BREAKING: PAF base Mianwali under attack, suicide bombers and heavy weapons in use

[One_Nation]

The only way this could be relevant is if boys are going in for payback, and need the "eye in the sky"....

This is not a payback. They admit they don't value their own lives which they can replace easily. Their people are not worth the petrol used in these aircraft.

If this is the only response from pak army then we are doomed.

 

[RescueRanger]

Sorry but I disagree, there are uneducated Bengali's and Urdu speaking people in Hundreds of Thousands in Karachi alone, why we are not seeing them doing the same thing? have it ever occurred to you? In Gulshan Iqbal where I live there are many slums where Bengali and Saraiki lives in tents and they work small jobs but you don't see them picking up arms against the State or blow up markets, they go to masjid for Namaz and they also believe Pakistan is not the best Islamic nation but no one is killing innocent people, this only happens by the people of Pashtoon and Baloch, if you gather all the data from the first Suicide attack in Pakistan until today you will see more than 70% done by people from Pashtoon origin and rest are Baloch, followed by Punjabis and Sindhi's. People not even talking about this Pashtoon/Baloch problem and failing to acknowledge that its not Islam or Education its the people from those two ethnic group who are the problem, until we recognize it and do something about it Pakistan will have no peace, you kill every TTP and they will form another group with another name, but people will always be the same Ethnicity Baloch/Pashtoon and that my friend is a undeniable Truth.

Nahi sir, this thought is what lead to many problems before. It is a very polarised view of the current problem in Pakistan. Wiping out TTP (yes please), Wiping out BLA (yes please). No problem there.

What you say has merit I agree, but it is only though education that you can crack the nut which forms pseudo nationalism, both Balochistan and KP are and WILL remain part of Pakistan, the Pashtun and Baloch bahi should understand and accept this fact. They should work with the federal and provincial governments to build up their mohallah's rather than just parrot the same narrative "woe us".

Similar fashion Karachi and Punjabi bahi's should lay off the "**** the Pashton/Baloch" sauce. It gets us nowhere. We tried force in SWAT, the gains while hard won were short lived. I lost an Uncle in SWAT conflict. So to me the pain is very real. I still believe education is key, but you can disagree with me. That is fine.

 

[One_Nation]

Education problem hain sir, I have worked extensively in Balochistan and KP, there is a lot of illiteracy and backwardness. Just about an hour from tribal belt you enter into DI Khan and then Bhakkar, in Bhakkar women are empowered, they are doctors, nurses, investors, educators. This was not possible 30 years ago, there were a lot of restrictions on women, Bhakkar looked like a backwater where it resembled a ghost town after 5pm.

Now it is a thriving district, with schools, shops, businesses, women in good posts, so much change.

Education is KEY.

Education in Pakistan looks more like white man's brainwashing to the backward people. They will rather go for allah jihad type of schooling.
We have to come up with indigenous education that is in the middle of jihad and white man's brainwashing.
Until then this tussle with backwardness will continue.

Even IK's education vision didn't address this issue.

 

[Goenitz]

Nahi sir, this thought is what lead to many problems before. It is a very polarised view of the current problem in Pakistan. Wiping out TTP (yes please), Wiping out BLA (yes please). No problem there.

What you say has merit I agree, but it is only though education that you can crack the nut which forms pseudo nationalism, both Balochistan and KP are and WILL remain part of Pakistan, the Pashtun and Baloch bahi should understand and accept this fact. They should work with the federal and provincial governments to build up their mohallah's rather than just parrot the same narrative "woe us".

Similar fashion Karachi and Punjabi bahi's should lay off the "**** the Pashton/Baloch" sauce. It gets us nowhere. We tried force in SWAT, the gains while hard won were short lived. I lost an Uncle in SWAT conflict. So to me the pain is very real. I still believe education is key, but you can disagree with me. That is fine.

What he is saying is true but those Pashtuns and Baloch hailed from disturbed regions who pick up arms. The same goes for street crime and robbers as any predatory species will have a free run if it doesn't get challenged.

