China downplays Japan's construction of India's first bullet train project

[Mirza Jatt]

You demand a better deal with more financing then kowtow three times to the Dragon with respect. Why should China cry, when your Prime Minister was grovelling on the floor requesting Chinese investment to flow into infrastructure projects in India. Chinese Companies have built 18,000 KM of HSR tracks domestically, therefore they are a giant in this industry as Africa and Europe will fall into there grasp. We shall see how fast the Japanese can build this project, when red tape and land acquisition is a problem in your country.

Take your dragon to some chinese polluted city... if you want the deal from India then start shoe polishing Indian Govt. with better deal or get lost.

 

[desimorty]

We secure even more than you. Your 11Billion is mostly overprice stuff or won due to the countries have bad blood with Chinese.

Source: China downplays Japan's construction of India's first bullet train project

Are you an idiot? The Japanese pretty much have monopoly on bullet trains. India wants the technology. Mind you the Japanese provided China with its first HSR. Every contractor bidding low gets a piece. You are NOT direct competition with Japan in terms of certian tech, including bullet trains. Perhaps in the future, but indians bullets trains will need to built from the BEST practice not 2nd best. Also this is China's lose, plain and simple. The Japanese are offering more, they have mastered, and pay the lowest costs for the technology, NOT manufacturing.

 

[xunzi]

Well, you have provided NOTHING to the argument beside calling on people's name, all I said was provided by "Indian" own news agency, and it is THEM who said Chinese Proposal is more expensive than the Japanese.

Now, if you have some concrete evidence saying otherwise, I am more than happy to withdraw what I said and offer my apologise for misleading, but the FACT is, you didn't.

According to PTI (The largest press network in India), Chinese lodge a bid but was beaten fair and square by the Japanese, if you have problem dealing with it, then let me quote what @Nihonjin1051 said

If you can't stand the heat, then get out of the kitchen.

How MANY TIMES do I have to tell you? The one we studied and made an offer of $20B is the Delhi-Chennai HSR Corridor. The fuking article in the OP even mentioned that! The ONE that the Japanese won is the Mumbai-Ahmedabad HSR Corridor in which we DID NOT made any offer nor ANYONE in the HSR exporter business. To give you an idea of India HSR plan. There ARE FIVE corridors:

1. Delhi-Chandigarh HSR - Feasibility study by France and would likely won the contract.

2. Delhi-Chennai HSR - Feasiblity study by China and completed with an offer of $20B to build.

3. Chennai-Bengalruru-Myscore HSR - Feasility study to raised to speed by China and would likely won by us.

4. Mumbai-Ahmedabad HSR - Feasibility study by Japan and they got the contract with NO other bidding offer, especially NOT from us. We have NOTHING to do with this corridor.

5. The Diamond Quadrilateral HSR
-Delhi-Mumbai (Plan 1) - Feasibility study by China and local India consortium
- Mumbai-Chennai (Plan 2) - Feasibility study by France and local India consortium
- Delhi-Kolkata (Plan 3) - Feasibility study by Spain and local India consortium.

Again, let the Indian speaks! if they are knowledgeable about their own country infrastructure plan and they should know full detail of what is going on. That is the hope as I said before!

 

[jhungary]

How MANY TIMES do I have to tell you? The one we studied and made an offer of $20B is the Delhi-Chennai HSR Corridor. The fuking article in the OP even mentioned that! The ONE that the Japanese won is the Mumbai-Ahmedabad HSR Corridor in which we DID NOT made any offer nor ANYONE in the HSR exporter business. To give you an idea of India HSR plan. There ARE FIVE corridors:

1. Delhi-Chandigarh HSR - Feasibility study by France and would likely won the contract.

2. Delhi-Chennai HSR - Feasiblity study by China and completed with an offer of $20B to build.

3. Chennai-Bengalruru-Myscore HSR - Feasility study to raised to speed by China and would likely won by us.

4. Mumbai-Ahmedabad HSR - Feasibility study by Japan and they got the contract with NO other bidding offer, especially NOT from us. We have NOTHING to do with this corridor.

