China downplays Japan's construction of India's first bullet train project

[Dungeness]

@Ryuzaki , you're right that there have been improvements in Chinese technology, provided, they have been explosed to lean , clean, processing technology and have adopted precision technology from other prolific East Asian economic powers. The benefits of hosting over 4,000 Japanese firms for the past 30 years. And Japan's comprehensive activity in China's industrial revolution in recent history.

In the process, Japanese managed to make their GDP less than half of China's. Good job, and thank you!

 

[Tiqiu]

And after 60 years of Japan's presence in India, Indian economy is one fifth of China's. Good job, and thank you.

 

[DRDO KALI 10000]

@DRDO KALI 10000

Don't be mistaken, most Chinese are frustrated by the very notion of helping India develop its infrastructure, not by loosing the contract to the Japanese. This makes perfect sense if you bring geopolitics into the equation. India and Japan both see each others the best fit for counter China, therefore there is nothing China can do to stop both counties going closer. The worst thing China does is to compete with Japan in India for building infrastructure. Africa and Pakistan are China's true strategic partner therefore China should continue to put its resources to these places. It is also make sense from business point of view, improved infrastructure means better security and lower economic operating costs, and that will in turn increase the value of other Chinese investments already in those countries, be it mining, real estate or agriculture. Chinese company does not have any ownership of such in India.


As to the Chinese made leaking train photo you posted, a simple headline can be very misleading since it gave an impression that those newly made train compartments could not stand for the heavy rain. Actually the whole story is one of the air conditioning duct caused the water leakage and the problem was rectified shortly afterwards. From Indian news coverage it was the project manager, the reliance group, not the Chinese, got the main blame. A simple watering test before commission would prevent this problem.(read leaking-metro-trains-justified-mumbaikars-angry)

"a simple headline can be very misleading since it gave an impression that those newly made train compartments could not stand for the heavy rain."
Its not misleading sir, It was the fact, Plz accept. Japanese coaches came in 2002 still working never faced any such Issue. Still its upto you take it or leave it, my side I put forward a truth.
Reliance Group to save some money purchased coaches from chinese firm instead of Japanese. This is there mistake and the blame on them. Had they purchased Japanese this incident would not have occur.

Bytheway who is responsible for Quality testing ? purchaser or manufacturer.


"most Chinese are frustrated by the very notion of helping India develop its infrastructure"
Sir, I feel you bit misunderstood. No body asking for help from you, Indian PM Invited you to invest in Indian Infrastructure. Not any Aid .
Investing means earning profit. So, its equally beneficial for both . No charity . In fact India is providing you an opportunity to earn your living-hood.

REMEMBER as the chinese economy keep slowing down and there opportunities for investment getting norrow and narrow in china, same time generating huge surpluses 100's of billion $s you will have to invest somewhere, and India is the brightest spot with highest growing GDP Not Pakistan or Africa .

And this thing your own govt. understood v well then you, this is the reason China is ready to invest in delhi - chennai corridor which needs more then 200% high investment then Mumbai - Ahmadabad but its Very unlucrative where as Mumbai - Ahmadabad is an golden egg japan is receiving. Still I afraid China looking to invest.
This itself defeats your logic.

Laptops, Lenovo; smart phones, Huawei, XiaoMi etc are made in China and they themselves are MNC. For example, Lenovo has three research and development centres in Beijing, Tokyo and Raleigh(USA); has 7 sub-companies in Europe and America, has several joint-venture business or acquisitions with IBM, Moto, NEC, Medion (Germany). In some fields, we need to refresh the views.

Lenovo, I am using its smart Phone and I can sense its quality is how much good.
These all are MNC's Yes but nowhere they are successful only in china . I give you reason, for cheap stuff yes they are good and best but when it goes for premium stuff, Tell me If you have budget of 500 $ smart phone you will buy a Chinese one or an apple phone ?

 

[Place Of Space]

"a simple headline can be very misleading since it gave an impression that those newly made train compartments could not stand for the heavy rain."
Its not misleading sir, It was the fact, Plz accept. Japanese coaches came in 2002 still working never faced any such Issue. Still its upto you take it or leave it, my side I put forward a truth.
Reliance Group to save some money purchased coaches from chinese firm instead of Japanese. This is there mistake and the blame on them. Had they purchased Japanese this incident would not have occur.

Bytheway who is responsible for Quality testing ? purchaser or manufacturer.


"most Chinese are frustrated by the very notion of helping India develop its infrastructure"
Sir, I feel you bit misunderstood. No body asking for help from you, Indian PM Invited you to invest in Indian Infrastructure. Not any Aid .
Investing means earning profit. So, its equally beneficial for both . No charity . In fact India is providing you an opportunity to earn your living-hood.