Similarly, Pashtun living for ages in Punjab would be more civilized, docile, and political than aggressive. Like Tareen, Niazi, and Baloch in Siraiki belt, etc. Therefore, it is related to conditions.

However, you are outright that is related to education besides economy, social norms, upbringing, etc.

 

[Goritoes]

Nahi sir, this thought is what lead to many problems before. It is a very polarised view of the current problem in Pakistan. Wiping out TTP (yes please), Wiping out BLA (yes please). No problem there.

What you say has merit I agree, but it is only though education that you can crack the nut which forms pseudo nationalism, both Balochistan and KP are and WILL remain part of Pakistan, the Pashtun and Baloch bahi should understand and accept this fact. They should work with the federal and provincial governments to build up their mohallah's rather than just parrot the same narrative "woe us".

Similar fashion Karachi and Punjabi bahi's should lay off the "**** the Pashton/Baloch" sauce. It gets us nowhere. We tried force in SWAT, the gains while hard won were short lived. I lost an Uncle in SWAT conflict. So to me the pain is very real. I still believe education is key, but you can disagree with me. That is fine.

You know when you have data/History to back it up the polarized opinion becomes a FACT, as I said you can take out TTP/BLA in a night but you think this will solve the issue ? NO, we have countless small groups that joined with TTP, and now we have another Tehrike Jihad or something like that, names will keep getting changed but people who form these group will always be the same, and their motivation is not Islam or peace or Education, you think TTP will give up their arms if their kids go to school ?

You can't educate these people because they don't want to be educated, it is as simple as that. From KU to NED, any private or Govt university you go and ask students about the Baloch and Pashtoon students, they will tell you about their Gunda gardi and Badmashi and violent behavior, this is not new and still happening, go to places like Al-asif , Kati Pahari , Mango Pir aur Afghan basti, and just see how these pashoons have turned these places into pile of trash and no go areas for other Pakistani's, back in 2012 young guys who use to go Al-Asif square for Food were picked up by the Pashtoons and beaten up for just wearing Jeans and having last name which was different than theirs, one time me and my friends cars were stoned all windows broken by the Pashtoon's from Kati pahari, and one of my friend was a Pashtoon himself. You can't help these people because they don't think anything is wrong with them they think they are some God's superior race, warrior race who will just keep fighting and killing many over small disputes, you never heard in neighborhood fights in Karachi whenever a Baloch or Pashtoon family is involved, there is always guns and someone either get shot or killed.

You want to fix this issue, these people didn't even allowed Pakistan's forces in their areas until in 1990's or maybe 2000's, they never allowed outsiders to settle in their tribal lands but they moved to other people lands and than make no go areas, every city that a Pashtoon or Baloch majority population is nothing but a pile of trash or impossible to live, they bomb schools and their tribal elders supports them, their Jirga system is still a parallel system they ran when we have a Law and constitution, you can't defend these people by just saying that its education or just paranoia of Karachi wale, no... Altaf Hussain was the first leader who start talking about Taliban moving into the outskirts of Karachi and people including me used to mock him, but now everyone can see he was right about that, and all those areas I mentioned above are gone and under no Govt control, try sending rangers or even Army there and see what they will do, there are thin streets full of houses and every house is full of AK's, how I know that ? I was involved in a small Car mechanic dispute in the Kati pahari area along with my friends, and within minutes we were surrounded by 3-4 armed pashtoon's with AK's who forced my friend to pay 5 times the amount to fix his car, this is what ground reality is in every Part of Pakistan, and the people at its center are Pashtoon and Baloch.

 

[RescueRanger]

Education in Pakistan looks more like white man's brainwashing to the backward people. They will rather go for allah jihad type of schooling.
We have to come up with indigenous education that is in the middle of jihad and white man's brainwashing.
Until then this tussle with backwardness will continue.

Even IK's education vision didn't address this issue.