5. The Diamond Quadrilateral HSR
-Delhi-Mumbai (Plan 1) - Feasibility study by China and local India consortium
- Mumbai-Chennai (Plan 2) - Feasibility study by France and local India consortium
- Delhi-Kolkata (Plan 3) - Feasibility study by Spain and local India consortium.

Again, let the Indian speaks! if they are knowledgeable about their own country infrastructure plan and they should know full detail of what is going on. That is the hope as I said before!

You have a problem understanding the word "Source" and "Reference" and the word "Play Nice" I can say a lot of thing, but without backing it up with facts, its BS or in court, we will call them "hearsay".

Even your fellow Chinese member here and SCMP are saying the Chinese have an offer but was beaten by the Japanese on the Mumbai-Ahmedabad Sector.

And then your claim of 20 Billions for the Delhi-Chennai 2182Km HSR is plainly crazy. Even as you said it was 50/50 and the total is brought up to 40 Billions, you honestly believe While the Japanese offer for 14.6 Billions on a 560km, which totally almost 57 Billions if they were to content with the 2182Km Delhi-Chennai HSR. While the Chinese is offering 40 Billions?? lol Chinese tech is cheap, again, are they that cheap? Just to show you, the bungled Waratah Train set (Just the set) cost 3.6 Billions AUD for it. And the Highly Contested Indonesian HSR contract (730km Jakatar-Surabaya) the Chinese have bid of 55 trillion rupiah (About 4 Billions USD) while the JICA have a bid of 65 trillion rupiah (About 5 Billions USD) and you meant to tell me the Indian HSR difference is 14 Billions?

 

[xunzi]

You have a problem understanding the word "Source" and "Reference" and the word "Play Nice" I can say a lot of thing, but without backing it up with facts, its BS or in court, we will call them "hearsay".

Even your fellow Chinese member here and SCMP are saying the Chinese have an offer but was beaten by the Japanese on the Mumbai-Ahmedabad Sector.

And then your claim of 20 Billions for the Delhi-Chennai 2182Km HSR is plainly crazy. Even as you said it was 50/50 and the total is brought up to 40 Billions, you honestly believe While the Japanese offer for 14.6 Billions on a 560km, which totally almost 57 Billions if they were to content with the 2182Km Delhi-Chennai HSR. While the Chinese is offering 40 Billions?? lol Chinese tech is cheap, again, are they that cheap? Just to show you, the bungled Waratah Train set (Just the set) cost 3.6 Billions AUD for it. And the Highly Contested Indonesian HSR contract (730km Jakatar-Surabaya) the Chinese have bid of 55 trillion rupiah (About 4 Billions USD) while the JICA have a bid of 65 trillion rupiah (About 5 Billions USD) and you meant to tell me the Indian HSR difference is 14 Billions?

Why are you continue to insist we made an offer on the Mumbai-Ahmedabad and what is the amount of that offer? They have been a lot of confusing about as what deal we offer and what deal we did not enter. I have even gave you a rundown of a list of existing Indian HSR corridors plan and their partner to study and build.

Now, let read this sentence carefully and tell me what part of comprehension (in red) don't you understand?

In addition to conducting a feasibility study to build a high speed rail track on the 2,200-km Chennai-Delhi route, an India-China consortium is also conducting a study for the 1,200-km New Delhi-Mumbai corridor.

Indian officials here told PTI that Japan had undertaken the feasibility study for the 500-km Mumbai-Ahmedabad corridor well before China entered the fray offering to do the Chennai-Delhi route that could cost over USD 20 billion.

Now go back to the list that I provided or you can go the reference list below to understand what is being discussed in the Indian HSR.

