Beautiful Response to a Statement "Islam is not Peaceful"

[RangerPK]

When someone attacks you on an emotional bases or invokes emotions in you through his attacks the trick is to not get emotional. Only then will you comprehensively and systematically rip their strategy apart.

Emotions are irrelevant to what I am talking about. I am saying if Europeans are trying to form a narrative for Muslims, then the Muslims are coming up with a counter narrative. It is a battle of narratives, ideas, information. Etc. if we let the opponent have a free hand in the battle field then they would win., so it makes sense to at a least defend and show resistance, or better be offensive yourself.


PS: by offensive, I mean in tactical sense.

 

[krash]

I beg to disagree.

Christianity got smart and adjusted its role when it saw the wave of freedom and enlightenment sweeping through Western Europe. When the intellectuals pushed it out of the governments it didn't launch its version of Talib@stards and Hizbullah-cesspoolla.

That has allowed the Christian countries to become free from Popes, Ayatullahs, and Mullahs and thus progress and prosper by leaps and bounds.

Some small groups in Christianity still behave as anti-science and anti-freedom just like their medieval days, but luckily they get routed in the courts and by government laws.

This is historically incorrect. For hundreds of years the Church forcefully, ruthlessly and systematically, working as a whole, tried to, not just oppose but annihilate the "freedom and enlightenment". I'd refer you to the history of the Spanish Inquisitions and the executions of hundreds of scientists, philosophers and theologians. The life of Galileo would present a good reference point. It was only when the people of the west realized the objective truths in science, the Church's incompatibility with science and had been amply disdained by the Church's actions that they threw it out of their political and, to a large extent, social spheres. The Church since then has been in damage control. It has only been a few decades since the Church has begun to, some what, embrace science.

On the other side of the religious spectrum, our religion allows, nay, encourages scientific, philosophical and academic research and endeavors (A cursory glance at the ancient journals written by European travelers coming to Muslim lands will be a good reference). And yet we are so stupendously moronic that we try to pit science against it and vice versa. Thankfully, at least till now, the Muslims haven't systematically gone after science.

Emotions are irrelevant to what I am talking about. I am saying if Europeans are trying to form a narrative for Muslims, then the Muslims are coming up with a counter narrative. It is a battle of narratives, ideas, information. Etc. if we let the opponent have a free hand in the battle field then they would win., so it makes sense to at a least defend and show resistance, or better be offensive yourself.


PS: by offensive, I mean in tactical sense.

Of course, as is our right and responsibility.

 

[That Guy]

I don't always agree with Mehdi Hassan, but he's a brilliant man and deserves respect.

 

[FaujHistorian]

This is historically incorrect. For hundreds of years the Church forcefully, ruthlessly and systematically, working as a whole, tried to, not just oppose but annihilate the "freedom and enlightenment"..

Oh brother.


If you read my post. I have already mentioned the anti-enlightenment disease that afflicted the church during medieval times.

Christian kingdoms suffered mightily a the hand of their Ayatuallah and Mullahs aka Popes.

then they threw their Ayatullahs out.

And tried to make their church free of politics and government for the last many many centuries.

On the other hand

in 2013 Islamism is still stuck with the same disease as that of medievval christian kingdoms.

Our Mullahs, the babas, the ayatullahs have not been thrown out of the government.

Our mosques have yet to be cleansed from the 2-bit politicians aka Mullah diesel and Ayatullahs

Our mosques are still the cesspool of politics and militancy and inquisition $hit that is not too different from the medieval christian times.


I hope you understand now.


peace

 

[FaujHistorian]

Emotions are irrelevant to what I am talking about. I am saying if Europeans are trying to form a narrative for Muslims,...

I beg to differ bhai,

Europeans know their history,

they hate medieval Christianity and the associated barbarity.

Now the same Medieval practices of Christianity are being aped by Islamists.

And Europeans are simply pointing the fact out.


It is time we listened instead of creating phony debates.

It is in the Muslim's interest to quit living like Medieval Christians.

It is in the interest of Muslims to accept enlightenment, and get rid of the chokehold of Ayatullahs, Mullahs, and their chor bazari.


peace to you.

 

[Marshmallow]

That's fair.

men live for debates.

Aren't we all on PDF doing the same?

However if you have to debate, then be intelligent enough to define the topic, and the CONTEXT beforehand.

If you do not, then you will look like a fool.

nothing personal bhai.






peace to you.

May you live long and prosper

May you have great spiritual experience during this holy month.