Yes valid point, but there must be a middle ground. The only problem with foreverwars is that they ain't forever, sooner or later, one side loses. I mean take Peshawar, compare Peshawar and its present façade (if you will) to the Peshawar of 1995, are you telling me there has been no change for the better, what about Mardan, Saidu-Shariff, Mansehra, DI Khan, Bhakkar, Quetta even, Quetta of 2005 vs Quetta now is a vastly different place. No?

Finding the middle ground is vital, education will lead the way. Bullets and bombs can only solve "so many" problems before you reach an impasse.

I worked in Afghanistan, empowering teachers:

I made some life long friends in Afghanistan, and learned about the core issues behind their hate for Pakistan, some people especially those outside Kabul were open to seeing things from the Pakistani perspective, like my good friend Jumma Gul. Jumma Gul was murdered by the Taliban because he was an interpreter for USAID, his crime? helping doctors translate and interpret material for pregnant women on maternity health.

I even trained their police force:

The man circled is (late) Colonel Saifullah of the ANP, Colonel Saifullah was killed on 24th April 2021 on the outskirts of Afghanistan trying to stop the Taliban advance.

---

I have worked extensively in Balochistan and KP, I have been lucky to speak to people from a cross-section of society here, believe me when I say, this is not an idealistic view, education really is KEY.

 

[airmarshal]

The army is fully focused on eliminating Pakistan's enemy no. 1 - Imran Khan. All its energies, all its intelligence is being used to break into people's homes, damage and destroy their property, arrest PTI workers and leaders, and then keep on registering fake FIRs to keep them in illegal custody. Once they break under state torture and leave PTI after condemning 'May 9', all 'sins' are miraculously forgiven.

When your own army is fighting war with its own people, such incidents are inevitable.

Questions should be asked why there are so many terror incidents despite army having all the resources. Army itself has claimed several times it has 'broken the back' of terrorist. Then why so many terror incidents?

Why its generals are billionaire while our soldiers are dying in soft skin vehicles in areas we know has terrorism threat?

Army is not a sacred cow and it cant hide behind shahadat of our soldiers. It must be questioned and it must be forced to answer.

 

[RescueRanger]

You know when you have data/History to back it up the polarized opinion becomes a FACT, as I said you can take out TTP/BLA in a night but you think this will solve the issue ? NO, we have countless small groups that joined with TTP, and now we have another Tehrike Jihad or something like that, names will keep getting changed but people who form these group will always be the same, and their motivation is not Islam or peace or Education, you think TTP will give up their arms if their kids go to school ?

You can't educate these people because they don't want to be educated, it is as simple as that. From KU to NED, any private or Govt university you go and ask students about the Baloch and Pashtoon students, they will tell you about their Gunda gardi and Badmashi and violent behavior, this is not new and still happening, go to places like Al-asif , Kati Pahari , Mango Pir aur Afghan basti, and just see how these pashoons have turned these places into pile of trash and no go areas for other Pakistani's, back in 2012 young guys who use to go Al-Asif square for Food were picked up by the Pashtoons and beaten up for just wearing Jeans and having last name which was different than theirs, one time me and my friends cars were stoned all windows broken by the Pashtoon's from Kati pahari, and one of my friend was a Pashtoon himself. You can't help these people because they don't think anything is wrong with them they think they are some God's superior race, warrior race who will just keep fighting and killing many over small disputes, you never heard in neighborhood fights in Karachi whenever a Baloch or Pashtoon family is involved, there is always guns and someone either get shot or killed.