1. Delhi-Chandigarh HSR - Feasibility study by France and would likely won the contract.
French connection to speed up Delhi-Chandigarh train travel | Zee News

2. Delhi-Chennai HSR - Feasiblity study by China and completed with an offer of $20B to build.
Indian Railways team in China for Delhi-Chennai bullet train - timesofindia-economictimes

3. Chennai-Bengalruru-Myscore HSR - Feasility study to raised to speed by China and would likely won by us.
Chinese Team to Assess High-speed Rail Link Between Chennai and Mysuru -The New Indian Express

4. Mumbai-Ahmedabad HSR - Feasibility study by Japan and they got the contract with NO other bidding offer, especially NOT from us. We have NOTHING to do with this corridor.
Japanese group keen on Mumbai-Ahmedabad high speed rail project | Business Line

5. The Diamond Quadrilateral HSR
-Delhi-Mumbai (Plan 1) - Feasibility study by China and local India consortium
Chinese Firm Wins Bid for New Delhi-Mumbai Rail Study

- Mumbai-Chennai (Plan 2) - Feasibility study by France and local India consortium


- Delhi-Kolkata (Plan 3) - Feasibility study by Spain and local
Spain likely to undertake feasibility study for bullet train on Mumbai-Howrah route - timesofindia-economictimes

Here is the run down..

http://www.internationaltransportforum.org/jtrc/RoundTables/2013-High-Speed-Rail/India-Raghuram.pdf

Lastly, in the Indonesia bid, our bid WAS HIGHER than Japan but was won because we were more willing to do a business-business type deal without government budget fund and with FASTER operational time. I don't know where you get the fuk idea that our bid is lower in the Indonesia. Let the Indian and Indonesian talk about what deals we offer and such. Do you understand? LOL

 

[Rajaraja Chola]

India is only a 2.2 trillion economy and the red tape is notorious. We are happy you won. Good luck

There are still plenty of good market in Europe waiting for China to make a clean sweep in HSR. Our future export is bright

Please get out. Guess this is a shameless way of telling I am not hurt.

And go and tell CCP not to invest in India , 50 center.

humourless trolls.

 

[jhungary]

Why are you continue to insist we made an offer on the Mumbai-Ahmedabad and what is the amount of that offer? They have been a lot of confusing about as what deal we offer and what deal we did not enter. I have even gave you a rundown of a list of existing Indian HSR corridors plan and their partner to study and build.

Now, let read this sentence carefully and tell me what part of comprehension (in red) don't you understand?

In addition to conducting a feasibility study to build a high speed rail track on the 2,200-km Chennai-Delhi route, an India-China consortium is also conducting a study for the 1,200-km New Delhi-Mumbai corridor.

Indian officials here told PTI that Japan had undertaken the feasibility study for the 500-km Mumbai-Ahmedabad corridor well before China entered the fray offering to do the Chennai-Delhi route that could cost over USD 20 billion.

Now go back to the list that I provided or you can go the reference list below to understand what is being discussed in the Indian HSR.

1. Delhi-Chandigarh HSR - Feasibility study by France and would likely won the contract.
French connection to speed up Delhi-Chandigarh train travel | Zee News

2. Delhi-Chennai HSR - Feasiblity study by China and completed with an offer of $20B to build.
Indian Railways team in China for Delhi-Chennai bullet train - timesofindia-economictimes

3. Chennai-Bengalruru-Myscore HSR - Feasility study to raised to speed by China and would likely won by us.
Chinese Team to Assess High-speed Rail Link Between Chennai and Mysuru -The New Indian Express

4. Mumbai-Ahmedabad HSR - Feasibility study by Japan and they got the contract with NO other bidding offer, especially NOT from us. We have NOTHING to do with this corridor.
Japanese group keen on Mumbai-Ahmedabad high speed rail project | Business Line

5. The Diamond Quadrilateral HSR
-Delhi-Mumbai (Plan 1) - Feasibility study by China and local India consortium
Chinese Firm Wins Bid for New Delhi-Mumbai Rail Study

- Mumbai-Chennai (Plan 2) - Feasibility study by France and local India consortium


- Delhi-Kolkata (Plan 3) - Feasibility study by Spain and local
Spain likely to undertake feasibility study for bullet train on Mumbai-Howrah route - timesofindia-economictimes

Here is the run down..

http://www.internationaltransportforum.org/jtrc/RoundTables/2013-High-Speed-Rail/India-Raghuram.pdf

Lastly, in the Indonesia bid, our bid WAS HIGHER than Japan but was won because we were more willing to do a business-business type deal without government budget fund and with FASTER operational time. I don't know where you get the fuk idea that our bid is lower in the Indonesia. Let the Indian and Indonesian talk about what deals we offer and such. Do you understand? LOL

Your post said nothing.......

