Bangladesh Air Force delivery

[Neo]

Sir,

Are we flying these 'new' jets or are they meant for 'canabalisation' for spares?

 

[falcone]

Originally posted by blain2:

No the integration circuitry was provided by the Chinese as part of Pakistani upgrades to the aircraft. The same happened on F-7s and F-6s. Pakistani innovations on the F-6 and later on adopted on the A-5 have been the extention of range by integrating the center line fuel tank on the belly now known as "Gondola" tank.

Thanks! :army:

 

[falcone]

Sir,

Are these the ones that Pakistan bought from Lebanon and Libya?

 

[Muradk]

Sir,

Are these the ones that Pakistan bought from Lebanon and Libya?

Yes.
I completly understand when a plane goes down every one is worried why is it happning. If you see 2 mirages went down because of bird hit , Now I have see on some forum people are saying ( BIRD HIT ) easy way out but it is true.
when these bases were establishes there were no one close to the base for miles , Getting out of Masroor we used to drive atleast 30 min before we used to see people , same with shorkot not a person for miles but now they are in the middle of towns which are growing so fast , one reason civilians want to stay close to bases for security purposes in Karachi and the more and more people are comming closer to the base and hence more trash.

 

[pilot_dude]

PAF has about 180 mirages, 150 F7, 40 A-5 and 34 F-16. total = 420+
We should maintain that number as the aircraft density is much greater in pakistan than India. the higher the numbers the higher the maintainence cost will be.

sorry bro i cant agree completely with u there. yes the maintanence cost will be more but like the indian dude said....indian jets will be flooding our air space. we need minimum 500....india has around 750....

 

[Owais]

sorry bro i cant agree completely with u there. yes the maintanence cost will be more but like the indian dude said....indian jets will be flooding our air space. we need minimum 500....india has around 750....

we cannot place a figher against every IAF fighter because we have small economy. If we start buying weapons like india, we will be bankrupt soon!
all we have to focus is on quality instead of huge quantity.

 

[Contrarian]

all we have to focus is on quality instead of huge quantity.

But even now and even the near future plans, PAF will not have quality either. IAF will maintain the qualitative lead as well. This is in terms of the superiority of air platforms wrt Pakistani air assets.

 

[Keysersoze]

But even now and even the near future plans, PAF will not have quality either. IAF will maintain the qualitative lead as well. This is in terms of the superiority of air platforms wrt Pakistani air assets.

Malay you know it geniunely amuses me the passion with which you believe these things.

I have read a few things about some of the "Superior" systems that we have discussed in other threads and it puzzles me as to where the great superiority is?

Lets look at the big name platforms for both forces
F-16 BLk52 and SU-30MKI
The BVR missiles have been touted (r77 and Aim120) as being an example of this. The distance between the two is a lot smaller then most think (approx 100km for the C series). And the 120 has been used in combat. To be honest I would opt for the American missile everytime.
Radar. The N011M BARS or the AN/APG68 (v)9 well since the RCS of both aircraft are as follows F-16=1.2M^2 and the MKI= 10M^2. The F-16 will see the MKI at around 125km and the MKI would see the F-16 at approx 140km there are also going to be AN/ALQ-184 or AN/ALQ-131 jamming pods which would reduce the range for the MKI.

So basically using the two examples above I don't know where you get Qualitative from? Why the purchase of the mk2005 from Qatar if there was such a qualitative difference?

Bear in mind please that there are smart cookies on both side of the border....The Pak airforce isn't run by idiots and they will buy what they need in order to remain a viable force against the main potential opponent.

 

[pilot_dude]

Malay you know it geniunely amuses me the passion with which you believe these things.

I have read a few things about some of the "Superior" systems that we have discussed in other threads and it puzzles me as to where the great superiority is?

Lets look at the big name platforms for both forces
F-16 BLk52 and SU-30MKI
The BVR missiles have been touted (r77 and Aim120) as being an example of this. The distance between the two is a lot smaller then most think (approx 100km for the C series). And the 120 has been used in combat. To be honest I would opt for the American missile everytime.
Radar. The N011M BARS or the AN/APG68 (v)9 well since the RCS of both aircraft are as follows F-16=1.2M^2 and the MKI= 10M^2. The F-16 will see the MKI at around 125km and the MKI would see the F-16 at approx 140km there are also going to be AN/ALQ-184 or AN/ALQ-131 jamming pods which would reduce the range for the MKI.

So basically using the two examples above I don't know where you get Qualitative from? Why the purchase of the mk2005 from Qatar if there was such a qualitative difference?

Bear in mind please that there are smart cookies on both side of the border....The Pak airforce isn't run by idiots and they will buy what they need in order to remain a viable force against the main potential opponent.

tyvm there keyseroze, u see ia m still a rookie at this military stuff so i would have never been able to reply to mishra's posts as good as you have! ty.

But not every f16 we have is block 50+ u know......IAF is gonna be retiring ALOT of mig 21s soon....so that should bring em down abit!


But really...india is getting 5th gen aircraft.....:wall:

 

[Keysersoze]

tyvm there keyseroze, u see ia m still a rookie at this military stuff so i would have never been able to reply to mishra's posts as good as you have! ty.