REMEMBER as the chinese economy keep slowing down and there opportunities for investment getting norrow and narrow in china, same time generating huge surpluses 100's of billion $s you will have to invest somewhere, and India is the brightest spot with highest growing GDP Not Pakistan or Africa .

And this thing your own govt. understood v well then you, this is the reason China is ready to invest in delhi - chennai corridor which needs more then 200% high investment then Mumbai - Ahmadabad but its Very unlucrative where as Mumbai - Ahmadabad is an golden egg japan is receiving. Still I afraid China looking to invest.
This itself defeats your logic.


Lenovo, I am using its smart Phone and I can sense its quality is how much good.
These all are MNC's Yes but nowhere they are successful only in china . I give you reason, for cheap stuff yes they are good and best but when it goes for premium stuff, Tell me If you have budget of 500 $ smart phone you will buy a Chinese one or an apple phone ?

What you said is actually these ambitious MNCs think about: how to be successful in international market. I think it's nature they firstly are successful in China, because this market is one of the biggest one in the world, especially in consumption fields. This is the foundation of success. They win the Antarctica market and lose Chinese market, it means 0 to them. Supposed Apple also follow the way, successful in America, then overseas.
I will choose Chinese ones. When we went to local shopping mall 10 years ago, most electronic goods were Japanese, Korean, American brands, nowadays more than half of brands are Chinese. Market decides it.

 

[rott]

Man these arrogant SOBs need to shut it good talking but save it man these SOBs adopates really just post and ignore most of their post to save time.

Posts reported. Enjoy your ban.

Take your dragon to some chinese polluted city... if you want the deal from India then start shoe polishing Indian Govt. with better deal or get lost.

And that's your come back? You sure made a lot of sense.

 

[Tiqiu]

"a simple headline can be very misleading since it gave an impression that those newly made train compartments could not stand for the heavy rain."
Its not misleading sir, It was the fact, Plz accept. Japanese coaches came in 2002 still working never faced any such Issue. Still its upto you take it or leave it, my side I put forward a truth.
Reliance Group to save some money purchased coaches from chinese firm instead of Japanese. This is there mistake and the blame on them. Had they purchased Japanese this incident would not have occur.

Bytheway who is responsible for Quality testing ? purchaser or manufacturer.


"most Chinese are frustrated by the very notion of helping India develop its infrastructure"
Sir, I feel you bit misunderstood. No body asking for help from you, Indian PM Invited you to invest in Indian Infrastructure. Not any Aid .
Investing means earning profit. So, its equally beneficial for both . No charity . In fact India is providing you an opportunity to earn your living-hood.

REMEMBER as the chinese economy keep slowing down and there opportunities for investment getting norrow and narrow in china, same time generating huge surpluses 100's of billion $s you will have to invest somewhere, and India is the brightest spot with highest growing GDP Not Pakistan or Africa .

And this thing your own govt. understood v well then you, this is the reason China is ready to invest in delhi - chennai corridor which needs more then 200% high investment then Mumbai - Ahmadabad but its Very unlucrative where as Mumbai - Ahmadabad is an golden egg japan is receiving. Still I afraid China looking to invest.
This itself defeats your logic.

You are mistaken here, I always accepted the fact that the quality of some Chinese goods are not on par to the Japan's due to many factors. I don't know how much did Reliance save by purchasing Chinese train but I would say the decision was wise and the savings were justified given there were no subsequent faulty reports since 2014 . In terms of who was responsible for testing, I think for project of this nature the contractor of the project (Reliance infrastructure) is mainly responsible, not the subcontractor(Chinese train manufacturer). That said, the Chinese company deserved some bearing of blame for not foreseeing the hash Indian monsoon environment.

I can only agree with you that India is one of the brightest sports. But compared to Africa, whose land size is nearly 20 times of yours, with almost same population (1.11 billion) and bigger GDP (2450 billion), and with abundant natural resources and arable agriculture land, India is not a must for China.

 

[rott]

Why are you continue to insist we made an offer on the Mumbai-Ahmedabad and what is the amount of that offer? They have been a lot of confusing about as what deal we offer and what deal we did not enter. I have even gave you a rundown of a list of existing Indian HSR corridors plan and their partner to study and build.

Now, let read this sentence carefully and tell me what part of comprehension (in red) don't you understand?

In addition to conducting a feasibility study to build a high speed rail track on the 2,200-km Chennai-Delhi route, an India-China consortium is also conducting a study for the 1,200-km New Delhi-Mumbai corridor.

Indian officials here told PTI that Japan had undertaken the feasibility study for the 500-km Mumbai-Ahmedabad corridor well before China entered the fray offering to do the Chennai-Delhi route that could cost over USD 20 billion.

Now go back to the list that I provided or you can go the reference list below to understand what is being discussed in the Indian HSR.