Again, first of all, the Thread related to Mumbai-Ahmedabad HSR is like 8 months old (March 2015), it hardly reflect anything, and even if it did not mention a Chinese bid, it does not write off a Chinese bid did happened.

And then you just quote other Project in India that China may or may not bid, I don't even know what's that for?

Well, you want to live in your dream world, then it's hardly my business, then China never bid anything in India, and so they have not "lose" anything to Japan, I mean, if you think like this would make you happy, what am I gonna say about it? My last post on this issue by the way, quote me, don't quote me, I don't really care...But I will not go further with this.

1. if your buying a car of either the bmw or the lexus and it has to be either or then you would pick which ever you like

if your getting it on hp (hire purchase) then you pick which is the best deal

2. no dont worry,i understand what your mean (sort of )


a hsr would have differant tracks to the tracks ordinary trains have. also indian tracks are mainly broad gauge which are at 1676mm. im sure extending or shrink the axels would not be a problem for either japan or china. if they can buid trains them im sure they can adjust the axel widel to accomidate the tracks.
Track gauge in India - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia




well i never knew sydney has double decked carrages. well you know more then me on this matter as i not that train savy nor do i check if a train is having problems on the opposite side of the world.


yes your right but even when it arrives in austrailia dont you think they checked and trsted the train?

ok enough on australlias train issues


well firstly let me introduce you to the saying "nothing is perfect" just how the titanic was unsinkable and then sank on its first run.

280 passengers trapped on train without heating for 6 1/2 hours ‹ Japan Today: Japan News and Discussion
well funny enough i was watchin an old episode of top gear were there wasa gtr vs public transport. and the trans are never late. and if they are late the train company writes to your employer explaing why it was their fault.

also our trains are never late , only bad weather is a factor. mind you all you need to fix our trains is a spanner and thats it. there ancient. it needs to generate enough torque to move it. so just before it move it reves like hell and vibrates badly. i just take the bus instead it, much cheaper and more of a easier ride but they do come late by about +/-10 min

2am is ok, all you need is coffee and your good. the the t-50 vs the fc-1 under the same situation i would pick the fc-1 its more reliable and more gurantied as the the t-50 has a end user linence issue. which led to the us blocking the sale of the jet to uzbekistan. the performance of both jets is near enough the same.

also you sent this message at 4pm [ish] uk time and over in austrailia its 4am ish, what are you doing at 4 in the morning? go to sleep


anyhow i will put an end on this and move on.

regards

Watching TVs...........

Well, I guess we agree to disagree..

Nice talking with you, a fresh change with the troll infested world.

 

[suresh1773]

India is only a 2.2 trillion economy and the red tape is notorious. We are happy you won. Good luck

There are still plenty of good market in Europe waiting for China to make a clean sweep in HSR. Our future export is bright

Red Tape is notorious. Are u trying to say there is less Red tape in countries like Pakistan where u r going to invest heavily(CPEC project)

 

[Blue Marlin]

s.
Watching TVs...........

Well, I guess we agree to disagree..

Nice talking with you, a fresh change with the troll infested world.

ok pal later.

but I do know one thing about the Japanese Train, it's impossible for them to break down or crash










yeah, yeah, yeah...

