BJP opposes Muslim reservation in jobs: Joshi

[cybertron]

are nahi. not all.
people of haryana are very good, since im a haryanvi myself, i can tell u people would do anything to help a needy.
but the point is according to some people casteism is not a bad thing, it is something in their deep pysche that they think discriminating the lower caste is a good thing.
i belong to SC myself thts y im telling u this.

yes theres has been a real turnaround in the thinking of the people, but the real problem is that of the educational standards.

we dont have enough schools n colleges, those feew good ones that we have, are not affordable for poor ones.

im all for putting an end to reservation.

sorry for late replying. was out for lunch.

i acknowledge what u said
but dont u agree that it is easier for SC, ST's to rise above the ranks if the income limit is lowered. say 50,000rs
This would provide an opportunity for the govt to provide real support to the people who are actually in need of it whether it be free education(a real one) or a considerable economic support.

 

[somebozo]

Jobs should be given at merit..not reservation..however in highly communal India rising and shining that is very unlikely! and speaking about reservations is a living proof of that.. Jinnah's two nation theory did not fail yet!

 

[MINK]

exactly.

i have seen lots of people from upper caste(?) carrying SC ST certificates and even managing to get jobs that are reserved for SC STs

So the moral of the story that this stupid & corrupt politicians who have millions of dollar in swiss banks are trying to divert our attention from main issue. Doing every single thing to fill their vote banks!

 

[metro]

i acknowledge what u said
but dont u agree that it is easier for SC, ST's to rise above the ranks if the income limit is lowered. say 50,000rs
This would provide an opportunity for the govt to provide real support to the people who are actually in need of it whether it be free education(a real one) or a considerable economic support.

no. like i said before i want reservation to end once and for all.
becoz the reason for their implementation is not being met.

for example, if there are 1000 SCs in a village, then how many of them can manage to get a govt. job with reservation- hardly 2 or 3 ? no ?

but if we can give world class education to all 1000 of them, then they all can get jobs and improve their living.
same can be said about the general category.
also, once people can get good education, caste ism would automatically die its own death.

 

[KS]

We are talking about West Bengal muslim community here. Its not an assumption, its facts as was shown by Sachar committee report.
The same report that showed Gujarati muslims faring much better.

In West Bengal 30% of the population is Muslim and less than 5% is in govt. jobs. That is gross mis-representation by all accounts and the part of the consition that I quoted gives the govt. the right to correct this imbalance. Once the imbalance is corrected it can be removed.

There is lot of propaganda on what this is about. Like you said, reservations should be on economic basis.
This reservation IS on economic basis. Unlike SC/ST reservations which are still not on economic basis.

So this is actually an improvement over previous systems.

Again it is still an assumption on the part of you that Muslims , even in WB were discriminated from being given govt. jobs by the other communities.

The SC/ST were explicitly discriminated against and they are documented. In the case of the Muslims , in WB ??

They lagged behind because of their very late adoption of education which the other communities had adopted much earlier.

So if any reservation is give, let it be given in educational institutions where the Muslims can study and let them compete to the jobs like others.

I oppose reservation being given directly in jobs, just because someone is a Muslim.

Can you please explain what minority appeasment is being done here?

As mentioned by the Sachar report, despite being 30% in population their representation in govt. is woefully low. The creamy layer or those who families who have household income of more that 4lakh Rs annually are excluded. And only OBC groups are notified exclusing the "upper class" Muslim groups like Syed, Pathans, Mughals e.t.c

So as per the constition, the state government is within its right to correct the imbalance and improve the status of backward communities just as it has done for SC/ST communities for the last60 years. And by mainstreaming the backward communities, the govt. creates a sense of belonging and patriotism among these communities.

Is this NOT minority appeasement for the sake of votes ?? Where did this suddden love of Muslims come from ?? All these 25 years they ruled Bengal but now when the election comes and signals are explicitly anti-Left they come with this.

It is no communities fault that Muslims despite being 30 % lag behind in representation in Govt jobs.

They missed the 'education' train and just now recently have started boarding it.Let them study and let them compete with others for the jobs.

 

[KS]

do you mean BJP by right wing groups or RSS,

karthic plz do understand that neither of these above mentioned groups has an affinity for cast or religion based reservations.
if their is a case for reservations for muslims, they have the right for it as their counterparts with the same socio-economic conditions are given favours.

No you cannot compare the reservation given to SC/ST with the proposed reservation to Muslims.

SC/ST were explicitly discriminated against by the higher castes. In the past they were prevented from getting even basic education which hurt their chances of jobs.

But is there any such thing happening where other communities prevent Muslims from attending schools or such ??