But not every f16 we have is block 50+ u know......IAF is gonna be retiring ALOT of mig 21s soon....so that should bring em down abit!


But really...india is getting 5th gen aircraft.....:wall:

The ones that are not blk 52 will be getting the MLU treatment. SO they will have the ECM and radars.

And worry about 5th gen when you see one flying in IAF colours.(as the saying goes.....many a slip, twixt cup and a lip) I am quite sure that there are plans several years in advance for aircraft procurement for the PAF. Plus you forget that there will another advanced aircraft that will be procured soon. I would suggest you stop worrying so much....you'll get an ulcer.....

 

[pilot_dude]

LOL ulcer!

jxx is still decades off man.

 

[Owais]

F-16 BLk52 and SU-30MKI
The BVR missiles have been touted (r77 and Aim120) as being an example of this. The distance between the two is a lot smaller then most think (approx 100km for the C series). And the 120 has been used in combat. To be honest I would opt for the American missile everytime.
Radar. The N011M BARS or the AN/APG68 (v)9 well since the RCS of both aircraft are as follows F-16=1.2M^2 and the MKI= 10M^2. The F-16 will see the MKI at around 125km and the MKI would see the F-16 at approx 140km there are also going to be AN/ALQ-184 or AN/ALQ-131 jamming pods which would reduce the range for the MKI.

.

I m agree with you mate!
MKI only have the advantage ot TVC in close combat over F-16 but in BVR combat, it will be a tough fight. can you tell me the RCS of JF-17??

 

[Contrarian]

Malay you know it geniunely amuses me the passion with which you believe these things.

thankyou i guess

Lets look at the big name platforms for both forces
F-16 BLk52 and SU-30MKI
The BVR missiles have been touted (r77 and Aim120) as being an example of this. The distance between the two is a lot smaller then most think (approx 100km for the C series). And the 120 has been used in combat. To be honest I would opt for the American missile everytime.
Radar. The N011M BARS or the AN/APG68 (v)9 well since the RCS of both aircraft are as follows F-16=1.2M^2 and the MKI= 10M^2. The F-16 will see the MKI at around 125km and the MKI would see the F-16 at approx 140km there are also going to be AN/ALQ-184 or AN/ALQ-131 jamming pods which would reduce the range for the MKI.

You tell me where did you come across the RCS of an F-16. I believe the RCS of Rafale is around 1 m2, im not sure, but that is what i read. Is F-16's design of the same stealth level as Rafale??

And BTW, you have read the articles on IAF wanting to get even higher level AMRAAAMS, like Meteor, with Russia already on its course for the new R-77 and its ramjet powered missile along with it too when PAF will get AIM-120 C-5. Wait barely 5 years to see the results.the New R-77 would be out but the ramjet one would take time.

The MKI would have jamming pods too bro, and its a heavy plane, can carry more equipment more pods, etc, etc and i am guessing in the future it would be the Mayawi pod, which is being developed by Isarel and India, Israel to equip its JSF, and India intended to use it in the LCA. You tell me if that would not be superior to AN/ALQ 131/184.

You also forget the Mini-AWACS aspectof the MKI. One plane can use its radar, while others can use that planes radar to fire missiles and they would remain undetected. You also have the question of WVR fights, though MKI wins on that count.

Also keep in mind, that PAF does not yet have blk 52's, its going to get them soon, but MKI has been in service for a long time, infact in its next MLU, it will further evolve, its MLU so to speak. With Irbis radar, new R-77, etc, etc, you would notice, that there's that lingering difference thrown wide ope. You are comparnig what PAF is going to get with what IAF has now and has had for a while, when IAF too is planning an upgrade to its MKI's.

So basically using the two examples above I don't know where you get Qualitative from? Why the purchase of the mk2005 from Qatar if there was such a qualitative difference?

If you hav eone good plane, does that mean you will never buy another different kind of plane, till the first one is old? We already had Mirage 2000, they got upgraded to Mirage 2005/9(I think its the best standard) and some more were bought to complement the numbers since IAF loves its Mirage's. Its just shoring up the numbers of the type we already have, what is your point here?

Bear in mind please that there are smart cookies on both side of the border....The Pak airforce isn't run by idiots and they will buy what they need in order to remain a viable force against the main potential opponent.

Certainly not, but do tell me, when i say qualitative difference, i say that for every plane PAF has, IAF has another plane, be that of the same segment, but ALWAYS ATLEAST slightly superior.
Do you wish to say that F-16 blk 52 a Medium MRCA is an eye for an eye match for the Su-30MKI a Heavy-MRCA??

Pak airforce is a very good airforce, and run by very professional men, BUT they are not given the money to buy what they want. Im sure the COAS wants Typhoon, but the government there wont let him. PAF is an excellent airforce because it makes BEST use of what its GOT. Do you get me? There is a huge difference. But the Pakistani govt cannot compete constantly against India buying high technology platforms.

 

[Adux]

RCS of SU-30MKI is wrong it is 5 not 10

 

[Muradk]

I never understood that why would some one say that we are competing with Indian military, that will be a foolish statement. it is just like India and china.