1. Delhi-Chandigarh HSR - Feasibility study by France and would likely won the contract.
French connection to speed up Delhi-Chandigarh train travel | Zee News

2. Delhi-Chennai HSR - Feasiblity study by China and completed with an offer of $20B to build.
Indian Railways team in China for Delhi-Chennai bullet train - timesofindia-economictimes

3. Chennai-Bengalruru-Myscore HSR - Feasility study to raised to speed by China and would likely won by us.
Chinese Team to Assess High-speed Rail Link Between Chennai and Mysuru -The New Indian Express

4. Mumbai-Ahmedabad HSR - Feasibility study by Japan and they got the contract with NO other bidding offer, especially NOT from us. We have NOTHING to do with this corridor.
Japanese group keen on Mumbai-Ahmedabad high speed rail project | Business Line

5. The Diamond Quadrilateral HSR
-Delhi-Mumbai (Plan 1) - Feasibility study by China and local India consortium
Chinese Firm Wins Bid for New Delhi-Mumbai Rail Study

- Mumbai-Chennai (Plan 2) - Feasibility study by France and local India consortium


- Delhi-Kolkata (Plan 3) - Feasibility study by Spain and local
Spain likely to undertake feasibility study for bullet train on Mumbai-Howrah route - timesofindia-economictimes

Here is the run down..

http://www.internationaltransportforum.org/jtrc/RoundTables/2013-High-Speed-Rail/India-Raghuram.pdf

Lastly, in the Indonesia bid, our bid WAS HIGHER than Japan but was won because we were more willing to do a business-business type deal without government budget fund and with FASTER operational time. I don't know where you get the fuk idea that our bid is lower in the Indonesia. Let the Indian and Indonesian talk about what deals we offer and such. Do you understand? LOL

Unfortunately point No. 3 didn't work out. The route between bangalore and mysore is mainly built on valleys and hills. Sharp turns along with inclines put off the deal. Simply said, it was not feasible to have high speed on Hills and valleys.

what I see is you begging for a project in India meanwhile you can keep your made in china low quality predictions with yourself. Come and rant when you do get any project in India....not now .

Does your posts comes free with "butthurt"?

 

[DRDO KALI 10000]

What you said is actually these ambitious MNCs think about: how to be successful in international market. I think it's nature they firstly are successful in China, because this market is one of the biggest one in the world, especially in consumption fields. This is the foundation of success. They win the Antarctica market and lose Chinese market, it means 0 to them. Supposed Apple also follow the way, successful in America, then overseas.
I will choose Chinese ones. When we went to local shopping mall 10 years ago, most electronic goods were Japanese, Korean, American brands, nowadays more than half of brands are Chinese. Market decides it.

Market decides yes, But not only chinese and I dont see they are getting success anywhere other then china infact Lenovo lost all the goodwill the brands (IBM. MOTO) earned before getting aquired by Lenovo, "My personal experiance Chinese do compromise with quality " this is the reason for v low brand value.

 

[Place Of Space]

Market decides yes, But not only chinese and I dont see they are getting success anywhere other then china infact Lenovo lost all the goodwill the brands (IBM. MOTO) earned before getting aquired by Lenovo, "My personal experiance Chinese do compromise with quality " this is the reason for v low brand value.

I don't know how you make the conclusion: they are only getting success in China. Take Lenovo instance still, since 2011, Lenovo sold more products(turnover volume) in overseas market than in Chinese market. You may know the difficulty situation of IBM(PC) or Moto before the acquisition.

 

[rott]

I like to correct 2 things
1. " We didn't lower our bid because why should we?"
In bidding there is no 2nd chance, Japs win due to better bidding terms THEN CHINESE as far as Indian Authority concern.

2. "The risk of India HSR investment is enormous due to red tape, indiscipline, and also lack of seriousness."
So, still, why are you trying for other even much bigger HSR contacts twice and thrice of present contact with finance ?
I hope next time you will find china also offering India financing at ~"ZERO" Rate . With no guarantee to win.

TALK LOGICALLY.


First Laptops, smart phones etc are made in china but they are manufactured by reputed MNC's with proper quality checks and no way compromise on quality.
About chinese companies, you can easily compromise on quality thats why its called allover in world CHEAP = CHINESE.

Look I have no problem with China, In fact I am very big admire of its development. And also for India-China relationship buildup, hope next project won by chinese. But I show you, your real weaknesses "Quality Compromise".
In metro Field I can give you 1 examples from India.
Chinese Coaches
'State of the art' Mumbai Metro suffers leakage due to rain in first month | Latest News & Updates at Daily News & Analysis
View attachment 279438


CORRECT !!