Killed 100+ , injuries 1000+

@Nihonjin1051

大平内閣 1978年12月
　　1980年2月20日 京阪電車置石脱線事故(負傷者104名)
　　鈴木内閣 1980年07月
　　1982年3月15日 名古屋駅構内寝台特急?紀伊?追突事故(負傷者14名)
　　中曽根内閣 1982年11月
　　1983年5月8日 東北本線踏切溝挟まれ事故(死者1名)
　　1984年5月5日 阪急六甲駅電車衝突事故(負傷者72名)
　　1984年10月19日 西明石駅寝台特急?富士?事故(負傷者24~32名)
　　1984年12月21日 上信電鉄列車正面衝突事故(死者1名,負傷者120~132名)
　　1985年7月11日 能登線急行列車脱線転落事故(死者7名,負傷者29~32名)
　　1986年3月13日 東急東横線横浜駅電車脱線事故(負傷者なし)
　　1986年12月28日 余部鉄橋列車転落事故(死者6名,負傷者6名)
　　竹下内閣 1987年11月
　　1988年3月30日 欧風気動車?????????車両火災事故(負傷者なし)
　　1988年12月5日 JR東日本?中央線東中野駅列車追突事故(死者2名,負傷者103~116名)
　　1989年4月13日 飯田線北殿駅列車正面衝突事故(負傷者138~157名)
　　宇野内閣 1989年06月
　　海部内閣 1989年08月
　　1990年8月10日 東海道新幹線架線切れ事故(負傷者なし)
　　1990年11月14日 急行陸中3号燃料切れ事故(負傷者なし)
　　1991年3月14日 広島新交通建設工事橋桁落下事故(死者14名,負傷者9名)
　　1991年5月14日 信楽高原鐵道?列車正面衝突事故(死者42名,負傷者614~627名)
　　宮沢内閣 1991年11月
　　1992年6月2日 関東鉄道?常総線取手駅列車衝突事故(死者1名,負傷者125~251名)
　　1992年9月14日 成田線???????衝突事故(死者1名,負傷者67名)
　　1992年11月3日 島原鉄道列車正面衝突事故(死者1名,負傷者72~74名)
　　細川内閣 1993年08月
　　1993年8月6日 日豊本線竜ヶ水駅土砂災害(負傷者なし)
　　1993年10月5日 大阪市交通局,??????衝突事故(負傷者215~217名)
　　1994年2月22日 特急おおぞら号脱線転覆事故(負傷者27名)
　　羽田内閣 1994年4月
　　村山内閣 1994年6月
　　1995年12月27日 JR東海?三島駅乗客転落事故(死者1名)
　　橋本内閣 1996年1月
　　1996年6月26日 JR東海?高山本線特急落石衝突事故(負傷者16~17名)
　　1997年5月6日 山陽新幹線岡山運転所列車冒進事故(負傷者なし)
　　1997年8月12日 東海道本線列車追突事故(負傷者43名)
　　1997年10月12日 中央本線大月駅列車衝突事故(負傷者62~63名)
　　1997年11月16日 JR東日本?全新幹線大幅遅延事故(負傷者なし)
　　1998年1月20日 ゆりかもめ保線作業員死亡事故(死者1名)
　　1998年6月11日 土佐くろしお鉄道?中村線列車衝突事故(負傷者38~40名)
　　小渕内閣 1998年07月
　　1999年2月21日 山手貨物線保線作業員死亡事故(死者5名)
　　1999年6月27日 山陽新幹線福岡??????????落下事故(負傷者なし)
　　2000年3月8日 営団日比谷線列車衝突事故(死者5名,負傷者63名)
　　森内閣 2000年04月
　　2000年9月11日 東海道新幹線豪雨遅延事故(負傷者なし)
　　2000年12月17日 京福電気鉄道?越前本線列車正面衝突事故(死者1名,負傷者25~26名)
　　2001年1月13日 JR東日本?宇都宮線列車連結分離事故(負傷者なし)
　　2001年1月26日 JR東日本?山手線新大久保駅???転落事故(死者3名)
　　2001年4月8日 福島交通福島駅電車車止衝突事故(負傷者2~4名)
　　2001年6月24日 京福電気鉄道?越前本線列車正面衝突事故(負傷者25名)
　　小泉内閣 2001年09月
　　2002年1月3日 名鉄新羽島駅列車車止衝突事故(負傷者なし)
　　2002年2月22日 JR九州?鹿児島本線列車追突事故(負傷者134名)
　　2002年9月26日 名古屋鉄道?名古屋本線踏切衝突脱線事故(負傷者35名)
　　2002年11月6日 JR西日本?東海道本線救急隊員死傷事故(死者1名,負傷者1名)
　　2003年2月26日 山陽新幹線岡山駅列車停止事故(負傷者なし)
　　2003年7月18日 JR九州?特急かもめ号脱線事故(負傷者33~36名)
　　2003年9月28日 JR東日本?中央線線路切替失敗事故(負傷者なし)
　　2003年10月18日 名鉄新岐阜駅電車車止衝突事故(負傷者4名))
　　2004年10月23日 上越新幹線脱線事故(負傷者なし)
　　2005年1月13日 北上線列車燃料切れ事故(負傷者なし)
　　2005年3月2日 土佐くろしお鉄道宿毛駅特急車止め衝突事故(死者1名,負傷者10名)
　　2005年4月25日 JR福知山線塚口—尼崎駅間脱線事故(死者107名,負傷者460名)

come on now..... no trolling please

 