Amen

u r takin it to a wrong way....i dint see anything wrong in da debate dat u seem to have serious prob wid...

sorry i'm not seeking an argument and i'm not trying to convince anything to anyone , the debate is there for u to see and judge ! agar kisi nai convince hona hai to vo video dekh kar ho jai ga , vo kehatai hai na : akalmand k liay ishaara hi kaffi hota hai

whoaaa sucha dry responce

nobudy n niethr me was forcin u bro...i just said since u kno abt da debate more n hav shared it so u shud defend it...dats it!

 

[notsuperstitious]

It goes both ways.. because non-Muslims have an obsession with Qasim.. and not Nizamuddin Auliya.

Not true. I'm not religious but I and my family have visited Nizamuddin shrine and lots of non muslims do,but popular belief here tells me that's not even Islam.

May be the ball indeed is in your court?

 

[RangerPK]

By the way does anyone know if this guy is an Atab or Pakistani? By his name he sounds Pakistani... "Mahdi" "Hassan"

 

[Kompromat]

Not true. I'm not religious but I and my family have visited Nizamuddin shrine and lots of non muslims do,but popular belief here tells me that's not even Islam.

May be the ball indeed is in your court?

We can only have a talk on this, if you answer that bit first.

*Do "you" think that is Islam? [Popular belief varies between person to person]

 

[notsuperstitious]

We can only have a talk on this, if you answer that bit first.

*Do "you" think that is Islam? [Popular belief varies between person to person]

You have to ask that to Oscar who brought up Nizamuddin, saying that non muslims do not remember him.

To a non muslim like me, nizamuddin and qasim both are important muslim personalities brought up, revered and remembered by many muslims in a religious context, hence relevant while discussing popular beliefs, attitudes and history.

 

[Kompromat]

You have to ask that to Oscar who brought up Nizamuddin, saying that non muslims do not remember him.

To a non muslim like me, nizamuddin and qasim both are important muslim personalities brought up, revered and remembered by many muslims in a religious context, hence relevant while discussing popular beliefs, attitudes and history.

I believe what Oscar has said is that what Nizamuddin Aulya represents [Sufi Islam] is ignored by non Muslims of this region even though they form the largest majority of Muslims in the region & the focus tends to go towards Muhammad Bin Qasim [General], even though he never ruled the parts of modern day Pakistan and left a short bright legacy of fair treatment,rules of engagement and respect for local culture.

 

[notsuperstitious]

I believe what Oscar has said is that what Nizamuddin Aulya represents [Sufi Islam] is ignored by non Muslims of this region even though they form the largest majority of Muslims in the region & the focus tend to go towards Muhammad Bin Qasim [General].

I understood him and I said that is not true, non muslims revere and visit Nizamuddin all the time, but its the muslims who remind us of qasim with a cooked up account of history written by victors that shows our forefathers in a bad light.

Since we are discussing modern popular beliefs, then its the muslims again who tell us non muslims that nizamuddin is NOT islam.

 

[Kompromat]

I understood him and I said that is not true, non muslims revere and visit Nizamuddin all the time, but its the muslims who remind us of qasim with a cooked up account of history written by victors that shows our forefathers in a bad light.

Since we are discussing modern popular beliefs, then its the muslims again who tell us non muslims that nizamuddin is NOT islam.

I will not go into individual opinions into what everyone has to say about the Hindu civilization and the Muslim influx. I personally take pride in the ancient history of India.

For Kasim, the young man left a lasting legacy during his short life. He is known as the "Sun of Indus", and a local cliche' attached to him in Multan, describes his departure only later to be murdered by the corrupt caliph as "The sun of Indus,set at the half mask",meaning that when he was summoned back and killed, he was surrounded by the people of Indus. He was known for his fair treatment, though his life was short.

He said "The temples,shall be inviolate,just like the churches of the Christains,the synagogues of the Jews and the altars of the Magians"

As for the cooked up version of history, i guess you should read. "Mediaeval India Under Mohammedan Rule Ad 712 to 1764" By Stanley Lane Poole.

 

[Cherokee]

There was "Algebra" , even before Islam took birth .

 

[Kompromat]

There was "Algebra" , even before Islam took birth .

So, was zero, calculus and what not. Matter of fact "inventions" cannot be associated to a certain culture as that culture might have had it from someone else. Muslim advances in mathematics was the success of their "integration of ideas" into workable calculations and formulas,which helped form modern algorithms,calculus,algebra as well as other scientific fields,they were taken from India,Greece,Romans,Spain,China and other parts of the world. I suggest you read Ibn Batuta's writings.