But some other chinese guys got frustrated by ending as looser today and giving again looser reasons why they lost . 0

India is second most ignorant nation of the world: Survey-INews - IBNLive Mobile
You are a perfect example.


About the Mumbai metro, you might want to blame it on your maintenance crew, like you've been blaming the Russians for your mig 21 crashes. First look at your unprofessional maintenance then blame the product.

 

[AugenBlick]

Japan was always gonna get the cream. Simply because japanese have a better relationship with India. Now China can get other HSR routes and this time they have an advantage because:
a)Their HSR is cheaper.
b) They know the terms Japan used to win this route and can outbid Japan.
Let us see what financial terms China offers for Delhi Chennai

 

[DRDO KALI 10000]

India is second most ignorant nation of the world: Survey-INews - IBNLive Mobile
You are a perfect example.


About the Mumbai metro, you might want to blame it on your maintenance crew, like you've been blaming the Russians for your mig 21 crashes. First look at your unprofessional maintenance then blame the product.

OK Troller

From first rain they need Maintainence Because its from Cheep country sorry Great China.
Whereas in delhi Metro (I daily travel 15 yrs old coaches) dosent need any maintenence . .... hmmmm cheap people's ?

 

[Rasengan]

Trade deficit doesnt prove your products are superior.. your products sell because they are cheap in price.. they are just use and throw and that's why you see people buying stuff in bulk.. because its cheap price . secondly China would not invest in India without any profit.. its business so both India and china are looking for profit.. so dont tell me China is investing because India asked them to.. if china will invest it will also earn profit.. so take it as a business and not any favour. so next time tell me when you win a contract in India instead of boasting now about the infrastructure project in your own country.. till then keep looking news channels for more news on Indian bills in Parliament .

Chinese manufacturing products are relatively cheap in price because its cost efficient labour ratio is extremely high, even though labour wages have consistently increased by 15% in the last 5 years. When this phenomena is connected to high productivity levels, then China has achieved an equilibrium in destroying rival competitors. Furthermore, the Indian consumer market must enjoy purchasing Chinese products, because they have no interests in buying from local vendors. India's supply chain system is atrocious since the quality and availability of infrastructure facilities is non-existent. Seriously the education system in India must be terrible, because you cannot understand simply economic theory. People normally purchase orders in bulk sizes because of economies of scale. The Indian Prime Minister specifically asked Xi Jinping to bring more investment into India and the Chinese can always diversify their capital into Africa, If the ground situation across India is dismal due to bureaucracy. China will make a profit in the procurement of different infrastructure projects across India, however they are not desperate like the Indians who require $2 trillion in the next decade. Already they have achieved deals in Indonesia, UK, United States and in the future various countries in Africa. I have been hearing this nonsense of reform for almost a year You are a naive little child waiting for the teacher to give you a lollipop. No reforms will transpire when Congress will simply block them

 

[Jlaw]

Hey, boss, about Chinese quality, I have someting to say. Chinese quality in train, rail, ships, rockets, laptops, smart phones, air-candiationers etc, are very good. I am fed up with Chinese shoes, I like to buy foreign shoes, that's ture.

You know the $200 CAD pair of Nike in Canada are made in Vietnam? I guess you mean made in Vietnam shoes is better than Chinese made

You are mistaken here, I always accepted the fact that the quality of some Chinese goods are not on par to the Japan's due to many factors. I don't know how much did Reliance save by purchasing Chinese train but I would say the decision was wise and the savings were justified given there were no subsequent faulty reports since 2014 . In terms of who was responsible for testing, I think for project of this nature the contractor of the project (Reliance infrastructure) is mainly responsible, not the subcontractor(Chinese train manufacturer). That said, the Chinese company deserved some bearing of blame for not foreseeing the hash Indian monsoon environment.

I can only agree with you that India is one of the brightest sports. But compared to Africa, whose land size is nearly 20 times of yours, with almost same population (1.11 billion) and bigger GDP (2450 billion), and with abundant natural resources and arable agriculture land, India is not a must for China.

I blame the Chinese subcontractors for not writing guidelines in layman's term for the Indians. Chinese assume the indian operators are smart enough to run and maintain trains.
The Chinese subcontractors need to babysit the Indians more next time.

 

[CHN Bamboo]

.

Market decides yes, But not only chinese and I dont see they are getting success anywhere other then china infact Lenovo lost all the goodwill the brands (IBM. MOTO) earned before getting aquired by Lenovo, "My personal experiance Chinese do compromise with quality " this is the reason for v low brand value.

I havent seen any of my classmates possess a lenovo smart phone,and many of them even dont know lenovo is Chinese brand.
Apple,Samsung,xiaomi,Huawei,Meizu,Coolpad,oppo,oneplus,vivo.etc..How much do you spend?I know lenovo can be given to Chinese when we renew phone charge...some years before..