[Rasengan]

Chinese people are known to make living through internet.. type and earn well, I give you a chance to get better business through shoe polishing those street children than just earning 50 cents.. who knows you might bag the deal from your Indian masters.. afterall you cant stop crying over losing to japan ...and guess why you are competing with japan ? to serve the Indians... now go master calling

Alibaba was successful in revolutionizing the e-commerce industry and millions of Chinese have benefited through making a living by using the internet. This is the main difference why China's economy stands at $12 trillion while India only has $2 trillion. Furthermore, Flipkart will be purchased by Alibaba in the near future and then the Indian consumers will be kowtowing to their new Chinese masters Your Prime Minister was grovelling in front of Xi Jinping requesting him to invest in India India in the next decade will need nearly 2 trillion dollars in infrastructure investment and how much you beg in front of China will determine your success rate in reaching this objective.

 

[Speeder 2]

I don't expect anything coming out of India's high speed rail dream in the next 10 years, contracts or not.

Obviously no one has ever heard about how Rafale deal panned out - "the world's largest warplane purchase"?

High speed rail requires far more infrastructure and far more complicated details than fighter jet deals.

Modi is day-dreaming, as always. Inviting the whole world to bid for the projects, then, kickbacks, years of delays and corruptions...then the new govt comes in... then the negotiation will start from the beginning , again... welcome to India!

 

[xunzi]

Your post said nothing.......

Again, first of all, the Thread related to Mumbai-Ahmedabad HSR is like 8 months old (March 2015), it hardly reflect anything, and even if it did not mention a Chinese bid, it does not write off a Chinese bid did happened.

And then you just quote other Project in India that China may or may not bid, I don't even know what's that for?

Well, you want to live in your dream world, then it's hardly my business, then China never bid anything in India, and so they have not "lose" anything to Japan, I mean, if you think like this would make you happy, what am I gonna say about it? My last post on this issue by the way, quote me, don't quote me, I don't really care...But I will not go further with this.

How can we made a bid on that Mumbai-Ahmedabad HSR when we never done a feasibility study? As you know us, we never make stupid blind bid. We are not dumb businessperson like the Vietnamese> LOL

 

[Mirza Jatt]

Alibaba was successful in revolutionizing the e-commerce industry and millions of Chinese have benefited through making a living by using the internet. This is the main difference why China's economy stands at $12 trillion while India only has $2 trillion. Furthermore, Flipkart will be purchased by Alibaba in the near future and then the Indian consumers will be kowtowing to their new Chinese masters Your Prime Minister was grovelling in front of Xi Jinping requesting him to invest in India India in the next decade will need nearly 2 trillion dollars in infrastructure investment and how much you beg in front of China will determine your success rate in reaching this objective.

what I see is you begging for a project in India meanwhile you can keep your made in china low quality predictions with yourself. Come and rant when you do get any project in India....not now .

 

[xunzi]

No one is acting like a boss, please stop this bitching and post something sensible

Check your countryman post #157.

 

[Tiqiu]

I said before and I will say it again that China should not take part in any infrastructure project in India. China should continue to focus on Africa, which is far more important and richer than India.

Yes, Africa, the poorest continent, is richer than India. In 2014,African's GDP per capita was 2200 dollars vs India's 1600, China Africa trade was 220 billion dollars vs China India trade of 70 billion. For the last 5 years alone China has invested 193 billion in 46 of 54 African countries, building roads, rails, dams etc. China Africa trade will reach 300 billion dollars in 2016.

So why will China be worried about a mere 12b HSR investment by Japan? India can cut its trade ties with China if they want because I just showed you above that India is not that important like those India think it is.