You want to fix this issue, these people didn't even allowed Pakistan's forces in their areas until in 1990's or maybe 2000's, they never allowed outsiders to settle in their tribal lands but they moved to other people lands and than make no go areas, every city that a Pashtoon or Baloch majority population is nothing but a pile of trash or impossible to live, they bomb schools and their tribal elders supports them, their Jirga system is still a parallel system they ran when we have a Law and constitution, you can't defend these people by just saying that its education or just paranoia of Karachi wale, no... Altaf Hussain was the first leader who start talking about Taliban moving into the outskirts of Karachi and people including me used to mock him, but now everyone can see he was right about that, and all those areas I mentioned above are gone and under no Govt control, try sending rangers or even Army there and see what they will do, there are thin streets full of houses and every house is full of AK's, how I know that ? I was involved in a small Car mechanic dispute in the Kati pahari area along with my friends, and within minutes we were surrounded by 3-4 armed pashtoon's with AK's who forced my friend to pay 5 times the amount to fix his car, this is what ground reality is in every Part of Pakistan, and the people at its center are Pashtoon and Baloch.

Like i said sir you are welcome to your opinion, but a middle ground must be found.

 

[airmarshal]

How is PAF base security not their job?

It is a failure of the local security set-up surrounding the base

Also need to identify the origins and motives of the attackers, since I doubt they were really locals


Military bases were attacked in the past before too so it's not the first time

The most famous attack took out billions of dollars of latest Swedish equipment, Erieye AEWAC

The question is why such incidents keep taking place? What is the purpose of intellignece agency if it cant stop similar incidents, conducted in the same manner over and over again?

 

[RescueRanger]

Why its generals are billionaire while our soldiers are dying in soft skin vehicles in areas we know has terrorism threat?

Army is not a sacred cow and it cant hide behind shahadat of our soldiers. It must be questioned and it must be forced to answer.

Valid question and criticism and one that has been echoed by many.

 

[Goenitz]

Valid question and criticism and one that has been echoed by many.

so how did the Col get martyred? in IBO or ambush? Was he leading? as Col is a unit commander?

 

[manpk77]

What he is saying is true but those Pashtuns and Baloch hailed from disturbed regions who pick up arms. The same goes for street crime and robbers as any predatory species will have a free run if it doesn't get challenged.

Similarly, Pashtun living for ages in Punjab would be more civilized, docile, and political than aggressive. Like Tareen, Niazi, and Baloch in Siraiki belt, etc. Therefore, it is related to conditions.

Why did Bengalis pick up arms, they were more prosperous, civilized than whole west Pakistan without any disturbance in their cities?

You have no idea that the statecraft is very complex and slippery ball to handle. Especially for an Islamic nation with multiple regions and languages, working under military rule.

Now, some regions in current Pakistan is going the Dhaka way. And the things are heating up badly.

 

[One_Nation]

The army is fully focused on eliminating Pakistan's enemy no. 1 - Imran Khan. All its energies, all its intelligence is being used to break into people's homes, damage and destroy their property, arrest PTI workers and leaders, and then keep on registering fake FIRs to keep them in illegal custody. Once they break under state torture and leave PTI after condemning 'May 9', all 'sins' are miraculously forgiven.

What makes it bad for the army is that the system they are attacking is designed to bring them more strength against issues like these.
With a robust political and judicial system, more people will be engaging with it to look for solutions to their problems which will lead to less anarchy and less attacks like these, less recruits for masterminds.

There is no one in army who can think about how they are harming themselves.

This army is completely hacked and looks clueless about their own dilemma.

 

[RescueRanger]

so how did the Col get martyred? in IBO or ambush? Was he leading? as Col is a unit commander?

As per official sources he was leading his troops in an IBO. There is mention of an ambush but that is rumour mill not confirmed by anyone worthy of mention.

 

[airmarshal]

What makes it bad for the army is that the system they are attacking is designed to bring them more strength against issues like these.
With a robust political and judicial system, more people will be engaging with it to look for solutions to their problems which will lead to less anarchy and less attacks like these, less recruits for masterminds.

There is no one in army who can think about how they are harming themselves.

This army is completely hacked and looks clueless about their own dilemma.

A strong political system is army's natural ally. But khakis are such duffers, they keep going after popular leader whenever one emerges. They have this colonial hubris and it can traced to the PMA culture which is modelled on Sandhurst. This is how they are trained to believe they are somehow superior.