I have personally seen many Muslim parents not sending their children to good schools because they happened to be convent schools where you had to sing "praise of Christ" every morning in prayer and they dont allow hijab or it will be run by a Hindu trust where you had to sing "Saraswathi Vandana" . While the other communities don't mind it as long as their child get a decent education, they think it goes against their religion.

So what is the moral ground for demanding such a reservation -- that too directly in jobs ?

 

[ajtr]

muslims are not called to interviews due to their religion.There is a hidden bias against muslims in india.their applications are rejected just by seeing muslim names on the resume.muslims must get reservation proportional to their population ie 30% divided equally for 15% for muslim men and 15% for muslim females.

Above all this Christian must get 8% reservation by following same formula....that way it will force govt,corporates to hire muslims and christians.

 

[cybertron]

Again it is still an assumption on the part of you that Muslims , even in WB were discriminated from being given govt. jobs by the other communities.

cud have had a better choice of words dr

The SC/ST were explicitly discriminated against and they are documented.

what if yes.
what gives them the right to reservations in this day and age where are poor people in every walk of life and from every community. Is it a repayment in a sense.

They lagged behind because of their very late adoption of education which the other communities had adopted much earlier.

and you are saying that sc st's should be given reservations today because they wer once discriminated. It shouldnt be the reason which led to the backwardness that is to be stressed on but the way forward which can remove poverty from every sect.

I oppose reservation being given directly in jobs, just because someone is a Muslim.

what is your point in support of job reservations for SC ST's in this day nd age????

 

[Agnostic_Indian]

after-all tell me ,what is the purpose of reservations?? it is to bring the socialy challenged people to the forefront of the society and it would be unjust on rest of the challenged people if a particular sect is selected for the favours or reservations. It is the govts responsibility to help those people whatever their number may be and if the number is very large to handle then let the govt brng down the economic limits.
Lets say every family with an income less than 50000 rs per year gets reservations. what do u say??


but how do u catogorise large chunk of ST people living urban areas as adivasi's with minimum opportunity??

yes such a system can be good but may be a two- three layered system(based economical and social backwardness ) with greater care and privilege for worst level can address the problem more effectively.
but how do we recognise socially backward.. i guess there is no other way but recognise the sc and st..or is there a better way?

 

[ajtr]

Same 39% reservation for muslims and 8% reservation for chritians must be followed in reserving legislature seats for them in parliament,states assembly, municipal corporations,gram panchayat elections.And even in UPSC,IITs and IIMs.

 

[metro]

muslims are not called to interviews due to their religion.There is a hidden bias against muslims in india.their applications are rejected just by seeing muslim names on the resume.muslims must get reservation proportional to their population ie 30% divided equally for 15% for muslim men and 15% for muslim females.

Above all this Christian must get 8% reservation by following same formula....that way it will force govt,corporates to hire muslims and christians.

30 % for muslims.
8% for christians
20% for sikhs
20% for buddhists
20%for jains

 

[Bang Galore]

No you cannot compare the reservation given to SC/ST with the proposed reservation to Muslims.

SC/ST were explicitly discriminated against by the higher castes. In the past they were prevented from getting even basic education which hurt their chances of jobs.

The correct comparison would be with OBC's. W.r.t. your point on SC/ST's, isn't it a real irony that the SC/ST's & their oppressors, the OBC's both get the benefit of reservation?

 

[cybertron]

SC/ST were explicitly discriminated against by the higher castes. In the past they were prevented from getting even basic education which hurt their chances of jobs.

yes that's the point
some people were once discriminated
so is it a kind of repayment to the current generation.
if yes i see it grossly undemocratic.

 

[cybertron]

GUYS PLZ AVOID THE SUCKR ajtr

 

[somebozo]

Job affairs in india..this is from todays news paper!

By ASSOCIATED PRESS

Published: Feb 2, 2011 11:35 Updated: Feb 2, 2011 11:35

They had been among about 200,000 people who had attempted to apply for just 461 jobs being offered by an Indian paramilitary force.

The unexpected turnout forced the Indo-Tibetan Border Force to postpone the recruitment Tuesday in Bareilly, a town about 115 miles (180 kilometers) southwest of Lucknow, the capital of Uttar Pradesh state.

Infuriated by the decision, the job seekers burned five buses and a gas station during street protests in the town, said Brij Lal, a senior police officer.

They later crammed into trains to return home, and those who could not get into the coaches climbed onto the roofs, Lal told The Associated Press.

Fourteen were killed on the spot when they were hit by the overhead bridge and fell to the ground, while four others died overnight in a hospital, Lal said. Nine others remained hospitalized, he said.

Accidents are common on India’s sprawling rail network, one of the world’s largest. Most are blamed on poor maintenance and human error.