energy and that need should be looked after," said Zhai.

The US asked China to clarify the details of the deal last Wednesday, after intense urging from India, but stopped short of publicly opposing it. On Thursday (My comment: Tuesday?) China said the reactors are for peaceful purposes, and will accept the IAEA's inspection. China joined the NSG in 2004 but has already built one reactor and started a second at Chashma, Punjab. The latest two reactors in the region will generate 650 megawatts each.

Although the deal is not likely to attract strong opposition, NSG members still do not want to see the transaction go forward, according to Mark Hibbs, nuclear policy expert at the Carnegie Endowment for International Policy in Washington. However, Hibbs said the US-India deal set a precedent.

"There was no real agreement between the members about how to proceed," the Australian Radio quoted him as saying.

Fan Jishe, a scholar of US studies at the Chinese Academy of Social Sciences, argues that the nature of the Sino-Pakistani deal is different from that of the US-India deal.

"We do not need an exemption from the NSG, as requested by the US, since the deal was reached before we joined the group," Fan said.
 
First of all, there is no waiver or deal (so to say) that Pakistan is getting. Its China who is powering ahead and supplying the 2 reactors taking the grandfathering route . That is the deal with Pakistan was signed before 2004 (before China jojined NSG) and hence it does not need to follow the NSG's non proliferation rules. Based on this no other country gets a green light to do nuclear trade with Pakistan

I never said we were getting an NSG waiver or want to partake in nuclear trade with other countries. Nuclear energy/weapon development and maintenance is an expensive task, we do not want to do partake in deals that benefit others financially. We are a developing nation that do not have the funds to undertake such expensive deals at the cost of our populace. Appeasment is not our forte, we try and get what we can from a situation.

IN case of India, its a blanket waiver that gives India the same access to Nuclear technology and trade that a NPT signatory has, without signing the NPT. It also gives a green light to every country in NSG to enter into nuclear trade with India.

Good for India, I hope these deals fast track your countries development. But the real question is at what cost.

Now I dont want to get into the debate on strategic importance of Pakistan vis a vis India. If being more important strategically mean you have to do what Pakistan is doing and go thru the turmoil that it is going thru, then I am fine with Pakistan being most important strategically to USA. Enjoy the importance :)

I must say your whole post reeks of envy and bitterness, but such is expected. Anyway, you proved once more that you people find solace whenever pkistan is undergoing difficult situations.

India is happy to be able to pay for what ever it wants in hard cash instead of giving concessions that border on breach of our sovreignity.

But we are getting way too off topic now..

I hope this project does end up like the Dhabol plant where you flushed down a lot of money just so you can appease USA.

June 2001: Enron Shuts Down Expensive Indian Plant After Afghan Pipeline Fails to Materialize
**
Enron’s power plant in Dabhol, India, is shut down. The failure of the $3 billion plant, Enron’s largest investment, contributes to Enron’s bankruptcy in December. Earlier in the year, India stopped paying its bill for the energy from the plant, because energy from the plant cost three times the usual rates. [NEW YORK TIMES, 3/20/2001] Enron had hoped to feed the plant with cheap Central Asian gas, but this hope was dashed when a gas pipeline through Afghanistan was not completed. The larger part of the plant is still only 90 percent complete when construction stops around this time. [NEW YORK TIMES, 3/20/2001] Enron executives meet with Commerce Secretary Donald L. Evans about its troubled Dabhol power plant during this year [NEW YORK TIMES, 2/21/2002] , and Vice President Cheney lobbies the leader of India’s main opposition party about the plant this month. [NEW YORK TIMES, 2/21/2002]
 
We have to live in the same world and the fact that Pakistan is a responsible nation that should volunteer NSG oversight of the usage of the nuclear tech according the same international standards meted out elsewhere in the world.

In return of course, NSG, should grant us an exemption and provide assistance in our search for civilian nuclear power.
 
any update to this project please?

its 24 june and the day is already over (could be a difference in NZ time zone - can't say)
 
any update to this project please?

its 24 june and the day is already over (could be a difference in NZ time zone - can't say)

zaki pakistan is ahead by 11 hours i think, anyways its 24 here today..most likely something will come today or how long this meeting goes..anyways we already have the contracts so i dont really see anything stopping it. Even India hasnt objected to it officially so officially they got no opposition even the US didnt object rather they wanted to get more informed

Its all the BS by indian media nothing more to it
 
zaki pakistan is ahead by 11 hours i think, anyways its 24 here today..most likely something will come today or how long this meeting goes..anyways we already have the contracts so i dont really see anything stopping it. Even India hasnt objected to it officially so officially they got no opposition even the US didnt object rather they wanted to get more informed

Its all the BS by indian media nothing more to it

I am in London Creder, its 20:51PM in London and 12:51AM (June 25) in Pakistan

and its 25th June 7:49am Friday (NZST) - Time in Wellington, New Zealand

thats why i am asking
 
its funny to see some Pakistain members visit ToI :lol:

for me even visiting that site is a time waste

Then u don't know what you are missing. It's the best source of entertainment like their news channels.:yahoo:
 
We should always do the right thing.

And when you're right, kisi ka **** bhi kuch nahi bigaar sakta :). Pakistan should keep defying blackmail and power through, assert its independence.
 
Then u don't know what you are missing. It's the best source of entertainment like their news channels.:yahoo:

hahaha :lol::lol::lol:

yeah i was great fan of bollywood-like indian news channels couple of years ago where they used to make full bollywood like story having features of heroes, villains and other important characters to add masala in the story. Later on i just fed up listening baqwas again n again and did not even turn their news channel on since past many years now.

@ topic

ab bas dua hai ke koi objection naa lag jaye aur construction work bhi jald hi start ho jaye Aameen :partay:
 

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